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NowItsAngeTime

Opinions on the current visual novel fanbase/community?

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12 minutes ago, Barry Benson said:

I wasn't memeing here and I legitimately don¡t like gay or transexual topic or characters in VN's. I think they are "degenerate" like I mention in the post before. 

Your casual linking of homosexuality to degeneracy is not welcome on the forums. Either you were memeing like Kaguya says, or you were serious and broke rule 6 of the Fuwa guidelines. Kaguya's being nice and giving you the benefit of the doubt, I however don't and think the forums can cut you and not lose a second of sleep over it.

Lucky for you I'm not a mod.

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Sure, I can throw you another one of these, @Barry Benson

1-Isn't this an inclusive community that accepts all opinions? I wasn't memeing here and I legitimately don¡t like gay or transexual topic or characters in VN's. I think they are "degenerate" like I mention in the post before. It's my opinion bro, not trolling. Then again, proves my point of how mods don't know when to discern whether we're trolling or just being serious about these things.

So that's not memeing, huh? As far as I'm concerned, it makes your case worse, tbh. We're not a place open to all opinions. When have we ever been? Fuwanovel is no free speech haven and we don't particularly value it. This works 100% like a private club, and people will and have been removed for being assholes, treating our users like shit, spamming and all sorts of reasons really. You think gay and trans people are morally degenerate? Well, there's definitely no place for that opinion on fuwa. I'll leave it up this time, but you can and will get in trouble for it. In fact, if any other mod wants to give you a third strike for it I have no recourse to stop that even though I kinda like you, because they'd be absolutely right. 

The last time we tried to shitpost in the coliseum of chatter (where shitposting is supposed to happen) everyone involved in it got warnings and temporary bans.

Last time I remember giving warnings and temp bans was when people were in violation of another rule, one about trolling instead. You know what though? Mods can be wrong, and so can I. PM me about the instance and if there's anything inappropriate about a punishment, I can revoke any warning and do an official apology. 

Low-key calling me a moron is rude, bro.

Come on man, I'm the one who should feel insulted by that. Hell, you agree with me on it. You know it's not toxic. It's why you say we should differentiate between friendly banter and toxic comments, because you know it's not toxic. If anything, it only shows that we're not on the level of mutual respect I thought we were, because you think the staff is dumb enough to think that's toxic :rize:

As a last pointer, to respond to your serious question (implying that you're not being serious about the rest of the post?) I stay here because I like it more than reddit and because the friends I've made over the time are here. I don't like the core of fuwa (if you consider the modding policies to be "the core" of this website in the first place) but that doesn't mean that I'll stay here because, in the end, I like it more than other places.

Well, not moderation policies, but what the community is like. You know and mention it too! We're a beginner-friendly "PC" community who doesn't welcome a lot of normal internet culture, which goes against a lot of what you talk about, and created a lot of discord between you and the staff team in general.

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4 minutes ago, Darklord Rooke said:

Your casual linking of homosexuality to degeneracy is not welcome on the forums. Either you were memeing like Kaguya says, or you were serious and broke rule 6 of the Fuwa guidelines. Kaguya's being nice and giving you the benefit of the doubt, I however don't and think the forums can cut you and not lose a second of sleep over it.

Lucky for you I'm not a mod.

I don't say that I don't like gays or transexuals ( some of my family members are), I'm saying that I don't like gay or transexual topics in Visual Novels. Maybe you should read better what I say.

You don't know me, and you should stop judging people over internet posts.

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2 minutes ago, Darklord Rooke said:

Your casual linking of homosexuality to degeneracy is not welcome on the forums. Either you were memeing like Kaguya says, or you were serious and broke rule 6 of the Fuwa guidelines. Kaguya's being nice and giving you the benefit of the doubt, I however don't and think the forums can cut you and not lose a second of sleep over it.

Lucky for you I'm not a mod.

He is not hating trans or gays, he is disliking topics and characters about it. and even if he does. he doesn't advocate any hate towards it.  He really dislikes the genres and that is it. maybe degenerate was not the best word choice though. 

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Just now, Asonn said:

He is not hating trans or gays, he is disliking topics and characters about it. and even if he does. he doesn't advocate any hate towards it.  He really dislikes the genres and that is it. maybe degenerate was not the best word choice though. 

Degenerate is an incredibly unfortunate word choice indeed. 

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2 minutes ago, Kaguya said:

Degenerate is an incredibly unfortunate word choice indeed. 

That and the word "theme" which was then clarified later on to reference to homosexual characters. Classifying homosexuality as a degenerate theme is most definitely an unfortunate choice of words

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35 minutes ago, Barry Benson said:

I don't say that I don't like gays or transexuals ( some of my family members are), I'm saying that I don't like gay or transexual topics in Visual Novels. Maybe you should read better what I say.

You don't know me, and you should stop judging people over internet posts.

I think it's pretty clear what you were trying to say.

Moderation is what separates 4chan from Reddit from Fuwa.

Edited by arosia
To be tactful

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9 minutes ago, Asonn said:

He is not hating trans or gays, he is disliking topics and characters about it. and even if he does. he doesn't advocate any hate towards it.  He really dislikes the genres and that is it. maybe degenerate was not the best word choice though. 

Yeah, it really was, considering how easy it is to interpret that statement as "gay and transgender people are degenerates".  There is literally nothing else in that sentence that refers to only disliking gay/transgender characters in VNs, and it seems to link being gay or transgender with being a degenerate.  It also doesn't list any other qualities these "degenerate" characters have that makes them so reprehensible to him, other than being gay and transgender.  I'd say it's pretty hard to say he doesn't come off sounding like a bigot.

Then there's the choice of the word "degeneracy", which implies that there's something inherently wrong with their lifestyle itself, and echoes the ideology and speech of homophobes that find the mere existance of LGBT people offensive.

So, yeah, that was a pretty unfortunate word choice, if that's what it actually was.

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25 minutes ago, Zenophilious said:

Yeah, it really was, considering how easy it is to interpret that statement as "gay and transgender people are degenerates".  There is literally nothing else in that sentence that refers to only disliking gay/transgender characters in VNs, and it seems to link being gay or transgender with being a degenerate.  It also doesn't list any other qualities these "degenerate" characters have that makes them so reprehensible to him, other than being gay and transgender.  I'd say it's pretty hard to say he doesn't come off sounding like a bigot.

Then there's the choice of the word "degeneracy", which implies that there's something inherently wrong with their lifestyle itself, and echoes the ideology and speech of homophobes that find the mere existance of LGBT people offensive.

So, yeah, that was a pretty unfortunate word choice, if that's what it actually was.

More or less this... by that choice of words, he essentially stated that, whether conscious or subconscious, that was his prejudice not only against the games but against the lifestyle.  If he'd simply said 'I can't get into yuri or yaoi' or something similar, it would have served the same purpose without causing so much trouble.  To be straight about it, I can't get into yaoi... but I don't mind people next door living the lifestyle.  By that choice of words, he essentially indirectly condemned any member of the community who does pursue an LGBT lifestyle. 

Even if he was just referring to the VNs, he went beyond stating a preference by that choice of words... he was indirectly attacking those who do like them.  While I frequently complain about charage/moege, I do manage to enjoy many of them and I don't condemn people for playing them... and I don't condemn people for enjoying LGBT-influenced games. 

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Considering that we got some BL or GL fan, the word 'degenerate' was quite unfortunate to say the least. But in real life it's pretty much a complicated matter, so let's just be more cautious in regard of homosexual thing, shall we?

Back to topic, since this is pretty much quite a sticky topic I can't say much about this. That said, I'd find that Fuwanovel is pretty much fine enough compared to the Reddit. As for Reddit itself, sorry to say this but basically it's pretty much like a wild community because I saw that when one of mods there expressed his depression, only to have the members were told him to commit suicide or spam some harsh word. Other than that, from what I saw the mod themselves were pretty much inactive at Reddit. Also I dislike a member who told that a certain translation is bad and keep campaigning that repeatedly, as if the member himself have something personal with that translation while he didn't do much editing work to help the translation. Okay, I admit that I'd rarely visited Reddit, but from a few time I visited that unfortunately I can't find the positive impression on that. I apologized if some Reddit member here dislike my post, and I knew that there's some decent Reddit members here.

As for JOP thing, I pretty much dislike whenever someone say that the translated VNs that he like didn't deserve a place to sold among the Sakura VNs at Steam. Granted it may be only his opinion, but it can be disturbing for some people who like to get the VN from Steam. Other than that, as long as they didn't spam much I guess they fine maybe, although I definitely didn't like whenever a JOP declared that they won't take the English spoken person seriously though. Oh, and I dislike whenever someone say like 'you didn't deserve to do X' or something like that, because to me the people who write that was looking down the person who already take an effort to do X, only to find out to be told that they didn't deserve to do it (Besides, it sounds quite rude) - which that kind of people who say that is could be found among the elitist.

I'm sorry that my post here was quite a subjective matter, but I'd already want to rant about this for a while here.

Edited by littleshogun

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46 minutes ago, littleshogun said:

 

Back to topic, since this is pretty much quite a sticky topic I can't say much about this. That said, I'd find that Fuwanovel is pretty much fine enough compared to the Reddit. As for Reddit itself, sorry to say this but basically it's pretty much like a wild community because I saw that when one of mods there expressed his depression, only to have the members were told him to commit suicide or spam some harsh word. Other than that, from what I saw the mod themselves were pretty much inactive at Reddit. Also I dislike a member who told that a certain translation is bad and keep campaigning that repeatedly, as if the writer himself have something personal with that while he didn't do much work to help. Okay, I admit that I'd rarely visited Reddit, but from a few time I visited that unfortunately I can't find the positive impression on that. I apologized if some Reddit member here dislike my post, and I knew that there's some decent Reddit members here.

 

The mod thing was a one time thing, there hasn't been anything wild about stuff like that among /r/vns

That said, the place does feel more like a VN news subreddit with a little bit of discussion topics.

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Personally I don't participate on any other Visual Novel based community, I've been to them sure but never stuck around mainly because I found nothing of value in them which I know might not be the case in general but it was for me at the very least. Fuwa is the only one I stuck to and still participate on (mostly because of the good or even great friends I've made during my time here) even though I don't always agree with it's ways or people who run it.

After all you don't have to love one another to initiate in conversations or participate within a community as long as you can keep it civil and respectful, I've been one of those people who have read OELVNS/EVNS and while most of them are quick cash grabs and really poor quality with few to none redeeming qualities, I have found a handful of ones that were worth reading but more often than not people who have already been burned by trash like what "Winged Cloud" produces and spams the Steam store  as well as other stores don't feel like giving others a try because they end up judging the whole market because of them.

@VirginSmasher already said what I think about the Steam community of vns and I share that mindset when it comes to it annnnnd I'm also one of those kind of people who tend to not always be the most respectful when it comes to genres I  dislike despite what I said earlier about being respectful and civil although I do try to be that way for the most part.

Edited by DarkZedge

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Guys, let's stop beating the dead horse and get this back on topic. We don't want to lock serious threads, but if people keep on derailing them, we aren't exactly left with much choice... I for one am growing tired of having to hide every other post made in this thread. So, let's just stop derailing it, shall we?

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12 minutes ago, Okarin said:

Everyone of us needs to pay less attention to what others do. If that brings about the community's demise... then too bad. You can't fight against the overwhelming tide.

Ignoring the problem is the worst way to fix a problem if you want to actually fix one.

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5 hours ago, Dergonu said:

Guys, let's stop beating the dead horse and get this back on topic. We don't want to lock serious threads, but if people keep on derailing them, we aren't exactly left with much choice... I for one am growing tired of having to hide every other post made in this thread. So, let's just stop derailing it, shall we?

K

On 27/02/2018 at 2:14 PM, NowItsAngeTime said:

Anyway, I ranted quite a bit. What are you guys' thoughts on the current community/fanbase?

The fanbase is very young, Fuwanovel, Reddit, and Lemma have all done surveys where the average age of the community is 21ish. Compare this to the average age of a video gamer who's easily in their 30s. There are certain side effects to this dominance of youth, imo.

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On 28/2/2018 at 8:03 PM, NowItsAngeTime said:

Ignoring the problem is the worst way to fix a problem if you want to actually fix one.

I don't want to fix anything...

I just buy the games that I want, and support the companies and projects that I want. I can't speak for the thousands of fans like me, that may pursue other directions.

I'll certainly not help moeges overthrow the market, though I get one of them from time to time. But if that's what the majority wants -what can I really do? They deserve to get what they want, too.

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