Another Day, Another Winged Cloud VN

[Tyr]

1 hour ago, haruki said:

That's actually really interesting. So the reason they're pumping out so many Sakura games right now could be to finance the development of a much more serious game?

Serious game? We are still talking about ... clicker games here, right?

[Infernoplex]

3 minutes ago, Tyrosyn said:

Serious game? We are still talking about ... clicker games here, right?

As much as it looks like that, I still consider even the clicker games better than the regular Sakura boredom xD

[XReaper]

still waiting for a possible sakura-chikan since they apparently hired some (semi?)professional jp writer(s), btw. just in case the story is going to fall flat again, hope is there its ero wont, i mean you would´ve have to be a literary retard to completely fuck up writing believable scenes of a little groping & not-so-consentual intercourse... *sarcasm off

[Infernoplex]

6 minutes ago, XReaper said:

still waiting for a possible sakura-chikan since they apparently hired some (semi?)professional jp writer(s), btw. just in case the story is going to fall flat again, hope is there its ero wont, i mean you would´ve have to be a literary retard to fuck up writing believable scenes of a little groping & raping.

Ahahahaha, wait, wait, wait ... They have hired a japanese writer? Man, I am really learning a lot of new things these days:

Edit: In that case, when the development of the "Sakura XXXXXXX" title is finished, is it considered an OELVN or a japanese VN? Ahahaha

Edited September 25, 2016 by Infernoplex

[Funyarinpa]

According to VNDB, that's the TWELFTH Sakura game. Whahahahahat the fuck

[Infernoplex]

55 minutes ago, Funyarinpa said:

According to VNDB, that's the TWELFTH Sakura game. Whahahahahat the fuck

Hold your breath, there's more to come Sakura Nova is from what I am gathering here apparently voiced and was written by a Japanese writer:

On a side-note, for all you unbelievers out there, Sakura VNs are pure hard-work so don't you dare call it boring and monotone!

P.S. Apparently I had a wrong definition of "hardworking" all these years

[XReaper]

seems i fail to get how having japanese writers automatically means the title(s) will be of good, or satisfactionary quality, seriously i just dont get it. them stemming from a specific nationality does in the end mean shit, because it solely depends on one having talent/skills or lacking these, regardless where he/she hails from; plus we all know there´s also a more than large amount of truly bad writers roaming the lands of nihon, so yeah that´s that. no idea why or when this screwed up perception came up of anything japan being superior by default, be it voice acting, writing, settings or whatsnot. sure, if included does make it apparently more easy to appeal/being marketed, but works such as valhalla, most stuff by mouse or others whom are still bend on using their own brains and ideas, despite common believes, keep proving them delusionists wrong.

edit: it´s undoubtably a right step in the more right direction when starting to hire writers who actually are ones, not just some clueless weaboos trying to come up with something, without knowing anything.

edit2: and always those same hollow and borderline dishonest excuses, like "we didn´t want to make the setting japanese at the beginning, but it does fit the story better", "the op is a japanese one, because it does fit the story better", "they have japanese names, because it gives off a more authentic vibe". holy hell please stop. just admit the sole fucking reason is for the product to appeal to a more broad audience aka putting a possible increase of sales before originality/quality. seriously those are just abunch of self-apologetic excuses to somehow justify emulating the popular, instead of try gambling abit and coming up with real works of their own. no matter what, oelvns will always stay oelvns and never ever turn into their japanese pendants, forwhy it´s the very nature of oelvns, because they are created by non-japanese studios in the first place, defining them as such. on another note what´s even the point in making oelvns when its devs start going for japanese artists (writers/voice acting/visual-artists)?

[iamnoob]

45 minutes ago, XReaper said:

seems i fail to get how having japanese writers automatically means the title(s) will be of good, or satisfactionary quality, seriously i just dont get it. them stemming from a specific nationality does in the end mean shit, because it solely depends on one having talent/skills or lacking these, regardless where he/she hails from; plus we all know there´s also a more than large amount of truly bad writers roaming the lands of nihon, so yeah that´s that. no idea why or when this screwed up perception came up of anything japan being superior by default, be it voice acting, writing, settings or whatsnot. sure, if included does make it apparently more easy to appeal/being marketed, but works such as valhalla, most stuff by mouse or others whom are still bend on using their own brains and ideas, despite common believes, keep proving them delusionists wrong.

edit: it´s undoubtably a right step in the more right direction when starting to hire writers who actually are ones, not just some clueless weaboos trying to come up with something, without knowing anything.

 

Simple statistics. Japanese have been writing VNs for a long time. Thus, a Japanese writer has a higher probability of producing a proper story than what we have seen so far.

Similar to the voice acting in the early 2000s. English Voice dubbers over anime were horrible while Japanese ones were much better. Why? Because they have much more experience.

We are not saying Japanese writer = Better writing. We won't know until we can read what he has written. All we are doing is hoping that due to the higher probability, a good story will be produced.

Here's an example: Lets say we have some indigenous sport in some faraway land. Are you going to bet on the locals to win or some group of random foreigner. Like you said Race/Nationality whatever doesn't matter. BUT we can infer the potential experience and skill from this information.

Another example is this: Malays have biologically better eyesight than Chinese. If I wanted to pick 10 people have have the best average eyesight I would pick 10 Malays rather than 10 chinese. Of course like you said. The BEST WAY is to of course just measure the eyesight of people and pick 10 with perfect eyesight. But if we are not able to do that, statistically we have a better chance with 10 Malays.

Back to topic, Japanese VN writers have a lot of experience in writing better VN stories than sakura writers. Thus, we have a higher probability. All we are doing is hoping this probability holds true. NOT immediately associating this new writer to automatically be a good one.

 

 

[Infernoplex]

I will be honest - I definitively see the reasoning in both arguments. But I have to say that I think that I subconsciously also prefer more to read something by a Japanese writer rather than the western one and I think that the whole reason behind that is that I actually had better experiences while reading something from Japanese writers. So I already have a form of a bias right there which prevents me sometimes from even looking at something that is developed by a western developer. That's also why I prefer more japanese voices, japanese art, japanese setting ... It's just that I didn't yet play an OELVN that managed to intrigue me like some of the japanese VNs I have read.

Surely, there are good OELVNs out there like Katawa Shoujo (I see it mentioned often, I didn't read it yet) and with a name like that I can already see for what audience it was aimed at. It's just like @XReaper said, I can definitively understand the reasons behind that. These developers have to market their VNs towards that kind of audience that is already familiar only with Japanese VNs. Yes, that kind of kills the originality but looking at it from this perspective, you must somehow get people to see you. I mean how do you get noticed in such a niche market at all unless you start developing something that will appeal to a wide enough audience?

I can also undestand the statistics that @iamnoob mentioned ... It's definitively true, the Japanese were much longer into developing VNs therefore they have more chance of producing better quality VNs compared to the western ones. I think the OELVN developers are still in their infancy period and they need much more time to get to that level in which they will become able to compete with the Japanese. 

[XReaper]

1 hour ago, Infernoplex said:

I will be honest ..SNIP....become able to compete with the Japanese. 

like i did already say above, what´s the fucking point in creating oelvns in the first place, if all you do is get japanese staff-members to replace those of other nationalities, which causes the product to end up being a oelvn only in name. that´s freaking ridiculous.
 

edit: and regarding the "japanese being more experienced", why is that so? mostly because the majority of theirs starts out making doujinshi first, both free and cheap ones, to gather the much needed experience before bothering to go after sth bigger. this is something the west apparently also lacks, while there are some, alot on the other hand just go pro from zero, always justifying it with high costs and blah the fucking blah. just cut corners, no newbie to the medium needs to have his/her debut works to consist of hd-visuals, voice acting or whatever there is that keeps the non-existent budget skyrocking.
sorry for me loosing my composure, but stuff like this is not only infuriating, but also depressing

[solidbatman]

VNs are typically shit because of JP writers 

[Infernoplex]

10 minutes ago, XReaper said:

like i did already say above, what´s the fucking point in creating oelvns in the first place, if all you do is get japanese staff-members to replace those of other nationalities, which causes the product to end up being a oelvn only in name. that´s freaking ridiculous.

I agree on that, I still think Winged Cloud has made kind of a strange decision with that one. It's like they aren't able to find a decent western writer to write a scenario for their VNs. Where are the all western good writers hiding, me thinks Not everything japanese written is neccesarily good so I do believe that western writers should get a chance.

15 minutes ago, XReaper said:

edit: and regarding the "japanese being more experienced", why is that so? mostly because the majority of theirs starts out making doujins first, both free and cheap ones, to gather the much needed experience before bothering to go after sth bigger. this is something the west apparently also lacks, while there are some, alot on the other hand just go pro from zero, always justifying it with high costs and blah the fucking blah. just cut corners, no newbie to the medium needs to have his/her debut works to consist of hd-visuals or voice acting.

True, if I am not mistaken, that's how even the famous Type-Moon started, as a doujin group?

[Narcosis]

It's a self-centered community that produces and consumes everything it creates. Just like with inbreeding, quality ultimately detoriates with time, unless you'll take in new blood (i.e. "have babies" with completely new and fresh concepts or think outside the box); either that, or you will allow actual writers to write and adapt their stories, instead of letting weebs go willy-nilly.

[Darklord Rooke]

3 hours ago, Infernoplex said:

Where are the all western good writers hiding, me thinks

Staying the hell away from Winged Cloud, I suspect. Some writers who worked with them have had some pretty poor experiences.

[Infernoplex]

52 minutes ago, Rooke said:

Staying the hell away from Winged Cloud, I suspect. Some writers who worked with them have had some pretty poor experiences.

I can believe in that, Winged Cloud is apparently hard to work with ... MangaGamer knows xD

[atorq]

What no one here seems to mention is the atrocity that they committed when releasing this "free" VN. Not only is it the typical piece of shit that the Sakura games we all know and love always have been, half of it is hidden away behind a paywall.

[Infernoplex]

58 minutes ago, atorq said:

What no one here seems to mention is the atrocity that they committed when releasing this "free" VN. Not only is it the typical piece of shit that the Sakura games we all know and love always have been, half of it is hidden away behind a paywall.

Somebody already pointed that out in another thread which I think was called something like "You thought EVN's couldn't get any better" ... But I think nobody even cares anymore about that stuff, that's why nobody mentions it anymore.

[Decay]

On 9/25/2016 at 1:10 PM, Infernoplex said:

 Where are the all western good writers hiding, me thinks

http://loveconquersallgam.es/ http://sukeban.moe/ https://twitter.com/alienworksdev?lang=en 

 

Anyway, someone who has already played some of Sakura Nova has informed me that it is total shit, despite the JP writer. So look forward to that.

[TexasDice]

On 9/22/2016 at 9:53 PM, DarkZedge said:

See this? :

This is the kind of people they're after.  

Forgetting about the Sakura Games, this guy needs to tell me how to do that.

[DarkZedge]

Just now, TexasDice said:

Forgetting about the Sakura Games, this guy needs to tell me how to do that.

Do what exactly?  

[Nier]

15 minutes ago, Decay said:

http://loveconquersallgam.es/ http://sukeban.moe/ https://twitter.com/alienworksdev?lang=en 

 

Anyway, someone who has already played some of Sakura Nova has informed me that it is total shit, despite the JP writer. So look forward to that.

Do we even know who this "Japanese Writer" is? Seems weird (fishy) that they would go all out to get a japanese writer, yet leave his/her name out.

[Darklord Rooke]

2 minutes ago, Nier said:

Do we even know who this "Japanese Writer" is? Seems weird (fishy) that they would go all out to get a japanese writer, yet leave his/her name out.

[Dons cynical hat]Random aspiring doujin author plucked from school and paid peanuts ... probably.

Japanese developers will pay more than whatever Winged Cloud can afford to dish out, and provide more stable and consistent employment. Therefore, whoever's been plucked from the populace is someone who isn't good enough to work for them. I wouldn't expect some great new level of writing, here.[/Removes cynical hat]

[andzalot55]

Whats funny is that people play Sakura games for "plot..."

[Zenophilious]

7 hours ago, Decay said:

Anyway, someone who has already played some of Sakura Nova has informed me that it is total shit, despite the JP writer. So look forward to that.

I don't know why people thought it would be any different.  There are plenty of shitty writers in every country; simply being born in the country VNs came from does, in no way, mean that you aren't a shitty writer.  It's almost like everyone forgot the legions of shitty Japanese VNs that get made and then forgotten about in under a year.

[Nier]

7 hours ago, andzalot55 said:

Whats funny is that people play Sakura games for "plot..."

Hey, don't make fun of people that love to have 200% more plot in their games.