Another Day, Another Winged Cloud VN

[wyldstrykr]

4 minutes ago, Nier said:

Hey, don't make fun of people that love to have 200% more plot in their games.

you mispelled boobs

[Nier]

6 hours ago, Zenophilious said:

I don't know why people thought it would be any different.  There are plenty of shitty writers in every country; simply being born in the country VNs came from does, in no way, mean that you aren't a shitty writer.  It's almost like everyone forgot the legions of shitty Japanese VNs that get made and then forgotten about in under a year.

ＪＡＰＡＮ:

- Superior Mental Capabilities.

- Superior Aesthetical Senses.

- Superior Emotional Intelligence.

- Superior Storytelling Skills.

- Superior Musical Talent.

- Superior Culture.

FACTS.

[yorikbad]

3 hours ago, wyldstrykr said:

you mispelled boobs

I can't believe I'm saying this, but not all boobs are equally attractive. Sakura's girls are like KyoAni characters, same old shit with diffrent hair.  

[haruki]

8 hours ago, yorikbad said:

I can't believe I'm saying this, but not all boobs are equally attractive. Sakura's girls are like KyoAni characters, same old shit with diffrent hair.  

preach

 

the most confusing part for me is why people are playing Sakura games for the boobs when most of them don't even have h-scenes...

[wyldstrykr]

9 hours ago, yorikbad said:

I can't believe I'm saying this, but not all boobs are equally attractive. Sakura's girls are like KyoAni characters, same old shit with diffrent hair.  

but when you see the girls, the first thing you notice is that the boobs!!!  

[Infernoplex]

On 26.9.2016. at 10:57 PM, Decay said:

http://loveconquersallgam.es/ http://sukeban.moe/ https://twitter.com/alienworksdev?lang=en 

 

Anyway, someone who has already played some of Sakura Nova has informed me that it is total shit, despite the JP writer. So look forward to that.

Love Conquers All Games (or should I say just Christine Sarah Love) is actually good from what I have heard about her VNs ... VA-11 HALL-A by Sukeban Games is also very good from what I have heard about it but looking now on their VNDB page I see that they are actually Spanish? The third one Alienworks is relatively unknown to me, and their only released title so far Highway Blossoms seems to be okay-ish I guess (I didn't read it so I don't know much about it or any of the other titles mentioned).

But all of these VNs witten by English writers aren't exactly what I had in my mind when I asked the question earlier. I was actually thinking more like "Where are all the very good English writers?". I mean, will we ever see a kamige developed by an English writer. For example, titles like Fate/Stay Night and Dies Irae, will we ever see an English writer for those God-tier type of VNs? None of the developers you mentioned seem to be on that level. Don't take me in the wrong way, I actually believe that they are very good writers indeed but I can't really compare them with people in Japan who wrote something much bigger and whose titles often get portrayed as classics of the VN medium.

As for Sakura Nova, that was to be expected, I never have hopes nor I look forward to Sakura titles xD

On 26.9.2016. at 11:09 PM, TexasDice said:

Forgetting about the Sakura Games, this guy needs to tell me how to do that.

 

On 26.9.2016. at 11:10 PM, DarkZedge said:

Do what exactly?  

I actually got confused too, but reading the post in the screenshot again reveals something funny xD That positive review on Steam literally says in one point "I am so happy forgeting this game." XDDD Yeah, the poster of that review is probably a 10-year old xD ...

[yorikbad]

41 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

Christine Sarah Love) is actually good

Christine Love's games like "Analogue: A Hate Story" and "Digital: A Love Story" are literally the only OELVNS worth to buy, read and remember.

41 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

will we ever see a kamige developed by an English writer.

For kamige we need a kami writer, composer and artist. We have all of them in movies, music industry and galleries but they don't care about VNs.

41 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

I actually believe that they are very good writers indeed

I am a writer myself, I even have a book but I will never write for visual novel. It's just another type of literature. In Japan as I heard, they actually study how to write scripts for this type of games.

[Decay]

53 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

But all of these VNs witten by English writers aren't exactly what I had in my mind when I asked the question earlier. I was actually thinking more like "Where are all the very good English writers?". I mean, will we ever see a kamige developed by an English writer. For example, titles like Fate/Stay Night and Dies Irae, will we ever see an English writer for those God-tier type of VNs? None of the developers you mentioned seem to be on that level. Don't take me in the wrong way, I actually believe that they are very good writers indeed but I can't really compare them with people in Japan who wrote something much bigger and whose titles often get portrayed as classics of the VN medium.

Nasu isn't exactly a brilliant genius himself. Neither is Masada. They are talented individuals for sure, but they're backed by teams that are able to flesh out their visions. EVN developers can't afford to construct 50+ hour epics with loads of art like F/SN. They don't have the budget Light has. Not to mention, the difference in the size of the two regional industries makes it so there's just less talent overall in the western scene, and therefore it's harder to find true talent within it. Regardless, the difference between the best EVN writers and the best JVN writers are likely just the people and money behind them.

[DarkZedge]

1 hour ago, Infernoplex said:

I actually got confused too, but reading the post in the screenshot again reveals something funny xD That positive review on Steam literally says in one point "I am so happy forgeting this game." XDDD Yeah, the poster of that review is probably a 10-year old xD ...

Makes sense since Sakura games are likely written by people of that age bracket so they'd target people of that same age

[Infernoplex]

33 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

Christine Love's games like "Analogue: A Hate Story" and "Digital: A Love Story" are literally the only OELVNS worth to buy, read and remember.

Yes, those two titles are what I see mentioned often, I might buy them when I am finished with some other VNs.

35 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

For kamige we need a kami writer, composer and artist. We have all of them in movies, music industry and galleries but they don't care about VNs.

Exactly, it all comes down to "it isn't profitable" ... While a good Holywood movie could net millions or billions of $ in total revenue, you can't say the same for visual novels. It's considered to be an un-profitable industry and so we don't see those kami developers coming on board just yet (maybe, one day, the situation will be different , I am trying to be optimistic) ...

43 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

I am a writer myself, I even have a book but I will never write for visual novel. It's just another type of literature. In Japan as I heard, they actually study how to write scripts for this type of games.

!?? What??? They have some kind of courses for the script writers?? O___O Wow ... That's just a confirmation for me on how much seriously the VN market is considered there.

30 minutes ago, Decay said:

Nasu isn't exactly a brilliant genius himself. Neither is Masada. They are talented individuals for sure, but they're backed by teams that are able to flesh out their visions. EVN developers can't afford to construct 50+ hour epics with loads of art like F/SN. They don't have the budget Light has. Not to mention, the difference in the size of the two regional industries makes it so there's just less talent overall in the western scene, and therefore it's harder to find true talent within it. Regardless, the difference between the best EVN writers and the best JVN writers are likely just the people and money behind them.

That last sentence sums it up pretty nicely.

[yorikbad]

16 hours ago, Infernoplex said:

They have some kind of courses

Yes, exactly. It's part of the great entertaiment industry after all. Anime, manga, ranobe, visual novels are all connected. Did you watch Shirobako? It's not about games but you can actually see, how passionate they are about this stuff.

In the West creating vn's is still considered as a hobby. You're right, it's an niche un-profitable industry. But that's what makes it good. Do you believe we could have f.e. NTR, lolies in mainstream games or movies?

We don't need media attention. I remember those SJW campains against Mass Effect sex scenes. We don't need famous writers, just competent enough to make a good story. Like Rin's route in KS. It's one of the best in OELVNS and it feels wonderfull even for western standards.

[Narcosis]

On 2016/9/27 at 2:05 PM, Nier said:

ＪＡＰＡＮ:

- Superior Mental Capabilities.

- Superior Aesthetical Senses.

- Superior Emotional Intelligence.

- Superior Storytelling Skills.

- Superior Musical Talent.

- Superior Culture.

FACTS.

And all of that stems from hundreds of years of unthreatened isolationism, they preffered to keep for centuries. Plenty of European countries used to be far superior when it comes to intelectual and social evolution around 19th and beginning of 20th century, but both World Wars along with German and Russian occupation destroyed it all; decades, when nations which are currently at the top of worldwide food chain kept on stealing both national goods and fruits of labor and scientific reasearch from these countries, enslaving it's people and making them common force workers "for a greater goal". It's all cool when you're isolated and free from any threats and thus, able to focus on more elaborate social and ethnic values, instead of plain survival, because all you ever were was being surround by other countries that kept on constantly biting you at every single opportunity.

"Superior", pfft.

[Infernoplex]

3 hours ago, yorikbad said:

Did you watch Shirobako?

No, I didn't. I didn't watch a single anime since 2015 I think (except Tokyo Ghoul that I watched relatively recently). I am more into visual novels these days, anime got me worned out and I can't make myself pickup a single title to watch these days. Anyway, I have a backlog of anime titles that I still didn't watch and I am "planning" to watch it someday. I will add that Shirobako to the list too (from what I have gathered, it's an anime about ... anime industry? xD) ...

3 hours ago, yorikbad said:

Do you believe we could have f.e. NTR, lolies in mainstream games or movies?

Definitively not, I don't see it happening anytime soon. I understood your point.

[Darklord Rooke]

21 hours ago, Decay said:

Nasu isn't exactly a brilliant genius himself. Neither is Masada. They are talented individuals for sure, but they're backed by teams that are able to flesh out their visions. EVN developers can't afford to construct 50+ hour epics with loads of art like F/SN. They don't have the budget Light has. Not to mention, the difference in the size of the two regional industries makes it so there's just less talent overall in the western scene, and therefore it's harder to find true talent within it. Regardless, the difference between the best EVN writers and the best JVN writers are likely just the people and money behind them.

I have yet to come across a translated visual novel I'd regard as a 'kamige', even with the budgets Japanese studios have behind them. The games don't translate well because Western and Japanese value different things in their stories, and there's always problems with storytelling or whatnot. Even disregarding F/SN obviously questionable translation, you have storytelling issues like massive bloat which detracts from the plot and causes pacing issues. The most talked about cases being the horribly inserted sex scenes.

In fact I wish people would drop the term, it just creates unrealistic expectations in the community that can never be met.

[Darklord Rooke]

But I understand the urge to go around claiming the things you enjoy are the "best ever". Everybody does it. Japanese translators have the advantage that they can easily claim that Western audiences aren't getting the "full experience" because they can't read it in the original language. But even if I could read these VNs in the original Japanese language, I bet I'd still be disappointed with what people call a "kamige". Mainly because people are individuals and look for different things in their fiction, and my taste doesn't seem to match most of the VN fanbase's.

Ever 17, for example. Claimed as a masterpiece by much of the Western fanbase but I consider it to be a horribly paced, POS. And vice versa - I'm sure stuff I really enjoy would bore the pants of others.

So yeah, every time I see the word "kamige" I think "here we go"  

[yorikbad]

13 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

(from what I have gathered, it's an anime about ... anime industry? xD) ...

Yes, it explains how the things work in anime studio, from a simple idea to post-production. Don't mind moe characters, it's actually very grown up tv-show that describes a number of serious real-life problems. I think, many people would stop complain about anime after watching it.

19 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

I am more into visual novels these days

It will pass).

For that I humbly recomend "Shoujo-tachi wa Kouya wo Mezasu". The anime about students making their first doujin visual novel. It's a very mediocre show but it brings to light some interesting points about VN's.

[Infernoplex]

6 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

Yes, it explains how the things work in anime studio, from a simple idea to post-production. Don't mind moe characters, it's actually very grown up tv-show that describes a number of serious real-life problems. I think, many people would stop complain about anime after watching it.

Oh, okay, thanks for the recommendation, it actually has good reviews so I will definitively check it out

7 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

For that I humbly recomend "Shoujo-tachi wa Kouya wo Mezasu". The anime about students making their first doujin visual novel. It's a very mediocre show but it brings to light some interesting points about VN's.

I see it has both an anime and an all-ages VN with that name ... I bookmarked the show Thank you for all the recommendations

[yorikbad]

10 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

all-ages VN

My God, I didn't know that exists! So, thank you

Why nobody cares to bring this game to Steam? Instead we get Wing Cloud's neverending lineup. And it sales on par with Stein's Gate.

[XReaper]

21 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

My God, I didn't know that exists! So, thank you

Why nobody cares to bring this game to Steam? Instead we get Wing Cloud's neverending lineup. And it sales on par with Stein's Gate.

because it´s a cashgrab mediocre one. it disgusts me that a well-known and -regarded author gave himself away to evil. had quite some high expectations for that one in particular, but-------------

[Infernoplex]

34 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

My God, I didn't know that exists! So, thank you

Why nobody cares to bring this game to Steam? Instead we get Wing Cloud's neverending lineup. And it sales on par with Stein's Gate.

Glad to be of help Speaking of Steins;Gate, if I ever get to read it, should I go for the recently released Steam's Edition or the JAST one? Are there any major differences between them?

9 minutes ago, XReaper said:

because it´s a cashgrab mediocre one. it disgusts me that a well-known and -regarded author gave himself away to evil. had quite some high expectations for that one in particular, but-------------

For a second I thought you were speaking about Sakura titles but then wondered why "well-known and -regarded author" was put there ... And then I checked the VN I linked ... Maaaaaaan O__O This is by the developers of Majikoi  ... You were speaking about their writer?

[XReaper]

8 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

Glad to be of help Speaking of Steins;Gate, if I ever get to read it, should I go for the recently released Steam's Edition or the JAST one? Are there any major differences between them?

For a second I thought you were speaking about Sakura titles but then wondered why "well-known and -regarded author" was put there ... And then I checked the VN I linked ... Maaaaaaan O__O This is by the developers of Majikoi  ... You were speaking about their writer?

yes i do indeed mean romeo, a former man of great, now corrupted by the likes of takahiro and having his name/fame abused as a means of drawing naive fellows in. truly an evil scheme. would´ve probably ended up laughing if it werent for its ridiculous shortness, yet somehow inappropriate pricing. honestly stick with the anime.

[Infernoplex]

18 minutes ago, XReaper said:

yes i do indeed mean romeo, a former man of great, now corrupted by the likes of takahiro and having his name/fame abused as a means of drawing naive fellows in. truly an evil scheme. would´ve probably ended up laughing if it werent for its rediculous shortness, yet somehow inappropriate pricing. honestly stick with the anime.

Well, I could have kind of expected that, not all VNs are good as their anime-counterpart and vice-versa I do intend to stick with the anime (my Japanese sucks so I wouldn't even be able to read that VN anyway xD) ... But you piqued my interest right now, the writer you mentioned, Tanaka Romeo, has worked on some very famous titles like Cross Channel, parts of Rewrite and so on ... While Takahiro is the writer behind Majikoi ... How did the combination of these two seemingly good writers managed to create a bad VN By the way, it looks like Romeo is also associated with 07th Expansion since he worked on this title too.

[yorikbad]

37 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

Speaking of Steins;Gate, if I ever get to read it, should I go for the recently released Steam's Edition or the JAST one? Are there any major differences between them?

Sorry, don't know much about, exept that Steam version apparently has some font problems.

55 minutes ago, XReaper said:

a well-known and -regarded author gave himself away to evil

Is it https://vndb.org/v14303 that bad? Anime, though mediocre, has its own charm .

24 minutes ago, Infernoplex said:

How did the combination of these two seemingly good writers managed to create a bad VN

From my experience it happens a lot. Even the most brilliant author can not always create masterpiece but still manage to make a decent product. Take Steven King for example. 

[Infernoplex]

3 minutes ago, yorikbad said:

From my experience it happens a lot. Even the most brilliant author can not always create masterpiece but still manage to make a decent product. Take Steven King for example. 

I see what you mean Yeah, it's a shame though that it happens but even the best writers don't always make decent products.

[Ariurotl]

Sakura Space is out (I genuinely thought that and Sakura Nova were one and the same somehow), and this is what Steam thinks you should also play:

Do I even need to say anything more?