Another topic regarding NTR.

[mitchhamilton]

so, this topic comes from a debate on ntr i had with a friend of mine. i will use two vns as an example on what i believe are not ntr since both of these came into the convo.

 

https://vndb.org/v13249

https://vndb.org/v10078

 

i dont believe these are ntr because both parties consent to whats happening. sure the mc at first in "Please Bang My Wife" has his wife being taken by another guy, but after confronting her about it hes open to the ideal of watching them. the mc in the first one has consent from his gf after she finds a porn video about a married woman having an affair.

 

ntr is more about the guy youre supposed to root for watching helplessly in someway while having his lover being sexed by one or more guys. thats what i think anyways. idk, what do you guys think?

[Kaguya]

Is it supposed to make a difference? 

[mitchhamilton]

38 minutes ago, Kaguya said:

Is it supposed to make a difference? 

thats kind of what i am asking.

 

something i forgot to mention is, just like him, i loathe ntr! and if those vns are ntr, they are the exceptions.

[Zenophilious]

But...netorare literally means "cuckold".  It still sounds like NTR to me, it's just leaving the traditional mold of most NTR games.  It fits the description on VNDB, which is, "a sexual fetish designed to cause sexual jealousy by way of having the heroine indulge in sexual activity with someone other as [sic] the protagonist".  The story still sounds like it would cause jealousy if the reader self-inserts as the husband, as the wife cannot orgasm when she has sex with her own husband, and the other man is better in bed than him, which would be extremely emasculating.  It just sounds like the husband enjoys being cuckolded and seems to derive sexual pleasure from it, which isn't that different from the typical reader of NTR, correct?
 

51 minutes ago, mitchhamilton said:

https://vndb.org/v13249

Wow, an NTR VN that I might actually like.  Thanks for bringing it to my attention 

[mitchhamilton]

8 minutes ago, Zenophilious said:

But...netorare literally means "cuckold".  It still sounds like NTR to me, it's just leaving the traditional mold of most NTR games.  It fits the description on VNDB, which is, "a sexual fetish designed to cause sexual jealousy by way of having the heroine indulge in sexual activity with someone other as [sic] the protagonist".  The story still sounds like it would cause jealousy if the reader self-inserts as the husband, as the wife cannot orgasm when she has sex with her own husband, and the other man is better in bed than him, which would be extremely emasculating.  It just sounds like the husband enjoys being cuckolded and seems to derive sexual pleasure from it, which isn't that different from the typical reader of NTR, correct?
 

Wow, an NTR VN that I might actually like.  Thanks for bringing it to my attention 

hmmmmm, i guess it makes sense. idk, the consent really makes the difference for me though.

 

also, i hope you enjoy it. the cover kind of sold it for me.

[RedK]

NTR could go both ways xD, the thing is that the cuck watches his woman getting banged which is hot as fug.

[Soulless Watcher]

Mitchhamilton for someone who claims to hate ntr, I find it odd how you obsess over it. I can't even muster the enthusiasm to make a thread about something I passionately enjoy, let alone hate (cough) snuff/vore/bodyalterations/coprophagia (cough). Reminds me of my early highschool days in which I talked shit about the sims constantly, but secretly played for hours guiding my character to knock up everyone in the neighborhood..... huh I guess the me of yesteryear was really into netori. 

Well, psychiatric evaluations of myself aside I think only the second one would be considered ntr. Ntr is (apparently) all about getting a high off the feelings of jealously and dark emotional shit you get when you see another man knocking up your wifu, in the first title the roles are reversed, so I suppose the first title would be whatever reversed ntr is called. 

I think the issue of consent is simply a modifier and not enough to separate it from the ntr category.

 

[Zenophilious]

Just now, mitchhamilton said:

hmmmmm, i guess it makes sense. idk, the consent really makes the difference for me though.

 

also, i hope you enjoy it. the cover kind of sold it for me.

I guess MangaGamer wanted to go with NTR-lite so they could possibly introduce NTR to their general audience without immediately turning them off, like a standard NTR VN would probably do.  Having consent is probably why they picked it, if that's indeed what they were going for.

Right?  That cover is great.  It's gonna be a while before I read it, though, as my Japanese is shit and getting rusty without practice.  I gotta sign up for another class 

[mitchhamilton]

9 minutes ago, Soulless Watcher said:

Mitchhamilton for someone who claims to hate ntr, I find it odd how you obsess over it. I can't even muster the enthusiasm to make a thread about something I passionately enjoy, let alone hate (cough) snuff/vore/bodyalterations/coprophagia (cough). Reminds me of my early highschool days in which I talked shit about the sims constantly, but secretly played for hours guiding my character to knock up everyone in the neighborhood..... huh I guess the me of yesteryear was really into netori. 

Well, psychiatric evaluations of myself aside I think only the second one would be considered ntr. Ntr is (apparently) all about getting a high off the feelings of jealously and dark emotional shit you get when you see another man knocking up your wifu, in the first title the roles are reversed, so I suppose the first title would be whatever reversed ntr is called. 

I think the issue of consent is simply a modifier and not enough to separate it from the ntr category.

 

i think its because i hate it so much is why im curious as to why other people like it. i just dont understand its appeal or why people like it. nothing wrong with liking it, i just cant. but im still curious why people like it nonetheless. also, ive never read or watched anything ntr related. ive had some suggestions but always went NOPE X10!!!!

 

9 minutes ago, Zenophilious said:

I guess MangaGamer wanted to go with NTR-lite so they could possibly introduce NTR to their general audience without immediately turning them off, like a standard NTR VN would probably do.  Having consent is probably why they picked it, if that's indeed what they were going for.

Right?  That cover is great.  It's gonna be a while before I read it, though, as my Japanese is shit and getting rusty without practice.  I gotta sign up for another class 

that might not be far off from the truth. what better way to introduce a highly disliked genre than its little more likeable counterpart?

 

omg, i love that cover. the girl in the back is nice but i just love images of women in total ecstasy, like the one on the bed. best of luck to you on your classes! i hope youll be able to read this, as well as many other great vns.

[Lucius]

1 minute ago, mitchhamilton said:

i think its because i hate it so much is why im curious as to why other people like it. i just dont understand its appeal or why people like it. nothing wrong with liking it, i just cant. but im still curious why people like it nonetheless. also, ive never read or watched anything ntr related. ive had some suggestions but always went NOPE X10!!!!

I read a couple of'em during my hentai-searches every now and then (c'mon, I'm a guy; what do you expect). It's not my favorite genre in terms of the more 'crude' hentai, particularly due to it being more suited more for masochists than 's-guys' like myself...  But yeah, the point is, I could understand the appeal somewhat, fantasizing about the loss of control. It's actually not a very strange fantasy, considering the similar fantasies women have about losing control to someone stronger, etc.

Anyway, NTR definitely isn't my favorite kind of hentai at all. Why would I watch someone steal the fun of sexing my waifu anyway? I wanna join in! 

[mitchhamilton]

6 minutes ago, Lucius said:

I read a couple of'em during my hentai-searches every now and then (c'mon, I'm a guy; what do you expect). It's not my favorite genre in terms of the more 'crude' hentai, particularly due to it being more suited more for masochists than 's-guys' like myself...  But yeah, the point is, I could understand the appeal somewhat, fantasizing about the loss of control. It's actually not a very strange fantasy, considering the similar fantasies women have about losing control to someone stronger, etc.

huh, i never saw it that way. that makes sense. some ntr can get pretty... heavy though. like this one i read where a guy gets his girl ntred and its implied he hangs himself while watching a video of her happily giving birth to the other guys child. O_O

 

thats the kind of level i could never get.

 

6 minutes ago, Lucius said:

Anyway, NTR definitely isn't my favorite kind of hentai at all. Why would I watch someone steal the fun of sexing my waifu anyway? I wanna join in! 

i think we all could get behind that.

[DarkZedge]

I'm not fond of NTR and as for your question they do seem to be NTR vns but what could I possibly know since I don't really like ntr to begin with.

[VirginSmasher]

Even if the VNs differ from the usual NTR romps, cuck games will always be cuck games.

[sanahtlig]

6 hours ago, mitchhamilton said:

huh, i never saw it that way. that makes sense. some ntr can get pretty... heavy though. like this one i read where a guy gets his girl ntred and its implied he hangs himself while watching a video of her happily giving birth to the other guys child. O_O

thats the kind of level i could never get.

I like the NTR in School Days.  It doesn't dominate the story.  It's just one of several possible (bad) outcomes that helps build dramatic tension.

[MoeKyun]

Believe it or not, I used to hate NTR-tags. But now it's one of my fave genre, whether it's vn/doujin/hentai. Oh, and in my opinion NTR type B>A>C  (according to vndb, tho).

I don't know, maybe I'm already had enough of those vanilla genre and want something new.

[Vorathiel]

7 hours ago, mitchhamilton said:

im curious as to why other people like it. i just dont understand its appeal or why people like it.

This is like the most fundamental question in the universe.
Why people like what they like? Why you like tentacles, and guy next to you like to be netorared? Why identical twins, rised together might drastically differ in what food they like? Why people who loves the same 9 VNs/movies suddenly differ in love/hate on 10th title?What makes us 'like' things?

And there is no answer.
I don't get why people love tsundere, for me it's same shit as NTR, no difference. Hate them both. I don't get it...but there is nothing I can do about it. I will never be able to understant it. Whatever floats their boat.


------------------------------------------------

Of course, there are some factors influencing our liking things. We, as a species, like things we can recognize. Take music for example. Recognizable beats, themes, melodies makes us 'like' some songs immediately. Whole pop market is basing on that.
But, it works complete oppositely for porn. People tends to look for more and more, 'normal' porn gets boring fast. There are even scientific papers on how regular porn watching changing ones sex preferences to degree so high, that straight guys start to fap to gay BDSM.
We all know who reads VNs - I would bet my money that over the half of VN audience is a mom-basement dweller, neckbeard virgins. They never even touched a girl. So. Never touched a girl -> watching more porn -> needs more crazy and 'heavier' stimuli -> turns attention into NTR porn.

But that is just my theory. I'm not saying that whole NTR fans community is made of 30+ old fat man virgins.

[Ningen]

Yeah, it's pretty soft NTR if the man makes his woman do it or approves it.

Real NTR should be the woman getting raped in front of her man, both crying.

But then the woman realizes she likes it and only the man is left crying.

That's the core of NTR as far as I am concrened.

 

Otherwise it's more wife swapping or the woman having an affair.

 

However, words aren't math, so definitions may vary.

[Kawasumi]

35 minutes ago, Ningen said:

Yeah, it's pretty soft NTR if the man makes his woman do it or approves it.

Real NTR should be the woman getting raped in front of her man, both crying.

But then the woman realizes she likes it and only the man is left crying.

That's the core of NTR as far as I am concrened.

true, this is my favorite kind tbh

[sanahtlig]

I thought some more about what I like about NTR: I like the rivalry.  And like any good rivalry, you should be able to both win or lose, and the rival character should be well-characterized.  Winning should either be challenging or require sacrifices (i.e., betraying a friend or having another love interest NTR'd).  Ideally, the process should involve the heroine being hit on or slowly seduced by the rival, which fosters a sense of jealousy.  In a sense, NTR is as much an element of gameplay as a theme to me.

[mitchhamilton]

2 hours ago, sanahtlig said:

I thought some more about what I like about NTR: I like the rivalry.  And like any good rivalry, you should be able to both win or lose, and the rival character should be well-characterized.  Winning should either be challenging or require sacrifices (i.e., betraying a friend or having another love interest NTR'd).  Ideally, the process should involve the heroine being hit on or slowly seduced by the rival, which fosters a sense of jealousy.  In a sense, NTR is as much an element of gameplay as a theme to me.

hmm, i see. very interesting.

[Lucius]

10 hours ago, Vorathiel said:

We all know who reads VNs - I would bet my money that over the half of VN audience is a mom-basement dweller, neckbeard virgins. They never even touched a girl. So. Never touched a girl -> watching more porn -> needs more crazy and 'heavier' stimuli -> turns attention into NTR porn.

But that is just my theory. I'm not saying that whole NTR fans community is made of 30+ old fat man virgins.

Okay, I'm a mom-basement dwelling piece of shit weeaboo, and I take offense to that, because I clearly don't like NTR hentai.

 

 

 

 

 

I clearly like rape hentai.

[Nandemonai]

9 hours ago, sanahtlig said:

I thought some more about what I like about NTR: I like the rivalry.  And like any good rivalry, you should be able to both win or lose, and the rival character should be well-characterized.  Winning should either be challenging or require sacrifices (i.e., betraying a friend or having another love interest NTR'd).  Ideally, the process should involve the heroine being hit on or slowly seduced by the rival, which fosters a sense of jealousy.  In a sense, NTR is as much an element of gameplay as a theme to me.

I might be interested in a story like that.  Most of the time I've seen NTR-type stuff, it's involved automatic turnoffs for me like coersion, blackmail, or rape.

[mitchhamilton]

soooooo please bang my wife might be ntr. shocking, i know? im basing this on the description for the other guy.

 

"Mariko’s superior at work. Handsome, successful, and knows how to get what he wants. He’s particularly gifted in bed, owing to his prodigious equipment and difficulty achieving climax.

He sets his sights on Mariko, in an attempt to steal her away from her husband. The fantastic sex is enough to keep her coming back, but will it win her heart as well?"

 

i still maintain that other vn isnt though. i mean, the mc is the one getting multiple girls. usually theyre the ones losing girls.

[vkalvkal]

You're right, those two titles aren't netorare (ntr). They're netorase.

There's netorare, netori and netorase. Netorare I love. Netori is not my kind of fetish, but one or other title can be good. Netorase I absolutely despise. 

[mitchhamilton]

44 minutes ago, vkalvkal said:

You're right, those two titles aren't netorare (ntr). They're netorase.

There's netorare, netori and netorase. Netorare I love. Netori is not my kind of fetish, but one or other title can be good. Netorase I absolutely despise. 

THERES A THIRD OPTION?!

 

 

.....*packs up* im out. bye yall.