The Emptiness of Finishing Games/VNs

[solidbatman]

I am a fairly new gamer, and an even newer VN reader. I can only say I really, really got into gaming around 6-7 years ago. Before that, its was only casual playing. However, since I've really gotten into gaming, I've noticed something when I finish a game or a VN. An empty feeling. 

 

I first noticed it when I beat Final Fantasy X. It was my first true JRPG, and the first story-centric game I played. Upon beating it, and totally not crying at the end, it took me a good while to even consider playing another game. I felt empty, and did not know what to play next. How could anything measure up to FFX? 

 

Repeat with Persona 3

 

Repeat with Metal Gear Solid 3

 

Repeat with Xenosaga III (multiplied by 100, that likely took a month or two to recover).

 

Everytime I'd finish a story driven game, I would feel drained and empty. Then, VNs started doing that to me. Heck, even Little Busters, which I did not like, left me feeling empty at the end (a little bit angry at the end too. Stupid stupid stupid). 

 

So, how do you feel upon finishing a great game or VN? Do you have to recover? Or can you jump right into something new?

 

[Nosebleed]

Pretty much the same for me. I feel empty inside and feel like I need more, but nothing fills that void other than a VN of the same caliber which is usually hard to find.

[Guest]

That happened to me with a few Vn's and some games such as Portal 2.

 

I always take break after these.

 

Maybe too calm down, maybe too realise I just played a fantastic game, maybe too realise it will be painfull to come back to standard ones again.

Why exactly ? Maybe a mix of these three reasons. It hurts to finish great games.

 

When I really get into a story, the end means "back to reality". That never feels good. It's the same for movies/anime/books though.

[Flutterz]

Quite frankly I haven't finished a game in a few years now (thanks, Dota 2! >.>) but I have finished quite a few VNs, and I usually take a short break, maybe an hour, maybe a day, and jump into the next thing on my list.

[monkeysrumble]

I have similar feelings too. After finishing a really good game I usually read wiki articles on it, listen to the OST, re-watch great moments etc. I kind of learnt how to coup with the feeling in a way because when I have that feeling of emptiness I know I have just played/watched/read something truly great.

[Kaguya]

Happened to me at the beginning, not anymore. The list of untld VNs to read is so big, so when I finish one I generally jump right into the other. I do stop to write my thoughts on very good VNs, but that doesn't take too much. 

[FruitsPunchSamurai]

I'm a big video game fan so if i finish a game i just go on to the next one, no big deal for me. Vns i finish one then end up taking a break because i don't feel like reading another one.

[Katatsumuri]

Almost the same here. While it feels very satisfying to actually finish something, I usually become very bored for some time afterwards...

[Steve]

Well the fact you are so new to gaming might explain it in your case, let me elaborate on it later.

But first let me start about VNs - it can easily happen with VNs, you expect different ending or simply want more of the same good characters and story you have grown to love. That way you feel something is missing at the end and that's why fandiscs for VNs are so popular, sadly almost none of them get translated.

 

Now back to games - you say games while commenting on the "games" for past 6 years, I would more like call them "interactive stories" - today's "games" often times have some simple combat mechanics and tons of cutscenes, linear story and also a "true end" (not to be confused with true end in VNs).

What the term "true end" means in this case is that once you finish the game, there is no reason or desire to play the game once again.

But then ask yourself, is that really a game in that case? Because if that was the case with the original meaning of games, you would never play another game of chess, because you already finished one game. You would never play another game of monopoly or any other board game if you already finished - but that is not true and you also don't feel the sense of emptiness once you finish those games - and that's how games should be and they still are, you just need to play the correct ones.

 

Games should be about unique experiences, experiences seeming like exactly fit for you, and you might say "well that is only possible with multiplayer games" and you would be wrong. Yes, multiplayer games are almost always unique, because you have different inputs from 2 or more different players, creating the unique experience nobody else had.

But why cannot it work with singleplayer? Well the answer is that it can, you just need to play GAMES, not "games".

 

If you get to the end of the game and think that it is the end, you have not been playing the right game, games are not supposed to be about the story, they are not supposed to be a story told to you via the protagonists perspective - those are visual novels and work great that way, but they are not games. True games are about the journey of YOU as a player, about you overcoming the obstacles the game presents you, about you overcoming the biggest enemy - yourself. Overcoming your weaknesses to improve your skill, improve your strategy, your thinking and then finally getting to the next stage of the game.

None of these feelings are present if the game holds your hand all the time and just tells you a story.

 

 

You might think that these games must be some kind of roguelike or roguelite, for example the current one I returned to after a few months, FTL - and yes, those are also one of the true games, I finished that game maybe 100 times and yet I never felt any emptiness after finishing it, you feel achievement and a nice conclusion to one of your journeys, so you can easily start another and it will be very different from the one you just finished, even after many times.

 

BUT it is not only this genre that offers the true game experience, well there used to be games that had this experience before, thats what we as gamers grown to love, giant RPGs where you can't possibly experience everything on first playthrough, I've finished fallout 1 over 30 times, fallout 2 maybe 10 times and I enjoyed the game every time.

Ok, those are old games, I agree that they are highly outdated with the graphics and systems and everything, you are looking for something from this era.

 

And all I can say is Dark Souls - that game is a peek to what games used to be and a hope that new games can still be like that.

Tutorial in that game while being held hand? Yes, sure, there is one... in DEATH, you die and you keep dying until you learn what you do wrong and correct it, that is the tutorial and death is holding your hand the whole time. And back on the topic of ending, if you actually do end up beating that game, or even just a boss there, you will feel a great sense of achievement inside, you put the work towards the kill, you worked hard on it and you finally did it.

Finishing the game and thinking you've seen it all, I can tell you for a fact you will have seen maybe half of it, I discovered one of the largest lore events and bossfights in my 3rd playthrough, yes, after I finished the game twice I still found new boss to beat, new challenge - and that is why it is worth playing the game multiple times - it is not about the story, about how you progress and how it ends, it is about the JOURNEY and the experience you have as a player - and that experience will be different for your first playthrough, it will be different for your second playthrough, you can't even possibly try all the different playstyles ("classes" - there are not real classes though) until you've played it several times. I've finished that game maybe about 7 times now and I still found new things worth exploring and I have time every time, I find new challenges that make the sense of achievement real. I find new parts of the game that I didn't know about before - and that brings me to another weakness of today's games - they are afraid you will miss stuff so they shove everything in your face, in cutscenes or whatever - where is the sense of exploration and unique experience in that! In true games like dark souls, you even miss whole zones, bosses, parts of the lore - and the game doesn't care, it will be there waiting for you until you find it and if you never find it then the game doesn't care. You might think "well then the effort of the designers was wasted, wasn't it" - WRONG, the design behind those hidden parts is that sense of satisfaction when you actually find something new, it feels like you've earned it with your exploration, with your dedication. The game should not shove content in your face, you should be the one to discover it.

 

 

So bottom line, today's "games" lack exploration, challenge, sense of achievement (hell when they give you steam "achievement" for WATCHING A CUTSCENE you couldn't avoid, you know something is wrong with the system), sense of satisfaction, and many more things - do yourself a favor and stop playing games for the story - read a book, watch a movie, read a VN, all those things you can do if you want story (although VNs are more for the H ). If you want to play a game, play a GAME. If your only motivation to beat a boss is to progress the story, and not the satisfaction of beating the boss, the game is flawed or you are playing it wrong.

 

But yea, start with dark souls, I cannot properly describe in a single post what makes that game a GAME and unique from all other crap released these days and why is it by many considered the best singleplayer game for the past decade. All I can say is that it is a game by the very definition of the term game, just like games used to be in the old days - and if you are not feeling like playing old graphically and technically outdated games, it is probably the #1 choice for you right now. Start with it and never feel empty after finishing a game ever again, you will learn to feel proud and to praise the sun after all your gaming achievements.

[solidbatman]

Without getting into defining what actually makes a game (I disagree on many of your points, but I do play a lot more games than you), how quickly does nostalgia set in?

 

For example, when I think back on reading through Clannad, or beating Atelier Rorona, a get a certain nostalgic feeling (especially with Clannad). I finished Clannad a little over a year ago, and Rorona maybe 6 months ago. But I still sometimes want to go back to those "good 'ol days. 

[Kaguya]

How quickly does nostalgia set in?

 

For example, when I think back on reading through Clannad, or beating Atelier Rorona, a get a certain nostalgic feeling (especially with Clannad). I finished Clannad a little over a year ago, and Rorona maybe 6 months ago. But I still sometimes want to go back to those "good 'ol days. 

Oh, that's interesting. Again, it's another thing that doesn't happen to me- Today is the same as yesterday and it will be the same tomorrow- work a bit, enter fuwa for a while and read VNs. I never really felt like going back to the "good old days" because there's still so many stuff to read. It may happen if I ever finish all VNs I'm interested in, though.

[Steve]

Well nostalgia differs for games and VNs as well - for VNs its easy to want to read it for the first time, not knowing what is going to happen in the story. But for a game that is not focused on story it takes much longer to build the sense of nostalgia, because for many years you still have the opportunity to return to that game, if its MP then you can just continue playing, for SP you can just play different way, explore new stuff you haven't found yet etc, I still return to above mentioned FTL after year and a half from its release, I can play it every few months and enjoy it. I did just recently replay dark souls as well, had lot of fun there.

I can recognize when its nostalgia getting on me, mostly for multiplayer games, I often think about how awesome it was when we used ti play counter strike or whatever other game, but I quickly get that it is just nostalgia getting on me and I can never return those moments because it was up to the people I played with and those people changed, split etc.

But for SP games, I know that I am not influenced by nostalgia when I'm saying how I replay those games 7 times and still love it. I am not replaying it and hoping to enjoy it like the first time (which is what nostalgia would cause), I am replaying it because it is worth replaying.

 

 

Also I am not sure how many more games than me you play, well you play infinitely more console games than me since I don't own those. And to be honest when I see games like Beyond: Two Souls, I wonder about the console experience. Don't take me wrong, I did watch the full game on youtube and I liked the story, but never in that playthrough I felt like I want to be the one "playing" it, there is nothing to play! I wouldn't even call it a game.

 

But if you enjoy mostly the story in games, play those games. But if you don't want to feel empty when finishing a game, try playing games for the gameplay, not for the story or the graphics. You might play more AAA games than me, but how many of those games you can genuinely say have good gameplay element and are not just a standard third person cover shooters and such.

I said it before and say it again, if I want story, I watch a TV series, anime, movie, if I want an interactive story I can read a VN, but if I want a game, I want to enjoy the gameplay and that's why the last 5 games I can remember have absolutely 0 story and 100% gameplay.

But whatever you like batman, whatever you like - just try some games with gameplay over story and see if you like it, if not then continue playing the story games.

[Clephas]

For me, I tend to have two types of reactions... I'm either excited and exhausted or disappointed and bored.  If the game was deep, stimulated me emotionally and intellectually, and had characters I could empathize with, I tend to go out of it excited and exhausted (though this is an extreme reaction, usually to games that pass my 'favorites' line). 

 

Disappointment and boredom...is much more common.  Considering the number of moege I've played and the number of role-playing, strategy, and shooter games I played before that (several hundred), it is inevitable that games that don't hit the sweet spot (as I said, baseline it has to stimulate me emotionally or intellectually... preferably both) leave me wanting to shrug my shoulders and move on. 

 

I guess the difference is that I am a hardcore gamer and have been one for the better part of two and a half decades.  Good stories are my reason for living, and I couldn't live without them.  However, I've long since resigned myself to the fact that I'll have to wade through oceans of shit to get to just one gem.  It is why I tend to be both more and less objective than the average gamer.  My initial response to most games is very subjective... but by the time I've finished a game, I usually have an objective analysis running parallel to my personal tastes.  I guess it is because I got tired of being jaded... being condescended to isn't fun for the person on the receiving end, so I made a policy of not letting my jaded tastes control how I evaluated a game to others if it was outside my sweet spot. 

 

Naturally, my sweet spot is superviolence, mixed with virulent emotional clashes, an involved and well-designed setting, and a perspective that doesn't leave me feeling helpless (it is the main reason why I despise helpless or weak protags in action vns).

[Zhiroo]

Can't help but think that Steve is missing the point of the topic and is going on about his rants.

 

I always get an empty feeling when finishing a VN, manga or anime that I really loved (can't remember for games as I haven't really played a story driven game in quite a while) but after a few years I've managed to manage better I usually jump to another piece soon after.

[garejei]

I've been gaming for almost two decades now and this tends to happen to me as well, *especially* with VNs. It sometimes takes me days to work up the motivation to start something new. If I'm ultra hyped for something I guess I might be able to jump right into it. Like, I'm nearing the end of game X buy I'm already thinking "man, I can't wait to finish this so I can start on game Y", but even this fails sometimes and I end up waiting a few days regardless.

[Bolverk]

Before I used lose motivation after I completed something. Nowdays it usually takes me 1 day or so before I can start with something new with great joy. The vn's stopped making such a big impact on me after me  20th vn or so. Hardly like with Saya no uta 2 years back, it made me feel bewildered for a week. Good times.

[Darklord Rooke]

I am a fairly new gamer, and an even newer VN reader. I can only say I really, really got into gaming around 6-7 years ago. Before that, its was only casual playing. However, since I've really gotten into gaming, I've noticed something when I finish a game or a VN. An empty feeling. 

 

I first noticed it when I beat Final Fantasy X. It was my first true JRPG, and the first story-centric game I played. Upon beating it, and totally not crying at the end, it took me a good while to even consider playing another game. I felt empty, and did not know what to play next. How could anything measure up to FFX? 

 

Repeat with Persona 3

 

Repeat with Metal Gear Solid 3

 

Repeat with Xenosaga III (multiplied by 100, that likely took a month or two to recover).

 

Everytime I'd finish a story driven game, I would feel drained and empty. Then, VNs started doing that to me. Heck, even Little Busters, which I did not like, left me feeling empty at the end (a little bit angry at the end too. Stupid stupid stupid). 

 

So, how do you feel upon finishing a great game or VN? Do you have to recover? Or can you jump right into something new?

 

Same. My trick is to switch genres. It will be hard to find something that measures up and everything afterward will feel not as good.

 

So, I walk away and do something different. Play a shooter. Watch a sitcom... play tetris. Come back to epic gaming storylines in a couple of weeks.

[Otaku1612]

Well, I've been gaming since I was about 5, but only came into visual novels about a year or so ago.

 

Interesting point you make there. Personally, when I finish some kind of story related game, I leave it with a sense of satisfaction, and at worst a slightly grim one if loved characters or my main guy died. I've done my job, beating the final boss and doing my best to sort stuff out, and now the characters are free to continue living their lives and enjoying themselves after the story is over. Only time I have a feeling of incompleteness or rage is when I get a bad ending, where I go all Bardock and go "I'm going to try to change the future!", or a feeling of incompleteness if I get a common ending in visual novels.

 

Only without the then getting owned by Frieza.

[solidbatman]

Maybe a better term is drained instead of empty. 

[Tom]

i never finished the RPGs that i liked alot on my first playthrough. i would progress with the story untill i thought the next scene is the last boss, then reset the save data and play again. i didnt want it to end that quick since i liked the game alot, i would finish it on my 2nd or 3rd playthough.

well this is how i used to be since i dont play games anymore, except some VNs

[Yeah Way]

Every single route of "Rewrite". Had to take several days break between each one, so I took perhaps a month to finish it.

[Zenophilious]

That's why I like roguelikes.  Even if you manage to "beat" the game, it never truly ends.  It only ends when you get so mad from repeatedly dying and starting over that you ragequit and throw your monitor onto the ground and stomp on it until your rage dissipates.  I also like NG+ options, usually because you can pretty much become a god, and games that let you mess around after you beat the story.  That's just for video games, though.  I feel a slight void of motivation to play another game for a while after I beat a game that had a story that profoundly affected me.

[krofna]

Sounds a lot like Post Anime Depression Syndrome.