Thoughts on long common routes

[Life]

A long common route is something I come back to when replaying a vn. Especially when the true route makes me feel like part of me is missing. There are so many Easter eggs to find sometimes.

[madvanced]

A long common route is something I come back to when replaying a vn. Especially when the true route makes me feel like part of me is missing. There are so many Easter eggs to find sometimes.

I remember Grisaia kinda of has one of those. 

After reading Sachi's route if you pay attention in her choice if you select to not praise her in the dialog right after with Amane and Makina, they talk about a playground and she mutters to herself the word playground pointing to the one she played with Yuuji.

[DavidA.]

Honestly, if the story is interesting, I don't really mind the length.

[Tatsujin]

Linear stories like Muv-Luv Alternative are superb. Common routes like Grisaia no Kajitsu are hella-damn-worth-every-minute. In the very end, when I questioned when will things happen ... I simply didn't give a shit anymore and I just didn't want this very long common route to ever end. I laughed hard and shed tears to the point of falling on the floor one time (I really did). I'm not a big fan of many options ... but I can suck it up if it's a good VN.

[Darklord Rooke]

I find long common routes usually contain a lot of bloat, which irks me a little. I would rather they tighten up scenes and deliver a shorter game, personally.

 

Also long common routes are annoying to replay, especially if you have to experience every route to unlock the ending *glances at Clannad*.

[Zenophilious]

I have to admit, as much as I loved Grisaia's common route, it did stretch out a little longer than I thought was necessary.  Whenever things slowed down I started trying to estimate when a choice would present itself, and guess just how much longer I'd have to read to get to it.  I wouldn't mind rereading it later, when I have enough time and I've made a dent in my VN list, but reading it the first time kinda pushed my patience to the limit.  That's just me, though.  I can't read through a mountain of text without a hook to keep my interest (The Lord of the Rings was brutal for me to read).  Might be my ADD talking...but whatever.

[edwd2]

Depends on how well it's implemented. In the case of Grisaia, the common route was excessively long and boring, with little plot or character development, overused humor, etc. It eventually started irritating me and carried over to its sequels, seriously, I got sick of all the girls except his sister, a rather new character.

 

In most cases, I would say unless the common route has a lot of plot development or introduces overarching concepts of the entire novel, it should stick to the goal of introducing the characters and their backgrounds before they lose the reader's interest. The plot of the common route is also restricted in the way that the protagonist cannot swing too heavily to any particular female character since the route must chronologically precede all character routes, thus romantic content is heavily restricted.

[Clephas]

The problem with long common routes in moege is that in a moege... there is usually no story to support the common route.  Thus, it ends up being a stream of daily life scenes, which can get interminably boring after a while.  On the other hand, since many moege heroine routes spend way too much on dating and ichaicha, long heroine routes in those games can be just as bad.  In a story-focused game, you either have a central story with a long common route or an early split with wildly different stories for each heroine.  Dies Irae is an example of the latter (though the common route is pretty long too) and Clannad is an example of the former.

[dreamweaver]

pretty sure the only long common routes i ever played was Hoshimemo, Grisaia and recently Golden Marriage.

Its okay i like long games lol

[HMN]

i personally enjoy long common routes,especially the ones which are full of funny scenes like grisaia

[madvanced]

Depends on how well it's implemented. In the case of Grisaia, the common route was excessively long and boring, with little plot or character development, overused humor, etc. It eventually started irritating me and carried over to its sequels, seriously, I got sick of all the girls except his sister, a rather new character.

 

In most cases, I would say unless the common route has a lot of plot development or introduces overarching concepts of the entire novel, it should stick to the goal of introducing the characters and their backgrounds before they lose the reader's interest. The plot of the common route is also restricted in the way that the protagonist cannot swing too heavily to any particular female character since the route must chronologically precede all character routes, thus romantic content is heavily restricted.

Dat spoiler doe. On another note, in my opinion Grisaia's common route had plenty of character development, even if I can agree that it was somewhat dragged out.

[Christfall]

Overall I would to think is the common route is for the purpose of player to understand the characters as well as growing affection for them. That is the most important thing a VN needs to achieve as the minimum requirement. If the story isn't promising to capture the reader's interest, the characters then have to take that role. A long common route can only work if there is a combination of both good story and characters. Missing one, it can still work with a shorter common route. Missing both, then people either complain or just drop it entirely.

[Freestyle80]

Length doesnt really matter as long as quality backs it up which Grisaia does really well

The common route never got boring so doesnt really hurt any 're-read' value

[hydro]

Well, if it's good I love a long common route. If not, then I may get impateint wanting to enter the route of my fav girl.

[Zhiroo]

Long routes like GnK are fine but ones like the common route of Rewrite are awful. Grisaia's common route never had me have 'Ah I wanna quit' moments while reading Rewrite I had a couple. Yes in the end Rewrite redeems itself on the actual routes but damn that common route.

[madvanced]

Stop playing the "I don't mind it as long as it's good" card. It's an empty response. You'd probably like to be stabbed in the chest if it's good too, but what would make being stabbed in the chest good?

 

The thing about common routes that interests me is that the author has absolute control over the characters and their relationships. The variables may change the plot ever so slightly, sure, but more often than not the writer knows just how the reader is probably feeling at that moment. So it's easier to deliver memorable scenes in the common route. That and we often see the most varied interactions in the common route.

 

Like in Katawa Shoujo when you can see basically every character talking to each other at least once. Rin and Shizune's interaction is hilarious, but more than that-- it's makes Yamaku believable as a school

 

So the common route is the best opportunity to make a VN lively, believable and remarkable. Long ones have more room for memorable scenes, but, of course, are more frustrating if they don't have any. So I really do prefer long common routes if they have uncommon interactions or banters, and, of course, variation so as not to damage the subsequent playthroughs.

I agree with everything you said, but the first sentence you said is somewhat of a fallacy, since it means different things to different people, and the analogy isn't the greatest.

[Undying]

that depends, if is just slice of life with almost no character development, (Grisaia case) , I prefer shorter ones, if theres something going on them the lenght is not a problem for me.

 

slice of life is fun, but it gets borig when they keep just doing nonstop. 

[Mr Poltroon]

Stop playing the "I don't mind it as long as it's good" card. It's an empty response. You'd probably like to be stabbed in the chest if it's good too, but what would make being stabbed in the chest good?

M'lord, I'm so very sorry. As it happens, not everyone has the ability to correctly discern what exactly makes them believe something is good. I myself have plenty of difficulty even trying, but I still want to share my oh-so-important opinion. I do understand it wont make for the most interesting read, though.

So I personally am of the opinion that the "as long as it's good" is as valid an opinion as a constructive 5 page thesis about why long common routes are better. 

 

 

Like in Katawa Shoujo when you can see basically every character talking to each other at least once. Rin and Shizune's interaction is hilarious, but more than that-- it's makes Yamaku believable as a school

I do agree that situations like this are awesome 

[Chewy]

That can be said about any common route, even short ones.

Well not every1 thinks dat tho. I mean some ppl dont like the characters themselves but still like the plot itself.

[madvanced]

Well not every1 thinks dat tho. I mean some ppl dont like the characters themselves but still like the plot itself.

But in the context I said, if you think a long common is hell because you don't either the characters or the plot, a short common will be just as bad. that's why the discussion shouldn't be about length but quality.

[Mr Poltroon]

But in the context I said, if you think a long common is hell because you don't either the characters or the plot, a short common will be just as bad. that's why the discussion shouldn't be about length but quality.

Have you read the topic title?

 

Anyhow, you have a point. But a long common route will be a longer hell than a short one, that's why people are making this connection. 

[madvanced]

Have you read the topic title?

 

Anyhow, you have a point. But a long common route will be a longer hell than a short one, that's why people are making this connection. 

Tiago I know the title, that sentence I said is on context and you know it. Of course it will be a longer hell, but you know that just because it's long it won't be bad and that is what some people are saying. Yeah it's a subjective matter, but it doesn't mean my argument is outright wrong.

[Freestyle80]

Either way before anything the quality and content of the common route matters the most

[Mr Poltroon]

Tiago I know the title, that sentence I said is on context and you know it.

I applaud you sir. I dislike using smilies, but sometimes they're necessary to catch the fact that I'm joking/trolling (mostly the latter).  It seems my signature is doing it's job of alerting people to that fact.

 

Of course it will be a longer hell, but you know that just because it's long it won't be bad and that is what some people are saying. Yeah it's a subjective matter, but it doesn't mean my argument is outright wrong.

Your argument is that a bad short route is as bad as a bad long route. Subjectivity has no relevancy here. Longer hell is always worse than shorter one. 

As for people saying that a route is bad because it's long, that has no basis on anything whatsoever.

Length has nothing to do with quality, except for the fact that quality is lost the more it's stretched (which could be the argument they tried to make).

[madvanced]

I applaud you sir. I dislike using smilies, but sometimes they're necessary to catch the fact that I'm joking/trolling (mostly the latter).  It seems my signature is doing it's job of alerting people to that fact.

 

Your argument is that a bad short route is as bad as a bad long route. Subjectivity has no relevancy here. Longer hell is always worse than shorter one. 

As for people saying that a route is bad because it's long, that has no basis on anything whatsoever.

Length has nothing to do with quality, except for the fact that quality is lost the more it's stretched (which could be the argument they tried to make).

Fair point, I wasn't trying to say that a bad long common will not be worse than a short bad common, it's common sense to know that the longer you're exposed to something you don't like it's worse, I was just saying, to some people, that a short common route is also bad, since they were trying to make he point that long=bad. Nothing else Tiago, it seems you missed my point a bit.