Are you that type of VN player?

[Clephas]

There are only a few heroines that seriously stand out to me after all these years... one is Marie from Dies Irae, another is Kagome from Comyu, Belche from Draculius, Ami from Semiramis no Tenbin, Kanata from Devils Devel Concept, and Donoko from Haruka ni Aogi, Uruwashi no. 

 

However, except for Ami, all of these are from VNs that I first played years ago... It is hard for me to retain a strong memory of heroines lately, because most begin to look the same after a while and less and less effort is put into making the reader love them, outside of mindless cuteness.

 

If you've read those VNs above, you'll notice that they are split into two types... the super-capable and the innocent.  Despite the persona I role-play a lot, I have a strong sense of 保護欲, the desire to 'protect' a heroine.  Thus, I have a thing for non-cliche tragic/lonely/broken heroines.  However, I also like strong-willed, independent-minded heroines... this is probably my biggest contradiction as a reader. 

 

What I really hate is the 'normal' heroine, a girl who basically falls in love with the protagonist normally, dates him normally, has normal problems on a normal scale (such as parent-directed angst, worrying about friends, etc), and wants normal things from their relationship. 

 

Even Donoko, the most normal of the heroines on that list, is still far outside this standard... and I've yet to fall in love with such a heroine for her own sake. 

 

In other words, I'm fundamentally perverse. 

[edwd2]

lol. unless you ntr en route, i won't consider a temporal reset cheating.

[Katatsumuri]

While a route and character can pull me in emotionally, I never actually feel anything for that character, knowing that it is merely a character. Sure, I usually try to create arguments in my head where I attempt to justify that particular route being the  "true" route (whenever the true route isn't specified, and as long as the main heroine/route isn't really obvious), but I never consider myself to be part of that route. I never consider myself as the protagonist, but merely as a watcher/observer who can occasionally influence stuff.

 

Even if the character is memorable, they are merely just a character.

[Carronade]

Can't say I've ever felt any romantic attachment towards a fictional character.

[nohman]

Eh, not really. 

I'm in the boat that reads visual novels for the story, not the waifu experience. I'll obviously develop preferences for characters, but it doesn't extend so far that I feel guilty for completing a title. That's not to say I haven't felt off completing multiple routes before. Aeka's route in Yume Miru Kusuri comes to mind. With how explicitly her problem plays out in her route, the implication that it still continues in the other routes put a bit of a damper on the when I immediately went to Mizuki's route. That added the experience though (in a good way), since the game is about societal problems at large.

 

You are so much in a wrong media then.

 

That's not true. VNs can be a medium to tell a story like any other. Just because you like to self-insert and find wish fulfillment, doesn't mean it's incorrect that other people don't.

[Decay]

You are so much in a wrong media then.

Somehow, I'm still enjoying myself.

[Clephas]

VNs are actually ideal as a storytelling medium... it is just that the Japanese, who obviously make the greater majority of them (understatement) tend to have a focus on characters over story in most cases, lol.

[sirjabberwock]

I'm the complete opposite in a way. I feel almost obligated to 100% every VN I play unless I drop it from losing interest in something beyond just the heroine

[Zalor]

To me 2D girls are far more important then 3D girls (I don't even like 3D girls to begin with) and characters from VNs/Anime are far more important to me then 3D people, whoever I don't feel like playing multiple routes is cheating as it is happening in an alternative dimensions.

 

What I am about to say is probably not going to be a popular perspective, but from from personal experience I can say this is quite a self-destructive view. I bought into the whole 2D is better than 3D thing throughout 8th and 9th grade. A combination of teenage angst and low self esteem led me to Tohno-chan. Not sure if you know of this site or not, but it is an acronym for:

True

Otaku

Hikikomori

Neet

Organization

channel

 

Spending time on Tohno-chan made me even more reclusive, anti-social and ultimately miserable. It was a perfect example of "misery loves company". Most of the people on that site are fairly depressed and anti-social. I sort of adopted their attitudes and it made it really difficult to make friends, and thus even more difficult to enjoy school. Thankfully for me I met a few other people who were as into Otaku sub-culture as I was. I ended up befriending  them and steadily became a more social person. I'm now in my final year of High School and I am on decent terms with all the various social groups. I still primarily hang out with my otaku friends, but they aren't my only friends. I enjoy my life far more than I did during my anti-social years in 8th and 9th grade when I was borderline depressed.   

 

As for the 2D women > 3D women argument; I once agreed but now hold the other perspective. During my anti-social days I firmly held this belief, and actively tried to find ugliness in real women. I thought that 2D women were superior because they were made to be. However, I've come to realize that it is the imperfections of real women that flavors their beauty and personality like a spice. Also, whether you like it or not, 2D women can never fill the void of human loneliness.

 

Again, I doubt this will change your perspectives. But I felt like sharing this because when I subscribed to the same views you currently share, I only became more miserable because of them. It was through becoming social and accepting of people that I became happy. Visual Novels and anime are great, but I think it is important and healthy to enjoy them as art forms and not as escapism/substitutes for life. 

[Clephas]

In my case... it is more of a general dislike of people that predates my otaku-extreme days.  I had to reject constant contact with people for the sake of my sanity and stress levels, so as a result, I used 2D to get over it... and eventually I found something resembling inner peace... or at least as close as you can get without sitting under a tree for a few decades.

[nohman]

 

Spending time on this site made me even more reclusive, anti-social and ultimately miserable. It was a perfect example of "misery loves company". Most of the people on this site are fairly depressed and anti-social.

 

 

I wouldn't characterize Fuwanovel to that degree. We have a varying degrees of... crazy, and there are a few members that come to mind that fit the reclusive otaku bill to a T,  but I wouldn't call the majority of this site depressed or even anti-social. Obviously I'm speaking solely from observation, so fuck me if there's some giant pity party I haven't been invited to. Other than that, you're right about how the whole 2D>3D mindset. It's an unhealthy coping mechanism.

[Zalor]

I wouldn't characterize Fuwanovel to that degree. We have a varying degrees of... crazy, and there are a few members that come to mind that fit the reclusive otaku bill to a T,  but I wouldn't call the majority of this site depressed or even anti-social. Obviously I'm speaking solely from observation, so fuck me if there's some giant pity party I haven't been invited to. Other than that, you're right about how the whole 2D>3D mindset. It's an unhealthy coping mechanism.

 

 

I was criticizing Tohno-chan of being a place to keep misery company, not Fuwanovel. I'm not that active here currently, but I like this place enough to keep coming back.

 

EDIT: I see where the confusion happened. Whenever I said "this site", I meant Tohn-chan since I was refering back to my previous mention of it. In any case I edited the original post to be less confusing. 

[nohman]

I was criticizing Tohno-chan of being a place to keep misery company, not Fuwanovel. I'm not that active here currently, but I like this place enough to keep coming back.

 

EDIT: I see where the confusion happened. Whenever I said "this site", I meant Tohn-chan since I was refering back to my previous mention of it. In any case I edited the original post to be less confusing. 

 

I might just blame my reading comprehension on that one, not you. 

My bad.

[Lambda]

Half the time I end up shipping the protag with another guy that doesn't even get a route, so I'm fine playing other routes. I consider some of the main ships to be best, of course, but they're all AUs, so... I'm a multishipper at heart, anyway. I wouldn't have survived picking some One True Pairings in my three playthroughs of Fire Emblem Awakening otherwise. ...I start and drop novels on whims because I have a very small attention span. A concept grabs me, I feel passionate about it, I finish a route or two, all the flaws become obvious, I stop. A few weeks-months later I pick it up again. It has nothing to do with how I feel about heroines.

[Okami]

 

What I am about to say is probably not going to be a popular perspective, but from from personal experience I can say this is quite a self-destructive view. I bought into the whole 2D is better than 3D thing throughout 8th and 9th grade. A combination of teenage angst and low self esteem led me to Tohno-chan. Not sure if you know of this site or not, but it is an acronym for:

True

Otaku

Hikikomori

Neet

Organization

channel

 

Spending time on Tohno-chan made me even more reclusive, anti-social and ultimately miserable. It was a perfect example of "misery loves company". Most of the people on that site are fairly depressed and anti-social. I sort of adopted their attitudes and it made it really difficult to make friends, and thus even more difficult to enjoy school. Thankfully for me I met a few other people who were as into Otaku sub-culture as I was. I ended up befriending  them and steadily became a more social person. I'm now in my final year of High School and I am on decent terms with all the various social groups. I still primarily hang out with my otaku friends, but they aren't my only friends. I enjoy my life far more than I did during my anti-social years in 8th and 9th grade when I was borderline depressed.   

 

As for the 2D women > 3D women argument; I once agreed but now hold the other perspective. During my anti-social days I firmly held this belief, and actively tried to find ugliness in real women. I thought that 2D women were superior because they were made to be. However, I've come to realize that it is the imperfections of real women that flavors their beauty and personality like a spice. Also, whether you like it or not, 2D women can never fill the void of human loneliness.

 

Again, I doubt this will change your perspectives. But I felt like sharing this because when I subscribed to the same views you currently share, I only became more miserable because of them. It was through becoming social and accepting of people that I became happy. Visual Novels and anime are great, but I think it is important and healthy to enjoy them as art forms and not as escapism/substitutes for life. 

 

 

I couldn't disagree more. There is noting wrong in being anti-social and surly that doesn't mean that you have to be depressed and/or miserable. In fact I lead a normal social life having friends and everything for most of my life and I was complicity bored most of the time no meter what I do I didn't find any satisfaction in normal every-day things. I was newer happier in my life and more satisfied then last 2 or so years from when I stopped wasting time hanging with people and started spending all my time enjoining Anime and VNs witch I actually enjoy doing and not just doing to kill a time from when I wake up till I go to sleep like all the social things I had been doing for all my life. 

 

It is complicate untrue that "2D women can never fill the void of human loneliness" in fact I would say that 3d women are the one that can't as there is no real love in 3D world unlike in 2D. If you find "imperfection" of 3D women to be their beauty that is your thing, I myself find it completely disgusting physically and I find especially disgusting their personalities.

 

I think that you are miserable now that you lost your way and are wasting time with a empty shallow 3D world and that you would be far happier if you thrown worthless things like 3D friends away and come back to an anime side witch is far better then an boring 3D world. True it's your life you have all the right to waste it on 3D things if you want.

[Zalor]

I think that you are miserable now that you lost your way and are wasting time with a empty shallow 3D world and that you would be far happier if you thrown worthless things like 3D friends away and come back to an anime side witch is far better then an boring 3D world. True it's your life you have all the right to waste it on 3D things if you want.

 

You're clearly getting a bit too defensive at the end. All I did was explain my experience with reclusive anti-social otaku subculture and how I didn't find happiness that way. I'm just trying to look after another Fuwa-brother in case you were in the same trap I found my self in. But if you are confident that immersing yourself in anime, visual novels, manga, etc will make you happy, than I'm not here to stop you. I'm just saying that I didn't find happiness in that, and only actually found further misery. But you're a different person than me.

 

lost your way and are wasting time with a empty shallow 3D world and that you would be far happier if you thrown worthless things like 3D friends away and come back to an anime side witch is far better then an boring 3D world.

 

Many monks of various religions claimed that the road to enlightenment is to abandon human attachment and relationships. However, secluding yourself in a monastery while reading ancient scriptural texts seems a lot more spiritual than fapping to 2D women. 

[InvertMouse]

I do have some thoughts on the 2D VS 3D topic, but I guess some might want this topic to stay on track. If this ends up continuing in its own thread (in a civil manner, of course), then I would be happy to chime in for a bit .

[Eclipsed]

The 2D vs. 3D might be a valid discussion for this thread, since the OP did ask:
 

 

So is there anyone out there like me who treats his 2D girls way too much like a real girl (3D)? LoL

 

Which I actually didn't answer in my earlier post, so I'll do so now.

No, I don't treat 2D girls like I do 3D. I don't even consider them as my "waifu" or anything. They are, as others have said, just characters. (Characters, mind you, that I really really REALLY REAAALLY like      but ultimately do not have any romantic attachment to).

Hell I don't even consider myself the protagonist so all the heroines he ends up with are his while I'll sit behind my computer screen cheering them on xD

[BookwormOtaku]

I'll admit if a heroine and/or her route stand out enough for me I may put some space between playing her route and whatever the next route in the game is supposed to be.  Really liking how a heroine and the MC go together hasn't ever stopped me from playing the other routes though I will sometimes find myself comparing one route to another. I think one reason I can move on to other routes no matter how much I enjoyed the previous heroine is because I consider the setup to be like so (the first 16 seconds of this video):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzUEu7Gb7Cg

[Okami]

You're clearly getting a bit too defensive at the end. All I did was explain my experience with reclusive anti-social otaku subculture and how I didn't find happiness that way. I'm just trying to look after another Fuwa-brother in case you were in the same trap I found my self in. But if you are confident that immersing yourself in anime, visual novels, manga, etc will make you happy, than I'm not here to stop you. I'm just saying that I didn't find happiness in that, and only actually found further misery. But you're a different person than me.

 

 

Many monks of various religions claimed that the road to enlightenment is to abandon human attachment and relationships. However, secluding yourself in a monastery while reading ancient scriptural texts seems a lot more spiritual than fapping to 2D women. 

 

Ok I might got a bit too much fired up, I see you didn't mean anything bad. But like I said my case is completely opposite of yours, 3D life is the one I didn't/couldn't find any happiness in and I am sure I couldn't find any happiness in it no meter what as there is simply noting in it for me. But I did find my happiness in a 2D world.

 

And I not fapping to 2d girls, I love them in a romantic sense not sexual, and in my opinion sex kills all romance and I am strongly against any kind of sex for many reasons, I am especially against 2D porn and I find it to be discrase for 2D world.

Witch is also a part of my 2D girls>3D girls opinion as 3D romance relationship is all about sex no about real love witch as I believe doesn't even exist in a 3D world and couldn't exist.

 

Like I said I am not some guy who spend his whole life next to his PC, I experienced most of what 3D world has to offer (Probably a lot more then most people) and then I find out about 2D world and for me 2D world is far better then a 3D one.

 

 

I do have some thoughts on the 2D VS 3D topic, but I guess some might want this topic to stay on track. If this ends up continuing in its own thread (in a civil manner, of course), then I would be happy to chime in for a bit .

 

Let's not go there, it wouldn't end up well, believe me. We tried it once already.

[Ezeefreak]

@Okami ... It's your life and you can make what you want. But that doesn't mean you can not be a pitiable individuum to me. And that is waht you are in my eyes. I just wanted to make that clear. But anyway, like I said do what you want to do and believe what you want to believe but don't try to convince others from yoz weird reflection of the world.

 

To the topic, I see it like Eclipsed (even without Kotori he has a good Opinion ). I've always cheering for them to get a good end with the protag. I have absolutly no romantic connections to them, more like the relation you have to a cute pet or something, you wanna help to have a good life. Jealousy or something like that doesn't exist here. In the end that still is fiction.

 

I'm more like the complete opposite, I've to complete the whole VN, no matter how bad it is .

[Clephas]

Speaking seriously, some people are just happier living in a 2D world, with only occasional necessary interaction with 3D people in order to maintain their mental and emotional balance (you really can go insane by being alone constantly for too long without non-net interaction). 

 

Back to the topic, falling in love with a heroine is something that happened to me a lot early on.  For instance, after playing Kaze no Ushiro ni Ayumu Mono's path on Jingai Makyou, it was better than a year before I could go back and finish the entire thing, because I just fell so much in love with her.  With Comyu, I have to force myself to play anything other than Kagome's route, even now.  Unfortunately for me, long experience has worn away that ability to fall completely in love with a given heroine in a merely 'decent' VN.  I might like an archetypical heroine, but it is highly unlikely I'll love her so much more than the other heroines that I would ignore them just to play her path. 

 

I mentioned Ami from Semiramis no Tenbin... but understand, it is rare for a heroine to fall so far outside of established lines.  She is semi-sociopathic (not quite but almost there), pragmatic, and surprisingly affectionate with those she really does let in close, though she never reveals the whole of what she is thinking or feeling.  She can frequently do horrible things on a whim, create situations that others would find frightening just as a test, and honestly doesn't understand the point of bothering with morality or the law when it gets in the way of survival or self-protection.

[hydro]

I see where you're coming from, but I don't go that far. I'll only skip routes if I don't like the character/scenario.

 

Miyako's sadness in other Majikoi routes was just horrible. Made me feel shitty, and what's worse is her's obviously isn't translated. It's usually not that bad though. I read Yoakena recently and all 5 routes did a pretty good job in not making you feel bad. In them the other girls either didn't like the main character yet or kept it to themselves.

[Okami]

@Okami ... It's your life and you can make what you want. But that doesn't mean you can not be a pitiable individuum to me. And that is waht you are in my eyes. I just wanted to make that clear. But anyway, like I said do what you want to do and believe what you want to believe but don't try to convince others from yoz weird reflection of the world.

 

 

I have every right to express my opinion and to tell about my point of view and to try to convince people that my way of life is better just as you. And just as you see me as pitiable I see you as pitiable too for living an empty, worthless 3D world and even true you know about a 2D world you are in delusion that 3D is better and even brainwashed to think of your poor 3D life as better then ours as something objective just because it's a mainstream opinion. I am at least able to think for myself and not just copy/paste most popular opinions.

[Nerathim]

more indulgence please