VN Reading Club - May 2015 (Coμ -Kuroi Ryuu to Yasashii Oukoku-)

[Zenophilious]

Almost seems like they were setting it up for a sequel (not gonna hold my breath, though).  I was also thinking that it was the most epic of them all, and really made a good ending to the VN.

 

Please tell me you aren't talking about the good end   I thought Hisoka's route itself was okay, but it was blown out of the water by the bad/normal end, whatever you want to call it.  Wasn't quite on the level of G-senjou's bad ends, but it was quite the feels injection.

[Kosakyun]

Please tell me you aren't talking about the good end   I thought Hisoka's route itself was okay, but it was blown out of the water by the bad/normal end, whatever you want to call it.  Wasn't quite on the level of G-senjou's bad ends, but it was quite the feels injection.

 

I thought it was decided that the neutral end was better.

[Kurokusari]

Almost seems like they were setting it up for a sequel (not gonna hold my breath, though).  I was also thinking that it was the most epic of them all, and really made a good ending to the VN.

 

Please tell me you aren't talking about the good end   I thought Hisoka's route itself was okay, but it was blown out of the water by the bad/normal end, whatever you want to call it.  Wasn't quite on the level of G-senjou's bad ends, but it was quite the feels injection.

A sequel would be good. Although something with just the same setting could also work out.

 

I had more pity rather than feels in G-senjou's bad ends. That and a bit of anger for the MC.. Like whut are you doing?

I thought it was decided that the neutral end was better.

It's more of a unanimous decision haha

Well the good end didn't have that much impact tbh. It's pretty hard to believe that a few lines in the ending could make the route this good.

[Turnip Sensei]

Almost seems like they were setting it up for a sequel (not gonna hold my breath, though).  I was also thinking that it was the most epic of them all, and really made a good ending to the VN.

 

Please tell me you aren't talking about the good end   I thought Hisoka's route itself was okay, but it was blown out of the water by the bad/normal end, whatever you want to call it.  Wasn't quite on the level of G-senjou's bad ends, but it was quite the feels injection.

I almost feel like refusing the existence of the good end, it was that disappointing. 

 

I want a sequel/fan disk

Where Akihito&Co. are going around as superheroes. They had that set up already in the ending.

[Kosakyun]

Well the good end didn't have that much impact tbh. It's pretty hard to believe that a few lines in the ending could make the route this good.

 

It basically disregarded the fact that people couldn't be saved from stampedes. Or that Hisoka was stampeding. Or that the situation was increasingly desperate. That was utterly unimaginable, Noiz reconnecting to Nomad after being able to survive whatever happened to him and then dying because lol. I can accept Kagome's case because she's special. Hisoka's was very luck-based, and felt really forced. Wow, so she was saved because her other partner came and reconnected after the avatar stampeded? Wat. Well, it's the creator's world. So he can do whatever he wants.

[Kurokusari]

It basically disregarded the fact that people couldn't be saved from stampedes. Or that Hisoka was stampeding. Or that the situation was increasingly desperate. That was utterly unimaginable, Noiz reconnecting to Nomad after being able to survive whatever happened to him and then dying because lol. I can accept Kagome's case because she's special. Hisoka's was very luck-based, and felt really forced. Wow, so she was saved because her other partner came and reconnected after the avatar stampeded? Wat. Well, it's the creator's world. So he can do whatever he wants.

Well at least they didn't use some sort of convenient magic. This was is a bit more believable albeit really luck-based as you said. I already forgot the mechanics of how avatars work so I can't give a more convincing explanation on this one. But did Noiz really die when he was supposed to be have been 

killed? I do remember something like he made it in the nick of time but that's more of a miracle since he died right after saving Hisoka. Well it also works somewhere along the lines of redemption so I was fine with that miraculous ending.

 

But bad end still best woot.

[TehRealOne]

Noiz got shot and his connection to Nomad broken. 

Doesn't that mean he was dead?

But then he comes back to life?

That is the only thing that I have against Hisoka's route.

 

But Mayu Mayu is still best route, Kagaome's might have been suspenseful, intriguing and exciting but I prefer the kinda half normal life style, half school protagonist part of Mayuki's route.

To better explain, its how it has casualness(Not seen in Benio's, Hisoka's and Kagaome's) but some actual action and plot(Unlike Ayaya's).  

[Fred the Barber]

Noiz got shot and his connection to Nomad broken. 

Doesn't that mean he was dead?

But then he comes back to life?

That is the only thing that I have against Hisoka's route.

 

Well, "dead" is a pretty tricky concept to nail down, and it's unclear exactly what makes or breaks the connection to an avatar. For instance, if someone is asleep, is it possible for them to "load in"? Perhaps not. Not trying to make some deep point here or argue about details, but rather, I'm just saying there are enough unexplained elements that I can let this explanation slide.

 

Anyway, I wrapped up Heroine 4's route today, and will pick up with Heroine 5 next week. I might reread the whole common route first... we'll see how I feel after a week away from the game.

 

I don't really have much to say about Heroine 4 - it was mostly sweet, though that second H scene was... weird. One thing that made me happy about both Heroine 3 and Heroine 4 routes was the heavy use of the best BGM song I've heard in the game so far. I'd previously thought it was being really underutilized, since I'd only heard it once or twice, but after those two routes I realized they were just saving it for the right moments, since it came up all the time:

[TehRealOne]

. One thing that made me happy about both Heroine 3 and Heroine 4 routes was the heavy use of the best BGM song I've heard in the game so far. I'd previously thought it was being really underutilized, since I'd only heard it once or twice, but after those two routes I realized they were just saving it for the right moments, since it came up all the time:

I concur

[Zenophilious]

I had more pity rather than feels in G-senjou's bad ends. That and a bit of anger for the MC.. Like whut are you doing?

 

It's more of a unanimous decision haha

Well the good end didn't have that much impact tbh. It's pretty hard to believe that a few lines in the ending could make the route this good.

But that's why they were so awesome!  Bad ends aren't bad unless they're fucked up, in my opinion.  Having the protag/heroine die randomly gets kinda old.  Anyway...[/tangent]

 

What I liked best about it was

the part where Akihito is pretending that she's not in a coma, and that she's agreeing to marry him.  I knew that it wasn't really happening, since we all knew that you can't un-stampede someone (unless you're Kagome and overpowered as hell), and the contrast between reality and what he wanted reality to be was just so heartwrenching.  It was also one of the few times Kagome suppressed her true personality in order to help Akihito, and that also had a pretty big effect on me, since we all know how selfish Kagome is.

  That ending really made me wish there were more bad/neutral ends in Comyu; bit of a shame there's only one, really.

[Kurokusari]

But that's why they were so awesome!  Bad ends aren't bad unless they're fucked up, in my opinion.  Having the protag/heroine die randomly gets kinda old.  Anyway...[/tangent]

 

What I liked best about it was

the part where Akihito is pretending that she's not in a coma, and that she's agreeing to marry him.  I knew that it wasn't really happening, since we all knew that you can't un-stampede someone (unless you're Kagome and overpowered as hell), and the contrast between reality and what he wanted reality to be was just so heartwrenching.  It was also one of the few times Kagome suppressed her true personality in order to help Akihito, and that also had a pretty big effect on me, since we all know how selfish Kagome is.

  That ending really made me wish there were more bad/neutral ends in Comyu; bit of a shame there's only one, really.

Well they are called bad ends so making them slightly less than good wouldn't cut it. Still, I didn't like 'em. Grisaia's bad ends are also screwed up but I'll stop here.

 

Stahp the feels. I think it being the only one in the whole VN also makes it count. If they put up more neutral/bad ends then it might feel less special imo.

[Nimbus]

I'll give my final thoughts on Comyu now. Before you read let me pre-empt all the replies to this by telling you to mentally add the phrase "but it's better in the final route" at the end of all of my criticism.

 

Comyu is perhaps the most disappointing vn I have ever read, not because it's bad but because it could've been so much more than what we've been given. What I mean by this is that we have been given an amazing and fascinating world but Comyu doesn't do anything with it. We see practically none of Caesar's Legion beside Caesar himself (and even he is underused), we get very little insight in the practical side of the Round Table and We don't even see much of The System. Comyu spends so much time on slice-of-life stuff that we don't get to see enough of Comyu's unique world. Don't get me wrong, the slice of life stuff is still good and entertaining but if given the choice between reading about a "super-detective's" school life and a giant metallic black dragon I'm inclined to choose the latter. If I were to equate it to anything it would be those First Person Shooter where in the final level there is mass carnage and a huge exciting battle going on in the background but the player is only tangentially related to it.

So what did I like? If I'm honest, just bout everything else. Characters were definitely Comyu's strongest point for me, it is home to some of my favourite side-characters such as Izawa, Haru, Gasia and Tainwen. That being said there were a few misses with characters. I've already my opinion on Kogame (very monotone) and I found Akihito wasn't very likeable he was a hypocrite, I didn't care for his particular ideologies and he was a little inconsistent. Mayuki was my favourite heroine because reasons (and yes I understand the irony of liking her the most when she best personifies my first complaint).

The fight's between avatars were incredible. the writers nailed the imagery and succeeded in making me picture the fights in my mind, though it would've been nice if the avatar sprites matched what was being told. The soundtrack was also really good, I never found it boring or repetitive so that's a plus in and of itself.

Overall I really enjoyed Comyu and was glad I replayed it. But it could've been so much more.
I may have forgotten to mention something so feel free to ask my opinions on anything I missed.

[Kosakyun]

Well, "dead" is a pretty tricky concept to nail down, and it's unclear exactly what makes or breaks the connection to an avatar. For instance, if someone is asleep, is it possible for them to "load in"? Perhaps not. Not trying to make some deep point here or argue about details, but rather, I'm just saying there are enough unexplained elements that I can let this explanation slide.

 

I thought that whenever you were in range of your avatar to be loaded in, you're automatically loaded in. Though I'm not really sure about that since there isn't any scenario where I can compare your hypothetical situation to. Consciousness might be a factor in being loaded in, yes, because you control your avatar based on each of your wills. I would think that you'd need to be conscious to actually provide a will for the avatar to load in. I'm trying to think of something to prove that point. But at the moment, I can't think of anything.

 

I still cannot find a valid explanation for whatever Noiz did to reestablish his connection. I was thinking that his heart stopped momentarily though, leading whatever's controlling the connections to think that he's dead, breaking the connection. 

 

The fight's between avatars were incredible. the writers nailed the imagery and succeeded in making me picture the fights in my mind,

though it would've been nice if the avatar sprites matched what was being told. The soundtrack was also really good, I never found it boring or repetitive so that's a plus in and of itself.

 

That was probably my biggest complaint, if there were any. 

[Zenophilious]

Stahp the feels. I think it being the only one in the whole VN also makes it count. If they put up more neutral/bad ends then it might feel less special imo.

I'm kind of a feels masochist, so I would've liked more really depressing ends.  Kajitsu's and G-senjou's bad ends made me love the really, really depressing, heartrending stuff (as long as it's not the only end), which is why I loved Hisoka's normal end so much.  I agree that more would have made it feel less special, though.

 

I thought that whenever you were in range of your avatar to be loaded in, you're automatically loaded in. Though I'm not really sure about that since there isn't any scenario where I can compare your hypothetical situation to. Consciousness might be a factor in being loaded in, yes, because you control your avatar based on each of your wills. I would think that you'd need to be conscious to actually provide a will for the avatar to load in. I'm trying to think of something to prove that point. But at the moment, I can't think of anything.

 

I still cannot find a valid explanation for whatever Noiz did to reestablish his connection. I was thinking that his heart stopped momentarily though, leading whatever's controlling the connections to think that he's dead, breaking the connection. 

I don't remember exactly how he was described as dying, but I remember him being obviously dead in a way that made it quite impossible for him to have survived in any fashion.  I think it's just your typical deus ex machina, really.  I wouldn't think too much about it, deus ex machinas rarely make sense.

 

The fight's between avatars were incredible. the writers nailed the imagery and succeeded in making me picture the fights in my mind, though it would've been nice if the avatar sprites matched what was being told. The soundtrack was also really good, I never found it boring or repetitive so that's a plus in and of itself.

That was probably my biggest complaint, if there were any. 

Have to admit, reading that various avatars lost limbs, only to see their sprites unaffected in any way kinda bugged me, although I understand why they didn't have damaged sprites for each and every fight.  Still kid of disappointing, though.

[TehRealOne]

I'll give my final thoughts on Comyu now. Before you read let me pre-empt all the replies to this by telling you to mentally add the phrase "but it's better in the final route" at the end of all of my criticism.

 

Comyu is perhaps the most disappointing vn I have ever read, not because it's bad but because it could've been so much more than what we've been given. What I mean by this is that we have been given an amazing and fascinating world but Comyu doesn't do anything with it. We see practically none of Caesar's Legion beside Caesar himself (and even he is underused), we get very little insight in the practical side of the Round Table and We don't even see much of The System. Comyu spends so much time on slice-of-life stuff that we don't get to see enough of Comyu's unique world. Don't get me wrong, the slice of life stuff is still good and entertaining but if given the choice between reading about a "super-detective's" school life and a giant metallic black dragon I'm inclined to choose the latter. If I were to equate it to anything it would be those First Person Shooter where in the final level there is mass carnage and a huge exciting battle going on in the background but the player is only tangentially related to it.

So what did I like? If I'm honest, just bout everything else. Characters were definitely Comyu's strongest point for me, it is home to some of my favourite side-characters such as Izawa, Haru, Gasia and Tainwen. That being said there were a few misses with characters. I've already my opinion on Kogame (very monotone) and I found Akihito wasn't very likeable he was a hypocrite, I didn't care for his particular ideologies and he was a little inconsistent. Mayuki was my favourite heroine because reasons (and yes I understand the irony of liking her the most when she best personifies my first complaint).

The fight's between avatars were incredible. the writers nailed the imagery and succeeded in making me picture the fights in my mind, though it would've been nice if the avatar sprites matched what was being told. The soundtrack was also really good, I never found it boring or repetitive so that's a plus in and of itself.

Overall I really enjoyed Comyu and was glad I replayed it. But it could've been so much more.

I may have forgotten to mention something so feel free to ask my opinions on anything I missed.

I guess a reason why they focused on ordinary life quite a bit was because the MC didn't exactly want to have an extra-ordinary life, 

I remember that Ahikito came back to Takakura city to escape from killing his mother's murderer and live out an ordinary life(quote: "To not make anymore connections")

But yeah, the whole comyu world was left mostly unexplored, and the sprites were really misleading. 

[Nimbus]

Have to admit, reading that various avatars lost limbs, only to see their sprites unaffected in any way kinda bugged me, although I understand why they didn't have damaged sprites for each and every fight.  Still kid of disappointing, though.

It is a bit of a stretch to demand they change sprites for ever fight so I guess it's a compromise we have to make.

[Kosakyun]

I don't remember exactly how he was described as dying, but I remember him being obviously dead in a way that made it quite impossible for him to have survived in any fashion.  I think it's just your typical deus ex machina, really.  I wouldn't think too much about it, deus ex machinas rarely make sense.

 

It's like you said that Kagome didn't make sense at all.

 

It is a bit of a stretch to demand they change sprites for ever fight so I guess it's a compromise we have to make.

 

It was really too bad. At least we have imagination. And at least the CGs kinda matched descriptions.

[TehRealOne]

It was really too bad. At least we have imagination. And at least the CGs kinda matched descriptions.

I think the last fight with sting on Kagaome's route had changed CGs at the end. 

When they showed Babylon with half of its head gone.

[Kosakyun]

I think the last fight with sting on Kagaome's route had changed CGs at the end. 

When they showed Babylon with half of its head gone.

 

Yup. Well, the CGs in the action scenes were the ones that really excited me. I couldn't wait to see one.

[TehRealOne]

Yup. Well, the CGs in the action scenes were the ones that really excited me. I couldn't wait to see one.

[Ventares07]

I've never posted on here so idk if there any rules, but I wanna share my thoughts on Comyu cos that was one frustrating visual novel.
I thought it was rather disappointing. My biggest problem with was it had really dark themes discussing revenge, justice, human nature. But the writers decided to throw sex jokes every second along characters that did not meet its ideas like loli or big titted maid. The conlict in the overall tone whether it was serious or just a joke was so frustrating
Was I the only one who thought Mayuki and Ayaya's route was waste of time, it did not contribute to anything plot wise. The only reason i finished the VN was because of the Kagome, her story somewhat redeemed the bad aspects of the VN.
I just wish the story took itself more seriously. Comyu had some much potential but it didnt come out bad, it was ok, it could've been so much better.

 

Sorry for the rant

[Kosakyun]

Contrary to some of your opinions, I thought that its frequent switching from dark to sex jokes to comedy and then back to the action again was really nice. In the first place, I didn't expect a continuously darkening atmosphere for the visual novel because of the prologue shown to us at the start of the visual novel. I do think that most of those jokes are in line with the characters' personalities, and have no effect whatsoever on how things go by. Why, those jokes are important in reinforcing the idea that Haru seldom falters in front of impending doom that they frequently face. I thought it was a nice touch. Most of these 'dark themes' recur inside the minds of the characters anyway. It is, in a way, a method of making the characters appear stronger than they should be, given how they're acting in a specific situation.

 

Also, I enjoyed Mayuki's route a lot. Sure, it didn't contribute much to the overall plot, but each route is a separate story anyway. They each have their own plots. Mayuki's and Ayaya's are prime examples of plots where Akihito wasn't dragged into whatever major's happening in the Comyunet. In a way, he was able to retain his 'everyday life' by a certain degree, oblivious to the fact that there are uprisings happening in the city. He played no major part in the fight for power, giving whatever plot those two routes had a 'sense of calmness and everyday life'. You could also notice that you barely see Caesar's Legion and the Round Table in those routes.

[Ventares07]

Yes I can agree with most of your points, perhaps its simply my personal taste. Although speaking of Caesor's Legion and Caesar, was I the only one who thought that he had too little screen time? After the first route I was simply expecting more.  

[TehRealOne]

Yes I can agree with most of your points, perhaps its simply my personal taste. Although speaking of Caesor's Legion and Caesar, was I the only one who thought that he had too little screen time? After the first route I was simply expecting more.  

I think that the majority of people feel that way, Gasai needed more screen time, there was so much I wanted to know about his past, how the legion would be when Gasai finished taking control.

On your other point of the conflicting themes, 

I don't really see why they're bad, to me it makes it feel more realistic. Someone's life can't just be full of dark, melancholy themes like revenge, justice, etc,etc, there has to be a balance.

[Nimbus]

I just thought of another criticism I have with Comyu that is somewhat related to this.

 

The writing in Comyu was pretty annoying at times

Two instances were this stands out the most are Akihito's constant references to the "gentle kingdom" and how he is constantly bringing up the colour red. I mean seriously, he is reminded of the colour by the most irrelevant things!

The other instance comes up mostly in fights. Akihito will give up and resign himself to his fate only to say "but so what?" This is fine but he does this with every fight, so often that whenever he gave up I just said to myself "Akihito, you and I both know you're just going to say 'but so what?' and get on with the fight. We've done this dance before so quit bringing it up."