Seraphim
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Finished up Raging Loop a couple of days ago and now I'm done with chapter 6 of Higurashi.
Raging Loop
Like I mentioned in a previous post, I'm not that into werewolves, which initially put me off when I considered reading this VN, but I'm glad I actually decided to pick it up. The pacing of the story felt just right and the story itself turned out to be a more exciting read than I expected, with quite a few twists and turns right up until the end. I did see through some of them long before the reveals, but everything leading up to that point was so well executed that it felt satisfying nevertheless.
I really appreciated how you, after clearing the game, unlock a toggle in the options, with which you can activate a ton of internal monologues mixed in with the normal dialogue and narration to get a better understanding of everything that's going on and why certain people act in certain ways. It's a function I'd love to see in Higurashi, to be honest. And so, while we're on the subject...
Higurashi, chapter 6
First off, I agree with @Dreamysyu that this is the best chapter (so far, at least). Anyway, onward to spoiler territory.SpoilerThe intro screen of the chapter said that the difficulty is zero, but I don't entirely agree. It's definitely more straight-forward than the previous chapters, but there's some confusing stuff here too. For one thing, Rika is only getting more mysterious. We hear her conversing with some person/entity/whatever that we haven't been introduced to yet, and there are several scenes with her acting much more grownup than her appearance suggests. I'm reminded of a horror movie I watched a few years back, where a malicious child turned out to actually be an adult with some rare disease that made the body age at a significantly slower rate than normal. Then again, she actually says herself that she's over a hundred years old. She claims to have died countless times and retained her memories of that, and if that's true, her mental age would obviously be much higher than her physical one.
In any case, things seem to point at Rika being somehow involved in Tomotake's unusual death. We're told in this chapter that he was apparently injected with something, which Rika later revealed that she knew about, and there's also the fact that she tried to inject Shion with something in the previous chapter. (Also, when she ended up injected with it herself in chapter 5, she proceeded to cut out her throat, much like what happened to Tomotake.)
However, I honestly have a hard time accepting that Rika, however mysterious she may be, would murder someone. If she actually did, there's probably some underlying reason behind it.
For the first time, Keiichi actually mentioned that he remembers events that only took place in other chapters, and I'm not sure what to make of that yet. It could be a parallell world scenario, like I briefly mentioned in an earlier post, but that wouldn't explain how he could have memories from those worlds. Then there's this internal monologue, which makes it seem like Ooishi clearly remembers things that have happened in other chapters, but there are some inconcistencies to this too, like how he seems to barely know who Keiichi is, although he should know him quite well by now if his memories are in fact retained. Another discrepency is why he, if he actually has memories from several timelines, doesn't hide and watch over the area where Tomotake gets killed. If he knows it's going to happen, it seems inopportunistic or even downright stupid not to use it to his advantage. (The same could be said about any other major events he possibly remembers.)
So, Takano.
In a mystery story such as this, it's pretty easy to get stuck in an overanalyzing mode where you just assume that every small piece of information is part of some grander scheme, but if you look at the situation objectively, that might not necessarily be the case. Earlier this week, before I started reading this chapter, I was hit by the thought that rather than Takano being possessed by some supernatural entity, a person involved in some major conspiracy or some other nonsense, maybe she's just an occult writer, going around Hinamizawa collecting information and inspiration for her stories. At the very least, we learn in this chapter that she's written a whole bunch of different stories about Hinamizawa.
The contradiction about her attending the Watanagashi festival while already being dead in an oil drum was pretty much tossed aside as a mistake during her autopsy, and I guess that could explain that part, no matter how unsatisfying a solution it is. It wouldn't explain why she gets murdered, though. Honestly, I wouldn't put it past her to, in a spectacular fashion, stage her own suicide in such a way that it looks like murder, just for the sake of enhancing the mystery and her stories.
The whole Hinamizawa parasite theory. Was it just some mindfuckery for funsies from the devilish Takano, who seems to enjoy messing with people oh so very much? I'm honestly not sure. There are a lot of nasty parasites out there, but it seems a little farfetched that an entire town would be affected by one to this extent.
It conveniently fills in a lot of gaps and it's certainly more plausible than the notion that there's an actual curse at play, but it could also just be a ruse to make the reader get caught up in Rena's delusions.
That said, there's usually an ounce of truth at the core of conspiracy theories, so maybe the existence of the parasite is actually real, while the part about the three houses master plan, UFO invasion and grand revival of the Oyashiro faith isn't. Actually, if everything turned out to be just a delusion, it would mean that Chapter 6 doesn't bring much relevant additions to the overarching plot, and that seems a bit odd for a part of the answer arcs.
There was one thing that I didn't like in this chapter. If the Chapter 6 explanation of the events at the end of Chapter 1 are actually true, it means that during Chapter 1, the readers were deliberately fed false information for the sake of enhancing the mystery. In my opinion, that's an extremely cheap and uninspired form of storytelling, which I think Higurashi should be above based on what I've seen so far.
Basically, it would mean that you can't really trust any information the game provides you with. If it's fabricated and presented in a way that differs from what's actually happening in the scene, there's just no way for the reader to see through it and it effectively renders the act of making conjectures more or less pointless.
As a consequence, despite being the most interesting chapter so far, Chapter 6 has lessened my opinion of the series as a whole, and Chapter 1 in particular. I just hope it will somehow redeem itself in the final two chapters.
Some random thoughts:
I've entertained the idea that there's some meta element at play here, like maybe the person playing the game is actually resetting the timeline whenever he or she starts playing a new chapter, and then some characters (Rika, in particular) have retained memories by somehow accessing information from the other chapters. (I guess I'm thinking this way because of a certain other VN I read recently.)
I recall a scene during Chapter 1 where there was an offhand remark about a person with seven personalities, and I've been thinking that it might have been some early foreshadowing. Curiously enough, Keiichi, Rena, Mion, Satoko, Rika, Shion and Satoshi equals seven. Well, I'm really just pulling this out of my ass and I'm probably way off the mark, but even if those aren't personalities of one and the same person, which they most likely aren't, it wouldn't surprise me if at least one of the characters in the game suffers from multiple personality disorder.This turned out to be one of my longest posts here so far, but maybe that's not so strange considering the extent to which Higurashi puts the mind at work.
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I wonder if they're still working on Hyourin, which they announced at the end of 2018. Haven't heard anything about it since, so maybe it's been abandoned by now.
I'm all for a VN store with a dedicated client where all localization companies could come together and distribute their games, and while I don't know if Hyourin was supposed to offer such an extensive service, the initial announcement definitely caught my interest. -
There are some references to what happens in Chaos;Head, but other than that, it's an original story that stands on its own.
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Nothing quite screams "gem" like the first coming of the titty spider.
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That actually sounds preferable! Some of the stuff in Higurashi feels a bit repetitive because they talk about it over and over again in each chapter. It's not too much of a bother, but I think there's some room for improvement/streamlining.
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5 hours ago, Silvz said:
The only thing I'm diisliking is how the MC constantly says he is worthless, a nobody, etc etc.
I think that's pretty much a side effect from a lack of confidence combined with him putting Miyuki on a pedestal. Even if he'd start actively improving himself, he'd probably still feel like he can't reach her level, and that in turn makes him feel like he's more useless than he actually is.
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4 hours ago, Silvz said:
Oh, and play Umineko after it.
Yup, that's the plan! I've been putting it off for years just because people recommended playing Higurashi first due to there supposedly being some shared elements or something. I don't really know any details, but I guess I'll find out soon enough. I've seen a spoiler about Umineko containing
Spoilera time loop,
but I'm hoping that's something that's present from early on, like in Higurashi, rather than some game-changing reveal towards the end of the story.
Other than that, I've managed to dodge any information about Umineko, so it's basically a blank slate for me.
I've also started reading Raging Loop whenever I'm not reading Higurashi. I'm not usually a very big fan of werewolves, but it works well in this case and the story is pretty intense and engrossing right off the bat. My main concern is that my brain might overheat from the Higurashi + Raging Loop Mystery Combo Attack, so maybe I should start considering something like this:
- fujoneko and Mr Poltroon
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Chapter 5 of Higurashi = done.
SpoilerI was apparently right to suspect Shion, and my theory about it not being Mion doing horrible deeds in that torture room turned out to be right on the money. (Well, it was technically Mion since they'd been switched at birth by mistake, but that revelation doesn't really change anything about the whole torture room situation.)
I was feeling a bit bad for Shion and her unrequited love at first, but as soon as she started blaming Satoko for all the problems within the Houjou family, all my sympathies went out the window, and then she just dove straight into madness from that point onwards.
Satoko had to endure some awful stuff in chapter 3, but the torture scene with her in chapter 5 was downright heartbreaking. I'm hoping that isn't the true ending for her, and it might not be, since it's contradictory to some of the other endings. The many contradictions between chapters are actually what I'm most confused about, and I have no idea how they all tie together. I hope the explanation for it all will prove satisfactory.
The characters who currently intrigue and confuse me the most are Rika, with her spot-on prophecies and sporadic Takano-like behavior, and Takano herself, who's basically a living contradiction. Rena's also a bit of an anomaly, with her severe attitude changes and oddly sharp instincts.
Other than that, it was nice to finally get a confirmation that the Sonozaki's weren't behind the incidents (although that effectively means that Shion's victims were killed for nothing). I'd been suspecting that was the case, since it all seemed a little too convenient. As of now, I don't have a clue who the real culprits are, what with all the contradictions and characters frequently exhibiting strange behavior.I'm hoping for some jaw-dropping reveals in the upcoming chapters! Three more to go.
- Dreamysyu, Silvz and Mr Poltroon
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12 minutes ago, Dreamysyu said:Spoiler
I've seen some spoilers that said that she still disappears or something.
I haven't seen it either, but yeah, I've also heard that's the case. She supposedly says something about
Spoilermeeting again in any future VNs you read, where she'll appear as other heroines.
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Same here! The over-abundant sex jokes got kinda tiresome, but other than that, it was a great game. Hoping for some kind of sequel at some point!
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8 hours ago, Silvz said:
These questions show how hard the games are
Yeah, no kidding! There's a ton of information to take into account, some of which contradict each other, so if someone actually manages to figure out the entire mystery simply by playing the question arcs, I'd say they deserve something like this:
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I've had a pretty productive weekend, finishing up 428: Shibuya Scramble as well as reading both chapter 3 and 4 of Higurashi. I originally intended to just read one chapter a week, but chapter 4 is much shorter than the rest so I figured I might as well read that too so I can get started on the answer arcs next weekend.
428: Shibuya Scramble
The story isn't all that interesting on paper, but the way it's presented, combined with the great soundtrack and an interesting and quirky cast of characters, make for a memorable whole. Although I do have to say that, for a completionist such as myself, it was quite a pain to get all endings and jump back and forth in the timeline to find all the hidden content.
My favorite part of the game was after the Mean Clean bonus scenario, when you got to view behind the scenes footage from the recording sessions. After seeing static images with silent dialogue for 40-or-so hours, it made a surprisingly big impression on me to get to see the actors actually play out some of the scenes those images were taken from, along with hearing them speak for the first time.
On that note, I actually managed to find a documentary with interviews with the cast, which I will definitely check out when my Japanese has improved some more.
Higurashi, chapter 3
As I mentioned in a previous post, chapter 3 is called "The Shortest Scenario", but in actuality, it's basically as long as chapter 1 and 2 so I don't really know why they chose to use that tagline.
The chapter itself was... hard to get a grasp on. It was equal parts exciting and confusing, with a lot of new questions raised, likeSpoilerwhy there was another Keiichi attending the Watanagashi festival while the current one was out murdering Satoko's uncle. The events at the festival were seemingly exactly the same as what took place in chapter 2, except that Keiichi turned Shion away here for one reason or another. He still ended up outside of the ritual implement storehouse, which is where she led him in Chapter 2, for some reason, though.
All of these events, including the "demoning away" incidents, could probably be explained by some sort of many-worlds interpretation, but I'm guessing it's not quite that simple. For one thing, it doesn't explain why some of the characters start acting really out of place at times.
Higurashi, chapter 4
By far the shortest chapter of the question arcs, but I imagine that is because it apparently wasn't originally planned as part of the main series. In chapter 3, they refer to chapter 5 as the actual continuation of the story, so chapter 4 is really more of a filler episode. It was still a good read with some well executed and intense scenes, but it falls behind the previous chapters in terms of quality, in large parts due to the fact that there aren't any truly significant developments in the story that we didn't already know about. I also find Ooishi annoying, so him having such a large role in this chapter affected my overall impression. (My opinion of him improved somewhat, though.)
The thing that stood out the most to me in this chapter was whenSpoilerRika's behavior suddenly changed. She started laughing and acting eerily similar to Takano. It's clear from the previous chapters that something's up with Takano, especially considering that she's up and about despite supposedly being dead at the time.
I'm looking forward to finding out what's up with that.
I've been getting exponentially more confused as the story in Higurashi has moved along, so it's going to be very interesting finding out what the hell is really going on.- Dreamysyu and Mr Poltroon
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13 hours ago, Silvz said:
play Steins;Gate 0 after it
I'm still waiting for the Steam improvement patch from Committee of Zero. At this point, I'm starting to doubt it'll ever be released, so maybe I should just go ahead and play the game without it.
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1 hour ago, TexasDice said:Spoiler
The protagonist just decides to date someone and it just happens within 30 seconds.
This was a bit of an issue for me. I like all the girls and the fact that they're fairly normal (compared to over the top tsunderes and whatnot that you find in a lot of other visual novels), but I feel like they really rushed the romance here.
SpoilerAs soon Madoka's gone for good, Shinji's just head over heels in love with someone else all of a sudden, and who that someone is is determined solely by a few choices that seem like they don't really matter all that much. It's kinda hard to buy that Shinji, who previously had been really averse to finding a new girlfriend (for years, mind you), would fall in love with a particular heroine just based on brief interactions in a couple of scenes following those choices.
The end result would definitely have been better and more believable if they had put some more effort into building the relationships before moving on to the next phase.
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Well, to be fair, this particular guess wasn't exactly specific or far-fetched in any way. With people travelling more than ever, it's only natural that any contagious diseases would spread globally at a faster rate than before.
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The intro screen for chapter 3 actually has "The Shortest Scenario" as a tagline and says that the difficulty is "the worst", so I imagine I'm going to be somewhat confused!
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If I were to theorize a bit, I'd say I'm highly suspicious of
SpoilerShion. Mion was acting pretty strange in the torture dungeon at the end, so I'm still not entirely convinced that was actually her. One thing that stood out to me especially was that when she was talking about desposing of Rika's and Satoko's bodies, she was speaking like they were just nuisances to her. Even if the real Mion actually killed them to cover up her crimes, I find it hard to believe she would actually disrespect them post-mortem like that (considering the fact that they used to be friends). Shion, on the other hand, wasn't friends with them (as far as I know), so for her to speak of them like that wouldn't be nearly as odd.
The police found Mion's body in the well, saying she fell down there while attempting to flee or hide, but it could just as well (no pun intended) have been a case of Shion orchestrating everything and then pushing Mion down the well to pin the blame on her and attempt to solidify her role as the culprit.It's going to interesting moving forward and see if I'm right on the money with any of this.
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Done with chapter 2 of Higurashi! I was a bit disappointed by
Spoilerthe twin switcheroo plot twist, since it's been done to death in both movies and games over the years. As soon as you learned that Mion had an identical twin, I immediately figured that at some point, one of them would pretend to be the other. Honestly though, I was actually thinking they might spice it up by pulling a double twist by, rather than just Mion pretending to be Shion over the phone, making it turn out to actually be Shion pretending to be Mion. I was kinda expecting some big reveal in the torture dungeon at the end, along the lines of "Shion" in the cell having Mion's demon tattoo. Shion's attitude was shifting a lot from scene to scene, so I figured she was hiding her real personality most of the time and would use that to her advantage in one way or another, but it never happened. Maybe it will in one of the other chapters. I guess I'll find out soon enough!
Other than that, I'd say this chapter was better and more exciting than the first one, and I'm looking forward to reading chapter 3 next weekend!
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Took 10-or-so hours for me to finish. And yeah, avoid using a walkthrough. There's a high chance you'll end up spoiling yourself, and this is definitely a VN where you don't want to do that.
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There's actually a "Gamer Heroine" tag on VNDb. I don't know how devoted they must be to pass the qualifications for that tag, though.
EDIT: Linking the "Gamer" trait is probably a better idea. -
22 minutes ago, Dreamysyu said:
I'd probably just run it in a windows XP virtual machine. Trying to run older games on newer systems is a nightmare.
I've never had any trouble like this before, though. I've been able to run Moon, One and a bunch of other supposedly problematic games just fine on Windows 10, but if nothing else works, I'll give a virtual machine a go. I don't have any experience using one, but I guess it can't be that hard to set up.
10 minutes ago, Jardic47 said:have you tried deleting the folder and starting the game? I do that a lot and it fixes save issues for me.
Nope, haven't tried that, so I will do so now and keep my fingers crossed I won't run into any further issues!
What are you playing?
in Visual Novel Talk
Posted
This and a lot of other stuff is actually explained if you turn on that toggle in the options after clearing the game. In truth, both him and his ex choose to ignore the fact that they know each other, and it's a pretty funny scene with the internal monologue included.
Yeah, I get that we're seeing it from his point of view, but I think it could have been handled better. There are several situations where the narration clearly states that something is a certain way, like with the needle in the bun. If you're explicitly told that there's a needle there, of course you're going to believe there is. Problem is, as soon as you accept what's presented to you, you derail and any future conjectures from that point onwards will be based on false information.
I think the "protagonist's perspective" kinda ended up acting as a forced plot device here.
I've actually already read Ever17. It was a bit slow, but the story was definitely interesting and I'm intending to read the others in a not too distant future.