Chronopolis

Your mom is awesome.

Japan might actually have a similiar problem, in that many people will have an idea of what eroge is, but probably only those in the know understand that the story and chars is the dominating factor. Using eroge in english is terrible outside the established community because it requires an explanation (ero+game), and then another (well, but there's a lot of ones with really good stories as well!). Plus, the term visual novel is conveniently a lot closer to the medium's technical definition. As for what the medium is capable, of course the format can support english language and story structure. As for naming conventions, I would go for: Visual novel (mostly thinking about Japanese VN's, but can also be them as a whole), and western visual novel (with the explanation that visual novels first became a thing in Japan).

Firstly, thanks Ren for making the thread. Encourage and making accessible more discussion is never a bad thing.

Unless your clephas, there's enough good stuff to last a bunch of years. Just way more trash. But honestly, when I might get tired or run dry of the VN medium, I'll have (japanese) novels to go to. Going by other peoples' recommendations of course. People say the medium is very underused, but it's kinda hard for me to imagine what those VN's would look like. Well...putting experimental works aside, it would be awesome if VN's were more diverse in structure (pursing stories that are supported by structures other than route-herione). Clephas, do you have any ideas on what currently-underutilized constructions (plot+presentation+structure) would make for great VN's?

I think the sentencing was reasonable. If canada stance is to per-emptively ban possession (of lolicon as well as CP), then they are merely enforcing that. (I agree that possession of CP should be an offense, because possession encourages distribution and production.) It might have the defense's lawyers maneuverings (silly trial system), but the judge's sentencing seemed like it was made in consideration of the fact that he already has a fair chunk of his life ruined. (being forced to live separately from foster children, etc. It's a one-size-fits-all precaution, but probably with this type of risk, it's far too late after the fact; in addition, the public wouldn't tolerate the government not doing this if such an incident broke out.) The counselling is probably a good thing. That being said, having let it be found by a student leading to being fired, is not so strange: the usb could have contained a number of other comprising details and still resultant in termination.

The art looks very nice. If the character (ct. pure moe) element is strong enough, it looks like an emotional ride I'd enjoy. Free fantasy element too!

Ah that makes sense. I've actually had a fair amount of experience reading CYOA's from the touhou fandom (there are choices after most updates, and the readers vote. People reading after the fact (like me) just read the resultant story.). If the story is light/comedic with a high degree of freedom, the presence of choice gives the CYOA a game-like feel: you pick what seems fun and interesting. In a serious story...if details about the protagonist are provided, the presence of choices IMO just gives a sense of agency: the MC's confusion and dilemma's are yours, but the MC still is a person if their own. To really be good self-insert, I think you need a reasonably serious situation (to avoid the game-feel), choices, and a narrative that always emphasizes that it's *you* in the position. Ie. second-person is mandatory. Gamebooks are a thing and are pretty much what I described: http://www.reddit.com/r/gamebooks . I'm not sure how immersive table-top role playing is in practice...there's probably some strong parts (constant high degree of freedom, environment can react profoundly). If you get into the scenario and your character, RP is probably one of the most immersive setups.

I have felt this in novels, (but also in some VNs) anywhere where the characters importance/ties to each other are heavier then their appeal to me the reader. Basically anywhere where I've been attached to the characters but not blindly doting one of them. Of course it's difficult to appreciate a romance of two people if you are just being attracted to the character in question. Recently, my impression of self-insert VNs has been that they are too bland. (To really self-insert I feel like I would have to actually write my own identity / struggles into the narrative, which is obviously impossible). I rather have a real protagonist with their own struggles. You can still get very close to the protagonist's position if you feel their emotions and irritation, and make an effort to look at their struggles from their vantage-point. It would be less likely though if you couldn't relate to or be convinced by the protagonist. When I think of an otome game, while I do feel a bit protective of a female protagonist, I also am interested in the male cast. Because they are emphasized, I hope they are strong characters, or interesting in some ways. Things that are cliches unfourtantely are still cliches, but there probably are some things to be enjoyed from the different structure of the cast (group of characters).

Hmm, indeed there are a lot of gameplay VN's in the fantasy setting. How many are heavily-story focused though? For wish fufillment, I meant like LN's with a powerful protagonist who just is cool and wins, like SAO, or a lot of others. Not the romantic or sexual aspect of wish fulfillment. RE: NTR: Ah, I see. That makes sense, kinda.

I've mostly forgotten what it's like being new to vns (though I'm not veteran by any means)... I think when I first played VN's I loved it when each VN would suck me in, and I wished for each story to have a huge payoff at the end (be it emotionally (katawa shoujo), or plot wise (ever-17, steins gate, g-senjou no maou). Now, besides for enjoyment, I play to see what VNs are "about". If it's a simple concept, then how the scenes and characters are layed out. If it's a complex subject matter, then that itself. Saya no Uta is oddly enough a good starter VN for anyone who can tolerate the material, because it's has a very strong impact on the reader (who is unlikely to have encountered the combination of music, sfx voice, and text) One thing I've noticed about VNs as a genre is that there are extremely few fantasy novels. Also, the premise of a self-insert character/wish-fufillment oddly, seems to be uniquely a LN feature.

Find why you read VN's and then find a VN which you know interests you enough. Then deal with procrastination and inertia and read it. I reccomend Midori no Umi. Easy read which doesn't take much effort, but different enough setting to be somewhat novel and interesting. Also has some atmosphere, a VN staple.

It's on the easy end. You could read it as your first VN, about N3 grammar and you should be set.

Soshite Ashita no sekai Yori is my wholehearted req for VN's depicting a protag-parent relationship, but it's lacking a translation

You can look at someone's face. Hear them speak. Feel that they are looking towards you (the MC, but even without self-insert it's a similiar perspective). Gape in shock at a scene, while at the same time having lines of inner narrative passing by.

Never. I've often tended towards marathoning near the end of series, but I think I will plan not to do that in the future. The reason is when I marathon like that, I'm so conscious about "is this the end? end?", and feeling like drowning in so much text, that I don't think I enjoy the final chapters as much as I would with a fresh mind.

Well, I was playing more but eventually cut back and settled on Itsuka, Todoku , Komorebi, and Evolimit for 1-2 hours a day a piece, which was fine and dandy for a while, but some other event interrupted that schedule and I didn't come back. Reading Gore Screaming Show atm. I'm on my third route (Konome's), maybe a third into it. I want to finish so I can read the god damn explanation analysis, but I also know I'll need to read up on some Norse Mythology around then, which makes me hesitant to restart. I think Futami's my favourite herione, the nuanced and yet heartfelt relationship between the MC's and Futami is moving to watch.

Depends on the subject matter. When I'm hyped for a VN or in super study mode I will only play it. If the VN is strange and foriegn to me, and isn't developing that fast, AND I don't feel like marathoning it, then I will play multiple VN's at once, until one of them gets going and sucks me in. It happened that one time I did that, all the VN's I played were intellectual/literary/slice of life/unique, so the number of VN's I was reading at the same time exploded. Number of VN's played at a time, over time (very roughly): 2.5 years ago 1----0------1-2----1----------0---------------------------------- 1.5 years ago 1------1-------1--------1-----1-----2-------1-----2------1-------1-----3---5--6--5--4--3--0---1----.now

Beat that stupid standard daily world from weeks ago. It turns out the Demon Lord isn't that bad once you have a good weapon and some DPS going. He went down in 2 fights. I gave it some thought and did leveling and item management a bit better. 2 levels in mountaineering really helped, though also running into 2 goddess statues was word for word, a godsend. This was the first time I got confusion effect on a weapon, it's really quite good. Clear Stats: Mah, it's a totally newbie play, but man yes! success! Died once by mountaining into a dragon...From a previous play there were so many mountain and corrupted zones from 800-1200. I think without going heavy mountain a 2000km world clear would be somewhat difficult without any towns.

Well, technically my first was Clannad, but I got like a in-game day in before I stopped. My actual first was Subarashiki Hibi, after seeing it's OP . My Japanese was around 1200-1500 words, Genki 1+2 at the time, so rather than being able to pick up grammar on the fly, that was the VN where I got lots of practicing using Jparser, and breaking down sentences and saying "oh this is a verb, noun". Most of the text is fairly simple, but the VN was inexplicably bizzare. Mah, it still left an impression and was interesting in places, even with all the mindscrew. Played for about 3 months, about half the novel (up to somewhere in Insects) before dropping the novel. Since it's popular and highly regarded work among intellectuals, I'll probably skim through the read parts and finish it one day.

Probably the VN us VN players are use to are different the VN's that could become more prevalent (they are long, character and route based). You don't have to immerse the reader in the protag's view. You don't need to use first person. You could tell the story in third person, like a picture book fairy tale. You don't need multiple routes, etc, etc. There are a ton of ways to use to the VN medium. Although, I know there are quite literary japanese writers who are attached to writing for the VN medium. In those kind of VN's, the text and the text context holds significantly more weight than the other elements. In that sense, VN's are like a different kind of canvas for writers. The writing style you use for VN is a bit different (just for ADV, you can practically do whatever you want in NVL style). We probably won't see those kinds of really deep literary vn's in the west because those writers would have to learn about the VN medium and take a liking to it.

for(int i = 0; i<100; i++){ std::cout << i - 100 << std::endl; } Mm just took 30 seconds to think about.

Never a more self-indulgent post lolol. Clephas, you need to stop writing your thoughts verbatim. To OP, I haven't really played KEY novels so I wouldn't know, but I'd recommend Soshite Ashita no Sekai Yori, and Midori no Umi. I played them as my 2nd and third VN and quite enjoyed them, even though I struggled with some of the non voiced parts. (was N3 level). The link in my signature has a list as well, but those two are probably the easiest out of them.

Princess :3. I beat normal with the duelist, force user, and hero. Tried forever to beat one of the daily campaigns with the knight, but the world had like no towns after a few hundred miles with tons of corrupted zones and mountain ranges. Was trying to get to 1000 miles to get an ally but it turns out thats only in the plus version ._. Got to 1300 miles. At last I concluded it was really difficult and gave up. Even when I level up properly, the dragons are really hard to deal with.

Itsuka, Todoku, Ano Sora ni. Slightly harder than Muramasa if you ignore the latter's politics scenes and few very archaic scenes. The whole thing isn't consistently hard, but Itsuka Todoku is more flowery and vague in places. Rui tomo is pretty shitting hard too, for completely different reasons. Everybody speaks in varyingly indirect ways, and there are tons of jokes. You should really see the list in my signature.