Thoughts on anime/manga that are used for LN promotion.

[madvanced]

Fuwans, I have come to ask you for your thoughts on what seems to be a growing tendency, that is to use either a manga or an anime for LN promotion only and never give the adaptation a satisfying ending(among other things).

Even though they might sometimes be a good idea in terms of business practices(in which I don't really agree with this argument, but it does exist), I find them to be utterly disgusting to a reader.

 

You are investing your time to the way you want to experience that work, and then you are given a complete lie. All that adaptation amounts to is a shallow (non) representation of what the work really is. In my opinion this should also be offensive to the author himself, to see his work being degraded so much in the name of advertising.

 

Well these are my somewhat negative thoughts on the matter. I'm looking forward to see what all of you think about this.

[Vokoca]

While not every (ongoing) adaptation is this bad, as the more popular onces actually are lucky enough to continue rather than getting cut off, ths trend bothers me a lot as well. It has come to the point where if I find an anime that looks interesting but is an adaptation, I actually opt to not watch it and go for the original instead, just from the fear of the lack of conclusion - or in the worst case, the adaptation that only serves as some sort of a teaser to what the story actually is.

 

While I'd love more works with actual endings, it's probably impossible thanks to where the medium is right now. With adaptations being made before the original is even finished - and with so many that only the really popular ones get to live on and continue - there might be no other way, but that doesn't mean I'll happily watch them either.

 

Besides the rare good adaptations, I only just really watch original anime works at this point.

[mitchhamilton]

Spice and Wolf, The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzimya, Okami-san and her Seven Companions. just a few off the top of my head, but i hate it as well. especially with Spice and Wolf.

[Kosakyun]

I'm just here, still waiting for Index III.

I'll answer after 5 or more years of hoping.

[Nosebleed]

Wait isn't the point of every anime adaptation of an ongoing series to advertise the source material?

It's sad but it's not like you can do much.

Give an anime original ending: fans get pissed because it didn't follow the source

Follow the manga: fans complain it's incomplete

Make an original anime: pray to god you have a good writer and director on board

In essence, unless you fully adapt the source material, you can't win.

[InvictusCobra]

In essence, unless you fully adapt the source material, you can't win.

[madvanced]

Wait isn't the point of every anime adaptation of an ongoing series to advertise the source material?

It's sad but it's not like you can do much.

Give an anime original ending: fans get pissed because it didn't follow the source

Follow the manga: fans complain it's incomplete

Make an original anime: pray to god you have a good writer and director on board

In essence, unless you fully adapt the source material, you can't win.

[Nosebleed]

That's a case by case thing, i often like watching anime of manga i love just to see a different side of it.

But if i don't like the manga that much i probably won't check out the anime.

I know, I'm not saying that the fact that it is an advertising is bad(although I'd prefer if it wasn't).

 

My point is that a lot of works get butchered. There are a lot of cases of ongoing LNs that have manga adaptations barely even touch upon the first arc and they end like after 10-15 chapters, just for LN promotion sake.

 

This is the kind of thing that I'm condemning.

[madvanced]

That's a case by case thing, i often like watching anime of manga i love just to see a different side of it.

But if i don't like the manga that much i probably won't check out the anime.

[Snowtsuku]

Since I read LNs, VNs and Manga, I just take it as a recommendation of some sort. To be honest, anime the one I enjoy the least so I'd rather have the story in another media.

[Nosebleed]

That's the very problem. Since this has been happening to a lot more adaptations, at least on the manga side, than a simple minority.

 

The fact that they then make the purpose of the adaptation be it's downfall accomplishes exactly the contrary effect.

[madvanced]

I don't think they purposely try to make it a downfall, they're probably just really clueless on how to direct a show and they just want to make a quick buck.

 

I don't think it has the opposite effect because if it's good, people will be interested in continuing with the source material, and if it's bad, people will be interested in reading a better version, assuming the source material isn't bad..

Don't forget Japan makes anime for Japan, not for westerners, so you're really out of their target audience because Japanese people can just go grab and read the source material whenever they feel like it and generally speaking a lot of people don't have the same standards we do, and unless it's aphallingly bad *cough* Mekakucity Actors *cough*, it'll likely sell decently well, and thus the cycle continues.

 

There's not many alternatives to adapting a LN/Manga aside from making sequels and sometimes it just doesn't sell well enough to award that and we just have to suck it up.

Making anime is really expensive (in the millions of dollars per 1 cour), so you have to understand the business side of things and cut them some slack.

It's just like how western movies are always worse than their book counterparts. Capitalism yo.

 

That and some studios just don't care *cough* JC Staff where's Index 3 *cough*

You are missing the point I'm trying to make.

It's not that they are bad adaptations in itself, it's that they barely scratch the surface on their source material and what they do covert is slightly butchered.

The types of works I'm referencing are those adaptations, that literally work only for the advertisement of the original work, and don't even try to gain any foothold on another medium with the adaptation they made. Hence, the so called adaptation, becomes something that shouldn't even be representative, in any way, of the original work.

 

That's why I talked about the face that the very thing they are trying to make(in terms of purpose) is what turns people off.

 

Most of the references I'm making are even more on the manga side rather than anime aside, so budget is not even the problem there. I just added anime to the topic because those also happen.

 

In conclusion I'm not bashing adaptations, rather they can be a good thing, but when they become a shallow non representation of their source material, is what leaves a lot of people with a bad aftertaste. Unfortunately that's growing trend and it's what I was touching upon with my arguments.

[Nosebleed]

But that's kind of a general problem in every medium, an adaptation of anything will always only be a fraction of its source material.

 

There's barely any adaptation works that have surpassed their original source material, this trend is something I don't think anyone can easily break.

 

But okay I understand you're focusing more on works specifically designed with the sole intent of advertising the source material without much effort put into it. But even then the same logic applies, even if they had a good budget and a good writer, it will likely never be as good as the  source.

 

And if it is appalling, then so be it, exposure is still advertisement in the eyes of capitalism, and that's their goal here.

 

Why do some manga volumes sometimes include an OVA? Because of exposure, even if it's a shitty 10 min short, exposure is exposure, and sales will increase, even if by one costumer.

 

 

I'm not in any way saying i support bad adaptations, of course I abhor them, but I am saying I understand why they do what they do and since I'm not their financial director, I can't really speak much against them.

[madvanced]

But that's kind of a general problem in every medium, an adaptation of anything will always only be a fraction of its source material.

 

There's barely any adaptation works that have surpassed their original source material, this trend is something I don't think anyone can easily break.

 

But okay I understand you're focusing more on works specifically designed with the sole intent of advertising the source material without much effort put into it. But even then the same logic applies, even if they had a good budget and a good writer, it will likely never be as good as the  source.

 

And if it is appalling, then so be it, exposure is still advertisement in the eyes of capitalism, and that's their goal here.

 

Why do some manga volumes sometimes include an OVA? Because of exposure, even if it's a shitty 10 min short, exposure is exposure, and sales will increase, even if by one costumer.

 

 

I'm not in any way saying i support bad adaptations, of course I abhor them, but I am saying I understand why they do what they do and since I'm not their financial director, I can't really speak much against them.

Well I also said on the very first post that I understand the business side of it. Even if I don't agree with it personally, it's not something difficult to see.

But what I'm indeed trying to touch up is those adaptations with little to no effort, I mean I never expect an adaptation to surpass the source material, the only cases of it are rare.

 

I just think that such adaptations, not even to the works themselves, but to the medium as a whole, do more harm than good. This may be seeing ways in too grand of a scale, but it's what I feel like. However as it is with anything, it's my own personal, and subjective, take on it.

[Nosebleed]

I can think of one anime that was such a poor representation of the source material, that half of the fandom actually abandoned the bandwagon over how shitty it was.

And that anime is Mekakucity Actors.

 

It was produced by Shaft, one of the better anime studios out there, with a good budget, yet it butchered the story so badly it was unrecognizable, and even I as a Kagerou Project fan felt like I was backstabbed by such atrocity.

 

So I guess I do know of some cases where it's just too bad. Although I will say this particular case would fail anyway due to how the original Kagerou Project storyline is built which would have never worked out in a 12 episode anime series.

 

Generally speaking though these adaptations tend to adapt some more meaningful parts of the source material, and sure they fail at adapting the interesting bits and actually managing to immerse you in the setting, but they still more or less show you what the source material can probably provide, they're just cheaply made I guess.

 

It's quality vs costumer acquisition vs budget. Each studio will balance these in a different way.

 

I still think it's shitty though, just like you do and I believe studios should always make the effort to showcase what the source material really is about, but sometimes costumer acquisiton takes the cake over quality.

 

Wether they do more harm than good, well, it depends on what we define as harm.

If you define harm as losing profit, then maybe not so much, but if you're talking about general stigma, then I guess it does harm the industry in some ways. But we live in a world where standards keep dropping and dropping and eventually everything will just be random moeblobs.

 

So I guess there's only one thing left to say here

 

[Down]

It's not like every adaptation out there are bad. It's obvious there'll be bad adaptations though.

 

And the main reason is probably that for god knows why there doesn't seem to be more than a handful of people capable of handling a script in japan. Lots of issues just come down to bad decisions from the production committee for one part and poor handling of the episode scripts (which are often done by multiple people to gain time, explaining why it works pretty bad) for another part.

[Nosebleed]

There's also that. Staff are very important and I'm sure these crappy adaptations have at least 50% of blame to put on their staff.

 

I mean, just look at what happened to Aldnoah.Zero

You get Gen Urobuchi to write you an awesome concept, and then you find someone else to direct the series and then you get a piece of steaming horse sh*t.

[sirjabberwock]

In a quasi-related affair, the manga for Aiyoku no Eustia awoke the feels and left me hangin'

 

Never again! 

[Tesla]

I both love and hate them at the same time. On one hand the anime will probably make me interested in a certain series, but on the other a lot of the time it ends when it gets good. Then to top it off sometimes the anime went farther than what is translated of the light novels/manga. One example would be Engaged to Unidentified, I loved the anime to death but the manga isn't very far at all TL wise. 

[Abyssal Monkey]

While not every (ongoing) adaptation is this bad, as the more popular onces actually are lucky enough to continue rather than getting cut off, ths trend bothers me a lot as well. It has come to the point where if I find an anime that looks interesting but is an adaptation, I actually opt to not watch it and go for the original instead, just from the fear of the lack of conclusion - or in the worst case, the adaptation that only serves as some sort of a teaser to what the story actually is.

 

Besides the rare good adaptations, I only just really watch original anime works at this point.

[madvanced]

You've basically ninja'd my thoughts.  The only difference is that I don't find it entirely that worrying.

 

Manga is extremely bad for this, I can agree, but anime not so much.  Even if they decide to animate a single cour of 12 episodes, unless they completely strip/spin it, you will get at least two volumes of the light novel animated.  For advertising purposes, this is pretty good, because if your book hasn't stated the premise and at least started rolling by the end of the second book, you've flubbed and need to rethink your premise.  Honestly, if two volumes doesn't hook a reader, nothing down the line will.

 

Really, its been a trend lately to half adapt things, and use anime and manga as a marketing platform for not just light novels, but themselves as well, and that discussion would be a different thread.  There was also a thread about anime original endings, so it should be obvious that that topic is indeed in a different thread.

That's why I based my argument more on the manga side rather than the anime side, as I said before, I only included anime because there also some cases of it. But this has been happening in such a disgusting manner regarding some manga adaptations, that I just couldn't help but feel like it doesn't do anyone any good.

[Abyssal Monkey]

That's why I based my argument more on the manga side rather than the anime side, as I said before, I only included anime because there also some cases of it. But this has been happening in such a disgusting manner regarding some manga adaptations, that I just couldn't help but feel like it doesn't do anyone any good.

Really, I can only ever see the LN promotions in manga as one season anyway.  As an outsider's perspective of someone who only reads scanalations and not actually buying any magazines, my best guess is that they are only temporary fillers used as advertisements for a season.  Having no idea how they are actually laid out, I would assume they would fill in the same area as one shots or as seasonals for when a series takes a hiatus. If you take a look at them that way, I really can't find any fault in them.  Sure you can make the argument that an original manga could take it's place, but if it's ultimately temporary, any original wouldn't last that long anyway.

 

As my personal input, even though the art can be atrocious sometimes, it seems Mahouka has done fairly well as a manga so far, with at least up to book 8 being adapted last I saw of it.

[Nosebleed]

The problem with manga is how it usually is an incomplete and often inconclusive work in comparison to its LN version which ultimately kinda sucks.

 

I'm not one to fuss over art, I've read really ugly stuff before so i don't care much, but monthly manga publications of a light novel can be incredibly frustrating, especially when you reach the end of it and realize it doesn't adapt everything.

 

I'm not sure why they do it, although I understand the appeal of it, I prefer manga over light novels just because I find it easier and more fun to read through, so I guess that's the kinda demographic they try to target?

[Down]

Manga adaptations are often sub-contracted works that are given to often young authors who often can't get themselves serialized otherwise, and don't necessarily care about the source material. Hence the result.

[Guest]

Well that my be true most of the most as you say, but LN's aren't very appealing to as many people as manga and Anime are.

 

And to counter what you say, I'll give two example of successful manga adaptations :

 

Boku wa tomodachi ga sukunai drawn by Itachi, which is as good as the LN if not better because I think manga serves the story more than the LN does.

Toradora, which has a flawless anime and a really good manga too.

 

Of course I could expand the list.

Maybe these are not a correct representation of the original work, but if they do a better job because the new media support does a better job at making the thing work (drawings, music, etc.) then I don't care if the original isn't the same.

 

But as you say, some are complete failures. In my opinion,often an anime can do what a LN does better in most ways.

So there are three reasons explaining why an adaptation can be bad :

- The LN is bad

- The animation studio doesn't give a shit, the anime is used just as a promotion

- The story isn't adaptated to anime format.

 

In my opinion, it's 40/40/20.