Berilium Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 Oh i see. Thanks for the answer. I was kind of worried about that but i'll cross that bridge when i get there. Funny thing: i seem to remember how to draw the kanjis when i read the word but i am struggling when is the other way arround. Hope is not because i suck a this lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 nah it's somewhat common at times. Recognition with other way around might come eventually, but it's not exactly guaranteed. that said, you learn to identify parts of the kanji with the method, so you can at least analyze whatever you see... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephisto Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 If you know all the Jouyou kanji then I honestly think you won't have much difficulty at all reading VNs (at least the kanji. The grammar / hirigana "words" might fuck you up.) Hell, even if you only knew all of the "elementary school" kanji you would do pretty damn well on most VNs. The Jouyou Kanji are much better than the random stuff that the Anki thing for Heisig has, as I see them all the time. (While I can't particularly recall seeing many of Heisig's words in there, although sometimes they are) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 All jouyou kanji are literally the kanji list Heisig uses. ...At least close? I got the impression he had all of them, but wikipedia says otherwise. lemme see what the book says... "The 2,200 characters chosen for study in these pages [...] include the basic 1,945 general-use kanji established as standard by the japanese Ministry of Education in 1981, another 60 or so used chiefly in proper names, and a handful of characters that are convenient for use as primitive elements. In 2010 another 196 kanji were added to the list of kanji approved for general use, 39 of which had already been incorporated into earlier editions of this book." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arturia Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 Hmm, Been on and off with things and Learning Kanj is one of them, I really want to continue but i had my own doubts of learning this way, BUt i dont know of any other that can help me at the moment..I think i will go Heisigs way till i do go to Japan, THen i will learn it when it comes naturally you could say..Anyway, I hope you all do well aswell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxidian Posted April 16, 2014 Share Posted April 16, 2014 I went 20 mins through the first 2 lessons of RTK just for trying, t's fun like the meaning he tries to imply in kanji like gallbladder are over the retard but still manages to instill the kanji in your mind... maybe I should start it seriously, the problem lies more in "seriously" than in remembering all the kanji sadly >_> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berilium Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Update on my study: 322 kanjis and increasing every day. I still have problems with some of them but I think it will solve itself with time. It's easy to learn them but it seems it will be hader when I need to remember a lot more =_= Besides I still have problems reading the Kanji itself and the Internet font (the little one) usually changes the strokes in some specific Kanjis (why?). I have no problems with the big font whatsoever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Increase font size and they generally look better. Welp, at 771 kanji for the RtK method. Doesn't include the ones I know visually like 俺, 僕, 様, 気 or even the ones I'm pretty confident I can write too like 花, 私 etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berilium Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Is there a way to make Anki show the Kanji and then flip to the word? Like that I can learn the other way around as well and It will help me a lot >.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Heisig basically strongly recommends against kanji -> story/word practice. The idea is that youll get it eventually anyway. It works... decently, but not always. Tl;dr read the sections between lessons guys, it's actually interesting (though he takes his time before he tells you....) Personally I encounter jp text daily in some form and try to read what little I can. I guess that's the only practice I'm getting though, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berilium Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Well, it was not my intention to neglect story/word practice but to try to indetify the kanji and associate it with the meaning. Why it is not recommended review them the other way around? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxidian Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 just for knowledge, the purpose of RTK1 is just making you remember visually the kanji, the book doesn't help to remember how to write at all right ? I'm done with lesson 5 (98 kanji) and I use obenkyo to write them after ending every lessons, up until 4 evey kanji was easy to draw, now with 5 I find easy to read the kanji, but drawing them isn't that easy since as lessons go on the stories for kanji-keyword get more and more abstracts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 I always write each kanji down when I study unless I'm really lazy that day. I think Heisig even advises you to write the kanji down once (and for some primitives, a few times) when you initially memorize them. He also says that it's a shame if you don't practice writing them as well somewhere. I'm not sure on exactly what page he writes this though, so it could be ahead of where you are. The book provides stroke order and everything. Why would it not be a guide to how to write them as well? Oo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxidian Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 what I meant is, rtk helps recalling a word fast when you look at some kanji, but not the other way around where you write the kanji from the word. I find the first easy and the latter harder (not much for now, but will soon probably), but it may be just me who is bad at that sort of thing. Btw I usually write them down more than once Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephisto Posted April 18, 2014 Share Posted April 18, 2014 Heisig's method is simply grinding kanji rather than learning japanese... which isn't good. Unless you magically understand how the kanji is used just by looking at dictionary definitions, it's really not a good method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berilium Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 Of course it is simply grinding kanji. I wasn't expecting learning the book and then jumping to a VN =_= Or do you recommend that we learn grammar parallely to Kanji? It is going to be quite hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arturia Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 I have seen a couple of people mentioning Learning Grammer along side Kanji as that helped them, I am unsure myself as i haven't tried..In my opinion i only have Heisigs way at the moment, But once i am open to the kanji, i hope to learn it better then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephisto Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 In my opinion you should learn the grammar first, and learn the mandatory vocab as you progress in learning grammar (and reading stuff). I don't see the point in studying "vocabulary" that you can't use, and therefore will forget without practicing every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berilium Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 Mmmm...I'll have to see what is best. To be honest I didn't know HOW to start learning Japanese so I started this lesson because I found it instructive enough and I didn't have the knowledge to critiziced in that way. Thanks for the recomendation, I'll have it in mind but I will focus primarly in this lesson because I don't want a mess with my order because probably I will end up losing my motivation and that would have been for nothing =_= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arturia Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Well, I was going to ORder Heisigs book, But Amazon charges so much just for the SHipping, and its unfair that i dont qualify for free shipping..So i dont kno wwhen i will be able to get that book, unless i can find another way of geting it.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 ^ I got my copy through a local (Swedish) e-tailer myself. You could check, though I guess south africa might not have the same kind of infrastructure lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funnerific Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 In my opinion you should learn the grammar first, and learn the mandatory vocab as you progress in learning grammar (and reading stuff). I don't see the point in studying "vocabulary" that you can't use, and therefore will forget without practicing every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwertymann Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Hey there! I decided today after finding this thread I will also start learning Japanese! HOORAY! ... but, there's a slight issue. Since I'm poor at the moment, I plan on using the 5th edition book and tried obtaining the 5th edition deck for anki... but the link is busted. I'm going to dig around on a bit to see if I can find something, but as a heads up, you might want to replace that as well. I'll edit if I find anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berilium Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I still have the deck with me. Let me upload it and I will share it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.mediafire.com/download/13tg8v8obg8973e/Heisigs_Remembering_the_Kanji_13_with_2010_joyo_kanji.apkg In another topic, I have reached 500 kanjis learned (487 specifically) I feel nothing... 1500 more to go... Hurray! ._./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwertymann Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Thank you! You are a hero, gentleman, and a scholar! Incidentally, I couldn't find anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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