PiggiesGoMoo
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Posts posted by PiggiesGoMoo
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10 hours ago, Stormwolf said:
How is it though? I'm still playing chaos child, but i'm planning to play this next, unless it sucks of course.
I'm 2-3 hours in and it's good so far. It has a reasonably paced introduction and transition into potentially more serious stuff. I'll make a more detailed review when I'm done.
As for the translation, there are some liberties taken it seems, but not so much that it becomes a giant meme IMO. I don't think the translation changes the personality of the girls in any significant way... but I only know some Japanese, so take that for what it's worth.
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Dropped Inganock, the story and theme is just not my thing. I didn't realize the story would be so strongly steampunk. Still, I have to give credit to the nice art style and atmosphere.
I started reading Swan Song instead for another post-apoc story, and I like it a lot. Lots of interesting inner monologues by characters. Tanomura is as manly and great as people describe lol.
Also some surprisingly funny dark humor (this is a drunken rant):
EDIT: Considering what happens later, I don't find that rant very funny anymore
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9 hours ago, r0xm2n said:
Finished Princess Evangile.
Wonder what I'm going to read next.....
Just noticed Hapymaher is on discount on MangaGamer. It wasn't really on my radar ..... but it seems interesting....
I'm back after a long VN Hiatus. Speaking of Hapymaher, I kinda blame that game for making me burned out by VNs for a while lol. It really felt like it took the worst of VNs and amplified it, just so many convoluted and unnecessary scenes in my opinion. On the other hand, maybe I was due for a burnout, since I was reading only VNs for a good 3-4 months.
I'm reading Sekien no Inganock now. So far, it has reminded me why I like VNs as a format. It really pulls you into the world just by the sound effects and visuals, while also making you use your imagination. It has some nice exposition like a manga would, without cutting out details like an anime. Yet it doesn't have the lack of immersion that a manga might have. Best of both worlds, you could say.
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4 hours ago, Tamaki Sakura said:
Let the market develop naturally.
I think VN's will get more and more animation as the market develops, which will help. Eventually I even think that the standard practice of reusing sprites will become a dated feature of VNs, and they will have more animation instead. I say this because I think people put a lot of value on the visuals of VN's, and there are definitely companies that have improved their standards over the years. Like anime, at a certain point the quality will be high enough to where it will break into a western audience.
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Reading Danganronpa 2. It has a lot of entertaining characters, and the trials have all been really good so far (and really sad and dramatic in some cases). I must say though, I find myself rushing through free time to get to the trials, and not bothering to buy gifts. I don't really like the clear delineation between "free time" and "oh no someone got murdered" in the game, it makes the pacing seem predictable... Like "oh it's a free time day? Welp, I guess nobody is getting murdered." Still, I think the trials make the free time worth doing.
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17 hours ago, r0xm2n said:
Finished Sorcery Jokers the other day. What a ride and a half that was! That VN had some rather profound themes too.
Asahi best girl (I just love how bold she is). While Ruu is ..... unforgettable (that scene when the tables FINALLY flipped on her was crazy extreme!).
+1 Asahi best girl. You like Michiru and Asahi... you my friend have good taste!
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At chapter 3. I don't think the gameplay mechanics compare to something like Kamidori Alchemy Meister, but Evenicle definitely has a major pacing advantage over that game. You can speed through combat scenes and encounters if you want by just holding CTRL. It even speeds up movement on the minimap. There's even an auto-combat mode. Pretty nice. I also think there is more dialogue in Evenicle than in Kamidori, at least on a "percentage of time playing" basis. I'm not sure I'd rate it higher overall than Kamidori, though. The romance is very rushed by comparison. I guess that's because Kamidori is less of a "nukige" than evenicle.
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Lazy fight scenes. Honestly I wish more VNs would just use a manga-esque style for fight scenes. Funnily enough Cartagra does the "manga-style fight scenes" (I haven't read KNS 1 or 2 yet, maybe they do too), and it looks great. Of course, this demands more on the part of the artist(s). More broadly, I guess I'm asking for more artistic effort when it comes to these scenes, in whatever way it can be done.
The "lazy" type I'm talking about are where CGs are reused, and the fights involve text and "colored slashes" on the screen, plus sound effects. This is the style in a lot of the highly rated VNs. It even includes some very action-scene oriented VNs where you'd expect there to be more artistic emphasis on the action. This problem might be because of budget issues.
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Funny that you mention Subahibi, I actually thought there were more "unjustified fanservice" h-scenes in Subahibi than in Grisaia. Sure there are h-scenes in Subahibi which fit the plot, but there are several I can think of that definitely don't.
With Grisaia, all of the character arcs are romantic, and the romance leads to the h-scenes, so I'd say the h-scenes are "justified".
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I was playing Utwarerumono. So far it's pretty decent, and I've heard the sequels are top notch. However, I'm now discouraged because I found out that the sequels are PS4/Vita only.... I thought I'd be able to play them on my PS3. The funny thing is that I actually developed and published a Vita game in college for a senior project, but I don't own a Vita
I guess I'll switch to another game for now.
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6 hours ago, ittaku said:
"How many" or "How... many"? Subtly different question.
The percentage that do
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I'd be curious to know the percentage that make them optional. Seems like some of the newer ones do, like Chrono Clock and Sorcery Jokers.
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Have been reading Grisaia. I'm really impressed by the writing in all of the slice-of-life scenes. Not just the humor, but in the way that it explores the depths of personality of the characters. That includes the common route. So far I've done the routes of Makina and Amane, and am currently in Michiru's. I saved Sachi and Yumiko's routes for later because I was very curious about WTF is wrong with Michiru... a very unusual character lol. Michiru's character + route might end up being my favorite. The only character I find kind of uninteresting is Amane, although her route is very riveting (it felt like I was reading a totally different VN).
I also read Cartagra recently, and it was decent. It almost felt like I was reading a nukige, with all of the very short routes and h-scenes. Looking forward to KNS 1 & 2.
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I think the steam audience is pretty clueless about Moenovel. Posts on the steam forum might help, it can spark a chain reaction.
By the way, Moenovel's If my Heart had Wings has sold quite a few copies according to this: https://steamspy.com/app/326480
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Reading Cartagra. Nana looks like harry potter. She's also very annoying. These two in combination make her a very unlikeable character
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Finished Umineko. I ended up ditching the VN near the end of episode 7 for the manga, because I was losing patience and had a lack of emotional investment in the story... not that I didn't enjoy many parts in the story. I heard that the manga has more plot points answered. I also heard that the extra information that the manga reveals is canon, as Ryukishi07 himself confirmed. I didn't want a wishy-washy "figure it out yourself" ending for a visual novel that took me weeks to read, so I had to read the manga.
I was really surprised by the manga because it felt like an improvement from the VN in many ways. Much more dramatic, with crazy character expressions and illustrations. The only thing missing was the music, and color. In hindsight, maybe I would have enjoyed the story of Umineko more had I read the manga. The ending is very satisfying and surprising.
Regardless of the format, there are some things that bother me about the story. I felt much less tension and investment in the characters than I usually do for a serious story like this. That's certainly true compared to Higurashi. Higurashi had piss-your-pants levels of tension, at least for me. I was sweating like crazy while reading the first episodes of Higurashi. That didn't happen once while reading Umineko, and I don't think this lack of thrill is because I'm getting burned out by VNs, or even my high expectations. I think it's because of the nature of the plot of Umineko:
SpoilerGiven the "meta" element of the plot is revealed very early on (right after episode 1), the "so what?" factor is very strong. Once I learned that each episode is going to be Beato's game to outwit Battler, the events that happened in the next Beato "games" were much less emotional to me. Why should I care about what happens to the characters if Beato is just making up stories based on a real event? As far as I'm considered, the characters depicted in Beato's games are just reenactment mannequins, with Beato's twist on the reenactment. It puts you in the strange position where you have to question literally everything you see on screen. You watch people laugh, cry, and get murdered, and lots of crazy magical fights, but none of that matters. The only thing you're thinking is: "Ok, what's Beato's angle? What is being hidden here?" I've read other VNs that hide real events behind fake hallucinations, but it's totally different when you know that a meta-character is deliberately doing this to fool you.
This really hit home in episode 2, which is very early on in the VN. You see all sorts of magical craziness that you know is probably not real, and that takes away from caring about what's happening. Why should I care if imaginary Kanon defeats imaginary demon bulls with magical powers that you know are only there to try to mislead you? There are hours and hours of this type of content throughout the story. This lowered tension and emotional investment a lot for me.
We know that people died on the island. So seeing them die again doesn't leave much of an impression, except in the "why is Beato doing this over and over"?
Now you might make a philosophical argument against my complaint here. That is, "all characters in stories are 'mannequins' to the author's control, so why is it any different when Beato does it within the game? The author might try to mislead you as well." The difference is that the reader is voluntary engaging in suspension of disbelief to enjoy the story, and has an unspoken "agreement" with the author that there is a real story happening, and that story is totally separate from the author, even if there are plot twists. In contrast, if you find out that what you are reading is just being controlled by a meta character, then everything you see is only meaningful insofar as to how it relates to the meta-character.
E.g. I'm not thinking "wow Shannon and George are such a cute couple" during their beginning date in episode 2. I'm thinking " Why would Beato show this? Why did Shannon destroy that mirror? What does that represent?" To the story's credit, the answer to that question is very clever. Like I said, the ending to the story is undoubtedly good. It's just that there are long portions of the story that are tedious for the reasons I've given.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think meta plots and meta characters are inherently bad. I just don't like it when the majority of the story is knowingly a farce created by meta characters. Most of the other VNs with meta-characters that I've read don't do this as egregiously as Umineko.
I think it's interesting to compare Doki Doki Literature club and Umineko (Doki Doki spoilers):
SpoilerIn my view Doki Doki Literature Club has the same "meta" problem as Umineko, except that Monika actually "owns up to it". As mediocre as I thought Doki Doki was, at least an interesting point was made about meta characters. Since you know that Monika is manipulating the characters, literally rewriting their "files" in the same way that Beato uses "pieces" in her game, why should you care about any of the characters except Monika? And that is EXACTLY what she tells you. What was the point of doing the other club members routes, if they are essentially bots that she is directly controlling?
You can apply Monika's logic to Umineko. Why should I have attachment to the tragic events in Beato's games, since I know she is the puppet-master trying to crush Battler's will?
That said, there is one major difference here. The Rokkenjima massacre was an actual event that happened, but Beato's "games" don't accurately represent how everything happened. Whereas with Monika, there is nothing "real" about anything except Monika.
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14 minutes ago, Swim Swim said:
Can read and understand japanese, for non-jp speaking there is simply lack of VNs to read.
Is that really still true? I have a list of like 30 plotge VNs to read, and they're all translated.
Hey, maybe this is an answer to OP's question. An experienced VN reader is someone who has read enough VNs to complain about the lack of translated VNs
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Not my type of VN, but I think the intro song is good. I haven't heard this type of intro sung in English very often:
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4 hours ago, Weiterfechten said:
This feature is in Higurashi When They Cry.
Umineko has it too.
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20 hours ago, Homufate said:
Most of that will be easier to understand once you keep read through the story. For short explanation with least spoiler for what would happen later in story as much as possible (still a bit spoil so if it not bother you not much, you better to read this after complete the whole story)
1. Battler denied that the whole Rokkenjima murder could be happened by human not magic in real world. There's difference between meta world and real world, he didn't deny that magic doesn't exist in meta world but rather real world. The game/kakera (parallel world) that presented was alternated by Beatrice and executed as fantasy scenario. Battler have to proof to that the scenario could works by mystery genre without fantasy element. With that in mind, his point that Rokkenjima murder could be happened by human still stand. I's a bit break the 4th wall if that make you understand it any better.
2. Probably neither but simulation would be closer. The characters that presented in the gameboard were piece but that doesn't change that they're real people and couldn't act out of characters. There's two types of red truth, one is the type that only refer to the scenario in their respective episodes and the other type that refer to the whole Umineko story. In your case of ep 3 it's rather the former. Rokkenjima murder DID already happened so technically Battler and his family are already death in real world but from Meta Battler perspective in the context of story if he accept that Rokkenjima murder happened by witches not human then Beatrice would be able to play with his family with her scenario as much as she want and she would really be the cause of Rokkenjima murder since the most anti-fantasy mind person in Ushiromiyas accepted her to exist.
Keep in mind that Umineko is the game between Ryukishi and readers, Battler while have his own actual personality is the transition of readers who have to believed that Rokkenjima murder could be happened by human while antagonist aka Beatrice on the other hand would denies that it could only be happened by magic rather than human. Basically anti-fantasy vs. anti-mystery. Realistically Battler point is the truth (anti-fantasy) but the problem is "howdunnit" which he have to explained to Beatrice's alternated fantasy scenario that could be happened without fantasy element.
3. The same with my #1 and #2 explanation. If you keep read through. A lot of things will be easier to understand and make more sense.
I'll read that spoilery bit later on, thanks for the response.
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Am near the beginning of episode 3. Something about the whole plot has been bugging me very strongly. I haven't finished the story though, so rather than any spoilers, all I want to know is if what's bugging me gets answered later on. Or, I want to know if my logic is faulty somewhere. Anyway, here goes:
SpoilerDoesn't the fact that Battler saw the corpses in episode 1 mean that if he were to legitimately deny the witch, he needs to assume that the people in episode 2-3 are not his actual family and servants, but are fake, using some form of non-magical deception? Otherwise, he has to accept that the witch used magic to revive them. Given that, the games between Battler and Beatrice are totally pointless no matter the explanation for how the games are created. Take these two scenarios:
1. Beatrice revived them and created the game in physical reality. This means Beatrice's magic is real. Then there is no point to Battler trying to figure out the closed-room mysteries to "deny the witch", because she has already demonstrated her magic by creating the game itself in a physical world, with actual murders happening.
2. It's all actors pretending to be his family and servants, or it is a simulation with no real people. In either the simulation or the actors case, the very murders themselves are in question. Even Beatrice's words "in red" are in question, because when she says things like "Kanon died in this room", she could be talking about people dying in a simulation or movie, the same way I would talk about Romeo and Juliet dying in a movie/play, even though the actors themselves didn't die.
An "it's the afterlife" explanation doesn't work either, because that falls into the "anything goes simulation" category.
So what gives??? Is Battler just stupid, and doesn't realize that just by playing the game, he is affirming that Beatrice used magic to create a "real" scenario where people are actually getting murdered, rather than fake-murdered in a simulation or story she devised?
I also think that my point is true whether or not episode 1 happened in physical reality. Because it's evident that unless Battler is pretending, he legitimately believes that they were murdered in episode 1, so in order for Battler to be consistent, he would have to deny that they were revived in ep. 2-3. And if he denies they were revived, the entire foundation of the game is destroyed, since the murders could be simulated.
As for the seven sisters torturing Battler, and him dying over and over by their hands: based on the way he responds to it, it's feasible that Battler didn't actually believe the torture was happening, and he believed he was in a dream or taking LSD. After all, he would have to believe that if he were to truly deny the witch. So I don't see a contradiction there in the same way that I see it in the "games" Beatrice is playing with him.
EDIT:
I guess I missed a third possibility for the games:
3. Beatrice is so influential, and has an incredibly cult-like relationship to 17 people to the point where they are willing to both dress up as Battler's relatives and servants, as well as actually murder each other in elaborate closed-room scenarios. It can't be demons, because then she would be magical, and again, there would be no point to Battler playing the game. If Battler believed this "cult" theory, then I guess he wouldn't be contradicting himself by playing the "closed-room murder" mystery games wtih Beatrice. But of course, he doesn't believe this theory, and he is apparently contradicting himself by playing with her as I pointed out.
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5 hours ago, FatEdenshaw said:
So I haven't played many VN, in fact the medium has always felt really difficult to "get into" for me. In part I feel like it's because a visual novel feels like such an undertaking, with many requiring several playthroughs to reach a satisfying end.
I think you have the impression of VN's being an "undertaking" because you tried to read Ever17. That's probably the slowest VN I've ever read, and you really have to be aware of that before you read it. Many VNs don't even have multiple routes, they just have a single ending. And of course VNs widely vary in length.
Ever17 also has a sort of "true ending" in the final route, so no, you didn't really finish it.
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16 minutes ago, milkteebaby said:
Anyone played The Letter? I'm going to dive into that tonight, after work.
I'm curious about that one too, there are apparently no reviews posted on it on Fuwa... I only got search results for Root Letter
Hello Good Bye English Release (January 25th)
in Visual Novel Talk
Posted
Even though Suguri is my favorite, I think her route is pretty meh IMO. I'm liking Nastume's a lot more.