edwd2
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Posts posted by edwd2
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nanarin hands down.
EDIT: my runner ups would be: Majo Koi Nikki, Tenbin no La Dea, Dekinai Watashi ga Kurikaesu, Hoshi Ori Yume Mirai, hmm
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Ah, the VN I see Clephas mention every now and then.
Got any impressions of your own on it?posted my thoughts on clephas' thread on that game. it's pretty unique but takes some patience to read. in regards to your post, the protagonist is devoid of certain human emotions, you'll see how that makes things more interesting. mei's route may be what you're looking for
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Devils Devel Concept
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Eustia is pretty good for August standards.
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Please, don't make me say what I didn't say.
- I didn't say that the japanese scene doesn't have any story that are cruel or that has characters that die. Don't misunderstand me. I just said that when it comes to Visual Novels, I have yet to find good examples of japanese VN where the choices you make are more immersive and more moral oriented. Japanese and asian people probably have a lot of good stories depicting moral conflicts and dilemmas, I'm sure of it, but I'm just saying that I have yet to see this kind of dilemmas to be implemented as choices in any interactive story japanese game, whether it is a VN, or a RPG. Again, I'm not saying I have a very broad knowledge concerning the VN and interactive stories oriented games of the japanese scenes, so there might be examples that prove me wrong. And even if some exists (there might), isn't the fact that it's not well known / not famous a sign in itself?
- On the other hand, what I know about, is that western gamers are accustomed to this kind of stories, especially since it became recently the popular trend in the west (and that's my main point) with the examples I quoted. Whether it is series, or even video games, as Valor said on his post "Western games seem to place more emphasize on life, death, morality", and I do see that they are examples of such games/VN that are getting popular. I'm just saying that the apparition and development of games with such a philosophy / system might be influenced by the recent rise of popularity of stories that involve said dilemmas and moral conflicts. And most of all, that it's that kind of stories that might be more appealing on the western scene for gamers.
I'm not trying to generalize about how stories are written in Japan or in the east, and me mentioning western examples of popular series wasn't an intent to compare to eastern stories (and I apologize if it seemed like so).
I'm not gonna go back and quote every sentence in your post containing "japanese", beginning with "especially Japanese ones" in the first sentence, but it's pretty clear that you were forming an OELVN vs JVN argument as you elaborate your primary points, which was quite frankly extraneous. I'll certainly agree that you might know about OELVNs and western culture in general, but If you don't know much about the other side, I'd suggest that you simply leave the whole thing out instead of making bad generalizations. That's all I have to say.
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Then interpret the question as such. "Are openings usually well implemented?" would be how you go about determining if they're 'good' or 'bad'.
Painting with a wide brush is more efficient. You've listed two examples within a subset which we both agree is massive. As with any form of media, the vast majority of VNs are
watered down crapnoticeably similar and simplistic. What this guy's saying is that he is disappointed that the choices present in most VNs are insubstantial. He says himself that he knows there are some exceptions to this.I simply hate replies that accuse OPs of generalising and not taking into account exception X.
I personally prefer more complex MCs whose role I need to take rather than a blank slate who can never actually emulate a real person well enough to provide immersion.
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I haven't played either of these games unfortunately. Also, regarding the rest of your post, I am not trying to actually judge and say "All VN should use this kind of choice system", I'm merely saying that "Wouldn't it be interesting to have more VN that create more involvement for the reader?".
I do like a lot character development, growth and consistency that you can find on most traditional VN. But at the same time, I enjoy a lot storytelling that engages the reader more, for example I'm very fond of the game produced by Telltales. They are quite close to Visual Novels as a genre by nature, and a lot of people enjoys it, so it's only natural to wonder if people think there will ever be VN with such system/gamplay that will ever be created.
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Have you played BSD or Muramasa? Can we not generalize the qualities of certain VN aspects by production origin when they are so diverse in nature? Some VNs are aimed for simplicity, others don't have choices, some are set in casual school settings, where serious decisions aren't always applicable, the greatest decision I've made in my 18 years is probably where to attend college, other than that, most of them are what to eat, where to go, who to hang out with, on a daily basis. Why would it be more appealing to sacrifice character consistency for reader engagement? The common trade-off, If we'll let the readers make major or many decisions for the character, the extent to which the author can define and develop the character is limited to ensure that either decision is plausible. Continuing from that, is reader involvement always necessary? What's wrong with kinetic novels, or novels, plays, movies?
I simply hate threads that generalize very diverse subsets, the other day, I saw a thread that asked whether openings are "good" or "bad", seriously? Depending on how well it's implemented, results can vary widely. As for choices, I'll hold the same argument, we can look at specific cases and how well choices are implemented in a particular novel, given its setting, plot, characters, and how well they fit as a whole, etc.
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None in particular I guess, or overarching ones.
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The OP is simply a feature, it all depends on how the producer implements it.
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All of the above plus others, I can't really put it in words, it's the heroine as a whole.
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comyu, i remember the protagonist sleeping with 3 other women in one of the heroine's routes hahaha.
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you can check out eden*, they're pretty similar
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If you ever learn japanese someday, Shiei no Sona Nyl
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there's really a lot of them, you can look up more specific tags on vndb
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incoming trainwreck
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saw it this morning, 5pb can rot in hell
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we have near perfect PSP emulators on multiple platforms. really no point if all you play is VN.
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Take Steins;Gate, for example. It's a story about a lot of things, inevitability among them. Because the characters are so easy to read, because they are archetypical, you can anticipate what will happen to them - but there's nothing you can do about it. If they were ambiguous, complex (which they actually are, in hindsight), opaque - you as viewer and player wouldn't be able to anticipate and worry so much. They are relatable because of the archetypes, regardless of how realistic they are.
You're confusing something here. Characters not defined by simple types are not necessarily hard to read, and complexity does not imply ambiguity. Well developed and three dimensional characters may take more time to familiarize and understand, that's precisely why the author needs to expose them well to readers and in many cases reveal character histories, inner thoughts and such early on. This is a slight stretch but take someone you know well in real life, yes, they are unique and complex, but can you predict what they would do under certain situations? Probably yes as well, you know their associated personalities, background, and behavior pattern to a good extent. Back to Steins;Gate, having more complex characters does not necessarily result in less predictability, and it will probably boost reader anticipation if done well. The author does part of this by repeatedly defining and affirming the characters through time loops.
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There are very few visual novels with complex characters and plot done well. Most are aimed for relaxation and enjoyment, and given the typical budget, it's naturally easier to write and recycle a script whose plot is simple and built from easy-to-define characters.
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Just finished DDC. BSDX taking too long to download, i think i'll check out koisora first.
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just finished the last route, i'm satisfied with the quite unique ending. overall this game is a bit too chuuni for my tastes, i find the infodumping and some long paragraphs of descriptions extraneous and against reader immersion. as for the "philosophy" and the protagonist's obsessions with keiyakus
and sex, the approach is too bland with the characters, mostly the protagonist, flat out questioning human nature, the act of killing and repeatedly affirming I don't have this emotion, I don't understand that, etc. well that's what i call trying too hard, if anything, they should have left the philosophical implications as an undertone and leave it for reader interpretation and analysis. i'm not asking for a hemingway style narrative, but the author more or less built sora in such a way that eases his job of showing and pleading critical thinking. speaking of the protagonist, he reminds me of Civilization and its Discontents, but if the author is going to craft a largely supernatural world and strip him of fundamental human qualities, his behavior becomes entirely speculation, we cannot analyze much of his questionable behavior if the author has the broadly defined supernatural setting to back his reasoning. i know i shouldn't go too hard on a VN, especially given that this is already a rarity in the medium, i only hope that some of the characters and plot concepts were implemented in a more reserved and realistic fashion. looking at it as an action supernatural VN, it was certainly enjoyable for the most part. anyway, 67/100. -
Clephas: VN of the Year 2014
in Visual Novel Talk
Posted
Well Astral Air was disappointing and actually drove away some devoted favo fanboys. The coloring is getting more ridiculous too. I'd agree that La Dea certainly didn't live up to its expectations, given Eushully's name, though I liked most of the Ikusa Megami series back then. Semiramis no Tenbin seemed pretty generic to me, I was an hour or two in before getting bored, it's still somewhere in my external hard disk though I probably won't bother. I might check out Houkago no Futekikakusha later.