Eai
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Posts posted by Eai
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6 hours ago, sanahtlig said:
Solidbatman gets suspended at least once a year it seems, and I think he was a former moderator (plus he heads FuwaReviews?). And Kiriririri has been temporarily banned from chat multiple times. The difference between them and you is that they're welcome when they return. At this rate, you probably won't be. Moderators can't make people like you. That's up to you. Lashing out at moderation or other members is only effective when you have support from your peers. If you've isolated yourself with rude and disrespectful behavior, as you seem to have, you'll encounter little sympathy and you'll simply further antagonize the community.
My recommendation: Accept your suspension, apologize to the people you've irritated, and move on. Show others that you can participate in forum discussions without being disruptive, and then maybe return to chat in a month or so. If they're still not willing to accept you, then perhaps the FuwaChat community isn't for you. There's no reason to hang around people who hate your guts anyway.
By the way, my point was that i didn't do anything which actually justified a chat ban, and my previous actions on forum are completely unrelated to this matter. It was not really about lashing a moderator after all, but rather pointing out that the decision here was not really justified and not objective. Tbh, i don't really need you to tell me about the fact that if some users don't like me, then a moderator can't do anything about that, but contrary to a 'simple user', a moderator should normally be encouraged to be more objective, and should try to stay impartial in their decisions.
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49 minutes ago, Rooke said:
It wasn't. Remember today's morals were influenced by the Victorians which were a response TO debauchery. Public sex wasn't uncommon in the past, because law and order was terribly lacking in the past. The only rules worth enforcing were those deemed serious enough by officials to warrant punitive punishments (remembering beyond a certain point there was no jail. Jail was just a place to hold you.) Thieves and crime were rampant at night, and the authorities didn't and couldn't do squat, yet sex was punished was it? And remembering there was no jail, only sentences to death or gross disfigurement, exactly what was the punishment for the crime of 'not adhering to the proper sexual position'? The texts religious people sought to put out, which is where you're getting most of your information, and what actually happened were two different things. Which is part of the reason why prostitution was so rampant and accepted.
It goes all the way back to the Roman times, you know. Public orgies were quite common in their mixed bath-houses.
Law and order were different at the time than today, but it doesn't change the fact sexuality was heavily repressed at these periods...a lot of the sexual behaviours and views about sex today will be for sure considered as debauchery or debauched behaviour back in the time...when you say that todays's moral were influenced by the victorian, it is certainly true to a certain extent, but today's morals have also detached a lot from these principles, actually thankfully, a lot of today standards since sexual liberation and the lessening of religious influence over sex were made to break the strict moral codes and repressed views of these victorian morals. There's a reason why some researchers and scholar call today Victorian period as a poisonous period for personnal freedom and liberty. Also this view comes from a 'english related country' perspective, people coming from other parts of europe or the world didn't get influenced as much as american and english by these Victorian morals.
i don't know what exactly your point is, especially by mixing a lot of unrelated things together like night insecurity into middle age an such, but the fact that public sex wasn't uncommon in the past, doesn't mean that they were more 'debauched' than today. if you talk about prostitution and places such as brothels and such, they are still existing today, but now it's mainly hypocrisy, because even if these places exist in the west, now you can't refer them as such. It has become illegal in many countries, whereas prositution can be still legal, and instead of calling them brothels, you call them by 'massage parlors', or other names, prostitution has become 'escort girls' whereas they still are the exact same thing.
As a difference, in Japan, these places are perfectly fine, and are by no mean rare, there is litterally one tokyo district, kabukicho, which is renowned for places like that. I think brothels, and places made illegal is a pointless thing, because that will not stop them to exist, and like you said they exist since roman times.
When i talk about 'authorized' positions, it was about religion which had obviously a very strong influence. Victorian morals were heavily tied with them. Basically that was which defined good morals than bad ones. Of course nobody could be punished for a crime of not having a 'correct' position at the time, but if they could, they wouldn't not have prived themselves to do so. Actually that's why at the time of victorian morals, a lot of people designed objects like the chastety belts in linked in my previous post, in order to guarantee people were conforming to 'adequate' moral standards such as limited sexual behaviour, and prevent them to do 'horrendous things' like masturbating.
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2 hours ago, ratboi said:
yeah :/ Like I can never see something like euphoria ending up on there. Im not banging euphoria btw. Its one of my favorite VNs and tbh I think it isnt just porn for people with those kind of desires to fap to.
Seriously, Euphoria has very strong emphasis on H content...you can't deny it's a game you are not only playing for the story but also (let's say it) to choke you chicken.
Tbh, the story may seems interesting but i'm not sure it would have the same impact if you remove the h from it. there is suspense and background into the game, but i think it's rather the general atmosphere and characters which make people say that it's not only 'porn'. But by the way it is designed with varied fetishes in it, and the way the story is made, you cannot deny the fact you cannot play solely this game for the story...
Also, i think that because a game has a lot of H scenes, doesn't mean that it couldn't have a great story, good characters and such. I think that the fact that visual novel can mix the two (sex and story) is what constitute it's charm, because having the time to know the characters and being involved with the protagonist makes things a lot more erotic for a lot of people...basically a lot of moege purpose are about 'catching' up the girls and finally have sex with them.
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5 hours ago, Justin579 said:
It does vary? Isn't it usually just moaning and slurping noises? And saying "fuck me harder" and "fuck my pussy" and "ohhhhhhhhhhh yaaaaaa" when she cums "my pussy feels good?" etc?
The contradiction is, that in that case it would be a lot more easier to tackle H scenes, because the translation could be seen as simplier, and not the reverse right?
And yes it does vary, but then it depends of the scenes in question...japanese is a language with a very extensive register to express erotical and sexual situations...
2 hours ago, Rooke said:And Victorian morals were a reaction to the debauchery, and (let's be frank) quite unhealthy (disease ridden for example) 'loose living' of the Monarchy Restoration period. Which was in turn inspired by the uptight nature of Oliver Cromwell's puritan rule (puritans ... they do sound familiar. I wonder if any Yanks on the board would know
) These things tend to go around in circles. It hasn't been all that long since we last cycled around.
For all those wondering why public nudity and YOLO isn't a thing, there was a reason why there was a backlash to 'free' living. However these things tend to be forgotten with time.
Well what these people said about debauchery was very probably something which would be considered as perfectly common occurences in our today world... and also it was already influenced by the way sexuality was already diabolized in western countries upon this time: restoration ruler was considered a womanizer, because he had several mistresses at the time, and his court too, but yet it was not really something uncommon at the time and even if they didn't claim it, a lot of monarchs were in that case. as a contrast, countries like japan at the time had the Emperor having official concubines and mistress and as such it was not considered a licencious behaviour... also what they says as unhealthy is probably not the behaviour in themselves, but the general poor hygienic conditions of the time, and of course contraception was inexistant at this period...
sexuality was already heavily repressed at the time even before the advent of victorian morals. Sex was not seen as something which should be considered pleasurable, it had to be done through mariage only, and only one sexual position was 'allowed' and all the other ones were considered wrong and condemnable. For what i heard restoration came up as a period of a little more sexual liberty but it was still probably very very far of today standards...in general Europe was very prude about sex, but i don't think there were worst ones that the englishmen of the time...they were the ones coming up with such inventions as these ones...http://cdn1.historybuff.com/images/2015/10/26102226/Chastity_belt_Heyser_0-1024x963.png
Btw, i'm not even a 'yank' but i do know a lot of the puritans were among the first immigrant to settle into american soil...so a considerable part of american people could have come from these guys...
And to come back to the topic, i also do not understand why they can't allow H content in steam whereas games like gta and others are perfectly fine...like i said, there is a huge demand for eroge there and the likes as Sakura series are only popular because a lot of people don't know there are much better games in this regard...if H content was allowed on steam, then it would be a win-win situation for both companies and players, it would multiply distributors revenues and provide people with what they want...the only ones who will be unhappy will probably be previously mentionned game developpers, because they would have to work a lot harder to bring audience to them if games with superior content quality were allowed on steam. I'm pretty sure the sales figures would be a lot more different
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46 minutes ago, ittaku said:
at they mostly follow a standard pattern of sex and expression which is suited to the Japanese 2D world and nothing like reality
What do you mean? I think sex scenes expressions vary a lot in vn. If you talk about tropes like 'onichan kimochi ii' and such
, then they don't happen all the timeWhy translating H scene sucks? Because it can be simplier to translate it can be easier i think and can be fun.
Not related, but i think positions in porn are not unnatural but they use various camera angles to display the action: i think in vn you can do the same and try different approachs to translate the scenes.
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If these topics appear there time to time, it's because there's actual concerns related to it. It should be permitted to be talked about freely and if you lock the topic whereas there's nothing wrong in it, then it confirm the fact that a lot of people are very sensitive or insecure about the subject.
I have already seen that this thing was real because while reading posts here and in another places, i often see people like translators who says they want to translate some games, but that when they display a lot of H scenes, they dislike it and suddenly it becames a no go. I have seen people say that about the translation of vn like Majikoi S and such. Majikoi scenes might not be the best in vn, but they are still an integral part of the game. So the op point is pretty much valid and it can be seen even in Vn communities
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13 hours ago, Kurisu-Chan said:
Nah, Japan is also very strict about sexuality, IRL they are extremely frigid and prudish...it's just that they have no limit for fictional creations, no or approx no limit.
Japanese can seem prudish about sex, but they are actually not, or were actually not. (At least lot less than western countries at the time). In Japan there's this thing about Public face and Private face concept (omote/ura).
Japan is still a nation who celebrates fertility and other things related to sex through festivals displaying giant erects penis and such. Because in Shinto/bhudism, originally sex was just seen as something completely part of life, pleasurable and which could be celebrated . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanamara_Matsuri
or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hōnen_Matsuri
These things don't exist in Western countries, and i think some people will get offended if it happened. Whereas in Japan it shocks nobody. Also in the past, i heard Japanese were even displaying shunga and erotic pictures sometimes in their own house, and also that they were used as luck charms by people going to war and such.
But since the introduction of 'western' standards' through Japan, it has introduced a contradiction with these former traditionnal values. But they can't supress these things because they were once integral part of their culture. There are also things like public baths which were once not separated by sex at all, these ones were encouraged to disappear to not shock the western sensibilities of the time, but even up to this day they still exists.
It's also probably the reason Japan is one of the only asian countries were porn is legal though censored, in other countries like China, Korea, Thailand ect, Porn is absolutely forbidden.
Problem with Japanese culture is that they have this 'it can't be helped' stance about things even when they are bothering them. For example many Japanese would like sex censorship to disappear, but they will not push their governement about it. A single politician will very unlikely repell the law because people will mock him and use this to decribilise him. They prefer to an exterior occurance happens then they can justify the decision of getting rid of it. If you look into japanese boards like 4ch, there's people who hope some vn and anime get licensed in foreign country rather than send complains to the governement about supressing the law. There are also people using the law at their advantage for distributing 'illegal' uncensored content (ura douga), of normally censored porn videos, this market is big in japan and is highly related to Yakuza protection and such. It's an extremely lucrative market which can earn millions to the people who do it. Like in this article in which they can make profits up to 130 million yen only with online dvd sales (approximatively 1,3 million dollars). http://www.japantoday.com/category/crime/view/illegal-mosaic-free-porn-business-busted
I hope one day Japanese will repell this law. Unfortunately i think it's unlikely because i don't think the people concerned will want to publicly advocate against it.
For South korea case in the OP, it might be related to the fact porn in Korea is illegal.
- Kenshin_sama, Funnerific and Valmore
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The subject is a true one. It's an actual thing and it should be able to be discussed in a free way. If people are unwilling to talk about this, it confirms the facts people shows insecurities toward this subject.
I have never understood why steam doesn't allow full eroge on their website whereas they have games like Sakura spirit, which are popular only because the people playing them problably don't know there are games with content 1 million time better erotically wise.
But despite all of this, Japan also have a problem, because what is exactly the point of censoring specific parts in H content and scenes when everyone pretty much knows what is hapenning? It's not like the mosaics they apply on games are making it less lewd and suitable for everyone. If it really wanted to have a purpose, then it would not be an half assed measure like that, and everthing would be hidden. But here you just hide it enough to bother people and not enough to not make the content "obscene". There are many obscure reasons about this, I don't know why they couldn't have come with light censors like the ones in manga for example.
1 hour ago, ittaku said:Japan's censorship is uniquely fucked in a different way thanks to their interpretation of the obscenity laws created when the USA wrote their constitution post World War II. Go figure.
Ittaku nailed it. Japan didn't have censorship originally. It can be seen in works made into Meiji era and even later, like Shunga painting by artists like Hokusai. There's a famous one with an octopus which some people think is the first occurence of tentacles into a depiction of sex scenes. I heard that Japan laws were made by pressure of the western countries heavily influenced by Victorian morals and prudery at the time, who thought Japan was an uncivilised country because of all this sex imagery available. So the Japanese governement tried to ban it in order to make look themselves "respectable" into Westerner eyes. If the West had not this views about sex and America didn't have obscenity laws, then Japan wouldn't have any censorship today. Japanese people are as annoyed as people in the west probably are, but since it has become something longtime applied, through time, they have resigned against it and just see it like something which cannot be helped. But problem is that this censorship influence didn't disappear and can be shown on non h releases today. There are stories about console games censored in Japan like this: http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/448424/japanese-gamers-outraged-at-western-sjw-censorship
It is sad. But if one day things like this become common, then Japanese once again will start to think the same way that they do about censorship of obscene content: 'it cannot be helped, it's better than nothing'. Because in it's essence it's exactly the same thing that happened for obscenity law: self censorship to not offend and please views of people outside Japan.
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On 24/06/2016 at 9:00 AM, littleshogun said:
Nice sob story there I guess, Eai.
But seriously, from your complain here I could only see that you tried too hard to make everything right in either this forum or chat. For frogstat, I didn't knew why he said you're hopeless there, but at least I knew it's his right to use Japanese in English chat room, like it or not. But if you dislike his insult to you, then I couldn't said about it here, and therefore I'll leave this matter to you. Oh, and from what I heard weaboo was what you call an insult to some people, and apparently frogstat was insulted by that.
For your second story, to me it sounds like you didn't involved in 'useless debate' in the first place. But apparently you sense of justice want to stop this, so you tried to stop the debate. Okay, even if I understand your reasoning, but if you didn't like the debate, you could actually just leave the chat room and ignore the debate. Beside, it's not like you knew the people who got insulted by velo personally anyway (Or if you knew, that I also understand why you did that to velo).
For last point, let's just said that you really dislike arguing, but from back at 2 locked thread and your post as Aei in Walkure Romanze, I couldn't see that from you. Back in nukige forum, if you really only jokingly said that in regard of nukige, personally you really didn't need to write many reply to the posts there that show you insisting that your point was true (To be honest, the argument there was like in circle, some user tried to show the fact, and you said it's not right). You also made a thread about people insecurities about sex in VN as the aftermath from first locked thread (Which made mod Kaguya hid 15 posts), and you also had debate with one user back at Walkure Romanze thread (Which actually blew you cover in regard that you dislike sex scene in VN). Okay, I didn't really need your defense in regard of those, but what I want to said is that if you dislike arguing, my suggestion here would be just stop your argument instead of keep trying to depend yourself (And if you said it's hard to stop arguing if one party not willing to stop, you just need to stop your arguing by yourself ie didn't need to reply to many posts since actually if you involving in arguing, you also the party in arguing).
As the last word, I entered Fuwanovel and had my first post here in regard of Soukoku no Arterial tips here. Okay, I understand your point that you want to contribute something to Fuwanovel here. Therefore, I would suggest you better just take it easy here instead of keep righting the wrong thing to you here. Sorry if you dislike my post here, but I really want to write about this since yesterday.
23 hours ago, sanahtlig said:and you give them any objective reason at all to boot you, you're gone.
The problem is when you got boot for no objective reason. Whereas others are just fine for the same things. I don't think what i've done is this bad, and i am sure a lot of people there have a lot worse history than mine and are perfectly fine. But i am a new user, and i'm not so naive to not know there is a tendency to have strong positive bias and indulgence toward older members in forum communities. And that's a pity.
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(Long post incoming)
Thank you for your answer. But the points you made up are exactly why i say it's unfair. I will explain you why. It will give me the occasion to express myself about them.
For starters, i say you are biased because many times you are not taking in account exactly what happened or how things actually took place, For several reasons:
1- You were not always present when some of the points you quote happened
2-Reports you had about what happened came from one person only (Frogstat or Velo) with me not providing my version
3- You consider my actions whereas some people on the chat just acted in a very similar way. Also you have to consider there were time i was NOT enjoying what others where saying to me. And i have seen many times people having a rude behavior against me or others. But your bias are making judging things objectively a lot difficult because you had already the image of me being a troll before even knowing me. There's no need to deny it.
I dislike to do that but since it was done i would have to give example in detail from a specific episode which took places 2 or 3 days ago: there was when a newcomer who came up into the chan and asked if people knew about where downloading a game (he made a topic in the forum as well): sure fuwanovel is not specifically the place to ask for these things, but i still remember very well Velo was here and that he said to him to "go away" (exact words).
Which was rude. There were other way to say that he was not looking at the right place. The newcomer just leaved the room after that. and you weren't on chatroom to know this happened.
Now i will explain things in detail concerning the three examples you took. I don't like the way things are turning but guess it can't be helped.
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Example number 1 : You and frogstat...i'm not saying that frogstat is a model member, but i don't think he deserved being called a filthy weeaboo, and the way you spoke to him, it wasn't a joke, it was a deliberate attempt at bullying him, and not only that...you don't know him, you don't have to be that harsh with him, if Frogy was your friend, or you did know him for a good amount of time, he would've taken that as a joke, and not as an offense against him, and fuwachat policy is clear : as long as the person enjoy it, you can make fun of him, but if he says no, it's NO.
The starting of this was actually frogstat saying to me in japanese "dame da koitsu". The way it came out was clearly not a joke. I say back what you just said: he doesn't knows me. Sure there are some members on fuwanovel who can actually read japanese but they are still few. So there would have be a chance of me not knowing what he said. But unfortunately since i speak Japanese i understood what he meant, which is very far from being nice. I didn't made derogatory comments about him before, he litterally throwed this at me.
Then i responded in the same unrespectfull tone back in japanese. I suggested him to stop using japanese because even if you speak it, there is no point to show it off on an english chat room. He insisted about it that's why i said at some point "stop acting like a weaboo" (those were my exact words). I didn't call him a "filthy weeaboo", i just said he was acting like a weaboo. Because he was rude with me in the first place. It's not the same thing. And several times he made bad comments about me just like saying me to speak "like an human" and such. But i guess your perspective about this and others are linked to the fact you think i am a troll given my past. It would have been different with another person.
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Example 2 : Your countless affairs with Velo, not only did you pick up fights with him more than once, but you even got as far as calling him names, even discussing with him in private, and using mean words, in an offensive tone, the chat is a friendly place, not a boxing ring.
Seriously, i'm staying calm but you don't know how biased you are with your last statement. Basically, the 'countless affair' you are talking about was me saying something and velo being argumentative about it. And it's funny that you talk about it because i don't perceive it being done in a nice way, but rather like you said above in a 'mean' and condescending way. And he had been like this with other users as well which just ignore him for that. (I know you ignore him too most of the times because you admitted it). If Velo was not trying to turns things into an arguing war, then things would be much cooler. And i repeat it, but i am not the only one who probably has this opinion. Yes i would like the chatroom to be a friendly place, but you yourself know that velo there is another matter . You know that he likes to argue for nothing, for 'fun', nitpicking about anything about some users, and making arguments just for the sake of making arguments. And that is a fact he himself admitted. You can't deny that because i know what you think about him.
Moreover, in the yesterday conversation, i just wanted to STOP the pseudo debate because it would lead nowhere, the problem is that velo is very serious and obsessed about debating. and that's why i made a unrelated shit post statement about 'primitive'. You cannot say in all honesly that this word is an insult, given what the word is, it was a tiny poke related to the fact he has a dinosaur as an avatar, and nickname, made to 'stop' this useless debate. But you know that. Either, Velo called me names in japanese at some point, that i was not even human or below human, that he would have more interest to speak to more intelligent people and other 'nice' words. Of course i didn't screen capture them, but if you have access to the log and actually check all the conversation, you will see that. Now if you say chat is a friendly place, then it's not normal some users launching arguments and such and keeping going to use them like velo are perfectly fine whereas i get reproachs from you. I know the answer is the same; you have strong bias against myself.
So sorry Kurisu to say it to you, but what you mention in the middle part of the quote is not true. I never called him names in an insulting tone (expect if on more time you seriously consider primitive to be offensive, which is a a bit exagerrated comparatively to the way he was making up arguments and some words he said to me). Up to yesterday i never even made one comment about velo himself, but just criticized his opinions and arguments. What you say about chat is false too: the only time i had private chat with him was with my principal account and not the Aei one i was using now. Basically the ONLY time i had a private chat with velo was from the screen capture he provided, which was more than 1 month ago.
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Example 3 : With me, not only did you not care about rules in place, but you really thought insulting me in turkish would work out? you really thought there we no turkish speaking guy out there? I really didn't understand what you wanted to achieve by that, but clearely, it was total lack of respect and tact.
Like i said, this took place after the decision and i reacted like this because i was disgusted by it because it's unfair. But i was rude and acting like an idiot there, and i am sorry about what happened. It was completely unneeded. I didn't want to achieve anything i was angry. And tbh Turkish is not even my native language. I used online reference and google translator for it. I was angry and acted stupidly, that's pretty much it.
As such, the three examples are illustrating the core of the problem and the unfairness of the decision.
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'Now, i just hope you understand, i didn't ban you for ONE reason, i did ban you for your attitude, your behaviour, and many mistakes you made during your time on the chat, i wanted to give you many chances, i did told you to stop acting like that, but i didn't expect you to act like that in my back.
I'll finish by this, a ban is not definitive, i'm not biased toward you, i'm very upset about how you reacted after you ban, but that's all, a ban is not definitive."
I hope you understand better how i feel with me explaining you things from my perspective. I know it will sound strange and some will probably say "come one he is just saying bullshit" but i actually dislike arguing and things like that but when things like that happen if one of the party in question is not willing to stop, it's pretty hard to not continue. That's why most of the time i was in the chan i talked lighty about random things in a jokingly way. I know i had a bad behaviour with my trolling on the forum, when i made false arguments with a point of view with is not mine, but it was one mistake, and i didn't want to act like this anymore after getting ban one time by kaguya from the forum.
Finally, just for the record, my very first participation to the forum was a constructive one: i created a topic asking about behind scenes work regarding cgs in western releases. A Mangagamer member himself posted in the topic to answer to the question, which was about something many users didn't know. Far from being a troll, it was from several months ago, you can check my profile if you don't remember about it; and the reason i mention it is, that it shows that i didn't have bad intentions when joining fuwanovel originally. I did mistakes later and was punished for them, but i didn't in the chatroom with my other account Aei. Your decision and the way you considered me was already biased from there. -
First, Kurisu-Chan i have nothing against you. I apologize for my earlier behaviour, it was rude and unneeded. But i reacted this way because the decision you made was unfair. I was allowed to stay on chatroom with my alternative account because exactly i wasn't trolling. When i say about you being biased against me, it's something pretty obvious, because many times you were interpretating my words like i was intending to troll whereas i was just talking as others chat users do. I also had some interesting discussion with you present on the chatroom (do you remember i took part to a conversation related to guns where i agreed with you?). I didn't made up false statements, or picked up random fights just for the sake of it in the chatroom. I know i will look ridiculous for saying that but i wanted to act normally and redeem myself from what i had done with this account on forum.
I'm not disrespectfull against you, i am just saying what i think about it: it was pretty unfair and motivated by your bias against me.
Then if there was a valid motivation, i would appreciate if you could explain it.
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It was my first time with THIS account and not the one i was banned after which is Aei. When i say i didn't troll i speak about my alternative account and not my principal one. I didn't troll in chat because i was taking part to the chat as Aei, not Eai.
And the episode from the screen capture was prior my troll on the forum. You know that? If i wouldn't have said to Kaguya that i was trolling in the topics i wouldn't have been banned. But yet i wanted to say it because i felt bad because the opinions expressed on the topic were completely false on my part.
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i will be honest, yes i made 'trolling' on the forum with this main account on specific topics. The point of views i expressed on the closed topics were false. And yes i was already punished for this behaviour and suspended from the forums. Aei was an alternative account i created with which i was entering the chatroom.
However, what i wasn't doing is 'trolling hard on the chat' with this alternative nickname...i just acted like a regular user here until the decision. Kurisu had strong bias against me from the start and banned me without a valid reason. Basically on chat i was doing things other users were doing, the only problem is that because it was me then it suddenly became problematic. I did a mistake on the forum i got a punishment for that, yet i still get punished on the chatroom whereas i'm not doing something wrong. This is what is unfair and that i find disgusting.
The problem with the decision is that it was motivated by bias against myself and not actual facts= i did false statements on the forum, i said that i was trolling to one admin then i got banned, it's unfair that when i am not trolling and just taking part to not so meaningless conversations or not on the chatroom, i do things similar that other users and yet because it's me it becomes a problem...also i didn't try to resolve the issue because i felt my punishment was deserved.
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The most ankward thing is to get accused of trolling for no reasons because the moderator in question just thinks you are, so the claims becomes the proof itself. I was disappointed to see how people are simple minded and not able to let their personnal bias not interfere with their own judgement. Being a moderator just makes it worse.
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I was banned from the chatroom today without any reason by Kurisu-chan. But the problem by the way is that the bias of this specific moderator against me are so strong that he already tried to make unjustified decisions on the past. But now it's just getting very bad.
Let me remember you, people can do mistakes, if you condemn them for life because of one tiny mistake they have done and get punished for, then you are not acting fairly at all. You are acting not only unfairly because for a same behaviour one person is going to be punished while the other will not, but also dishonestly because your decisions don't even have valid reasons.This is a very narrow minded way of considering others and i find it very damaging to fuwanovel image in general. -
Well Sekai are by no means among favorite vn distributors. I don't know if they are less appreciated than others like Nutaku, but saying that they are not very popular comparatively to others is a secure fact. Their biggest problem is: they only rely on crownfunding, get several times a lot more money than needed, yet very little is know about what this excess money is becoming or why exactly they are so insisting about continuing crownfounding. It's limiting them in term of choices given the kickstarter rules about content. Also they must have sufficient backing founds now to try to get others licenses. They are a lot behind virtually all other distributors, given that there is not one single Japanese vn in their catalog which has an uncensored version (without mosaics), and a lot of their content is all age only. Also their last survey was mainly a joke: they were not even asking people what games they would like for future releases and instead asked boring and unrelevant questions.
About the previous comments, it 's unrealistic to assume people are going to go as far as learning a language for the sole purpose of reading porn *ahem* vns. I hear this often but there is not point to suggest others to learn Japanese to enjoy vns. Actually if you put this on an extreme perspective, it defeats the point: that could mean that licensing vns in the west is not so important, because after all people should learn the language to play them.
10 hours ago, Xavier12 said:You could also just learn to write your own word program, repair your own car, perform your own heart surgery etc.
Create your own visual novel...
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Art wise, if you look for evangelion doujins, you can't just not talk about mogudan:
http://exhentai.org/g/36319/19bd4bb3ae/
Oh and also this guy...(these blowjobs
)
http://exhentai.org/g/388594/cae0cacb1a/
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15 minutes ago, Qrqe said:
Made up what? Seriously, did you even read my post? Even if you cut off the Realta nua, Original fate stay night still sold way more than the anime. If you cant see the difference between 146,686 and 96,758 its definitely your problem. And as I said this doesnt even count the Fsn + Ataraxia sets etc, just the sales of FSN between 2004-2005 while we are combining all FSN anime sales.
And how that proves your point? Realta nua sold more than original because it HAD extra scenes and VOICES. Then how about To Heart 2, or Island, Kouya etc? Its actually funny how you are specially ignoring those.
You obviously ignore the point i made about realta nua selling more that fate stay night which was about the sales (and not the reasons) by only by looking your numbers, and the fact you didn't even mention ataraxia. (you tried to say at some point that ataraxia sold more whereas you don't even mentionned it). You also ignored the point that Rooke made on the previous page, which was what i was making reference to by saying "made up numbers". How convenient.
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16 minutes ago, Kawasumi said:
That said though, its so sad that we've become so prudish with sex, because, its just sex. Its a thing we all do to reproduce and therefore a basic human function, no matter how its portrayed it will always be one thing: sex.
It's not a matter of being prudish, but to not want porn to degrade the vn genre. About the presence of the H scenes the ones i am blaming are the vn developpers who are just acting brainwashed into following trends. But i find it very sad that licensing companies have to resort to release nukige who seems to sell. And to have people who say that they sell or even buy them is even more sad.
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54 minutes ago, Qrqe said:
I guess I'll prove that and not going to argue with you anymore. First version of the FSN which got released at 2004 sold 146,686 sales and the PS2 version of Fate stay night, Realta nua in short sold 169,647 copies, Makes 316,333. And this number is without the PSV versions, Fsn + Hollow atarixa set etc. Its "JUST" Fsn and Realta nua.
Now, Lets calculate how much did Fate stay night animes sold? Unlimited blade works by Ufotable sold 76,222 at total, 39,283 s1 + 35,992 s2. How about the Original fate stay night anime which got released at 2006? Only 20,536.
Finally, Lets add those numbers; While Fsn + Realta nua sold 316,333 copies, Fate stay night UBW season 1, season 2 and Original fsn anime sold only 96,758. Do you need any more evidence? If you want I can give you the sources of those numbers as well, But I'm sure you can find them with just googleing. You are exaggerating the anime sales too much, specially against one of the best sellers of visual novel industry.
My previous message was deleted it seems, but like i said, i didn't even check the sources and just took your own data to make the statement. And since it seems you made up your numbers from the sales of the all age versions (read Rooke comment), then it prooves even more my point. Without H content vn would sell a lot more.
That being said, i now understand why you didn't provide the sources of your numbers when i asked you.
37 minutes ago, Nosebleed said:Porn doesn't have to be art. Porn can just be porn. That still doesn't discredit its existence in any way, shape or form.
Again I'm repeating myself but this comes down entirely to people's taste in the genre. You clearly hate sex scenes, and that's fine, but don't bash other people and call them delusional for merely having a different preference.
You are literally trying to justify a personal preference of yours as some universal fact, and I'm sorry to tell you but that won't go anywhere.
And let's assume everything you said is true. That h-scenes give a bad name to vns, that h-scenes are pointless, that they literally only harm the medium. EVEN THEN, that is still no reason for people not to like them.
I think you should just accept the fact there are different audiences in the medium and in this case you're just not part of it.
I was not the one who called people delusional, actually it's funny because i was the one accused of being delusionnal here.
And sure there are perverts who will enjoy H scenes in vn i'm not denying it, but what i don't agree and the main problem is that some people who don't even like h scenes in vn come up with saying that they are needed for sales. Which is a very problematic statement, because it's not only contradictory, it's also making a false generalization and implies that people play vn for these h scenes. This is the point i find the strangest and the most disturbing. I don't know where theses assumptions and these self contradictions are coming from, and i find also annoying that people seems to be so inconfortable about this subject. It's not a matter of personnal preference, it's a matter of value of the medium in itself. I see nothing good into associating the vn market with porn and unfortunately the two seems undissociable for a lot of people which i find very deplorable. That's why i say H scenes and even more nukige are detrimental to the genre.
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11 minutes ago, Qrqe said:
I guess I'll prove that and not going to argue with you anymore. First version of the FSN which got release at 2004 sold 146,686 sales and the PS2 version of Fate stay night, Realta nua in short sold 169,647 copies, Makes 316,333. And this number is without the PSV versions, Fsn + Hollow atarixa set etc. JUST Fsn and Realta nua sold 316,333.
Now, How much did Fate stay night animes sold? Unlimited blade works by Ufotable sold 76,222 at total, 39,283 s1 + 35,992 s2. How about the Original fate stay night anime which got released at 2006? Only 20,536.
Now Lets add those numbers; While Fsn + Realta nua sold 316,333 copies, Fate stay night UBW season 1, season 2 and Original fsn anime sold only 96,758. Do you need any more evidence? If you want I can give you the sources of those numbers as well, But I'm sure you can find them with just googleing.
Yes i would like to know where your sources come from. Sales records can vary tremendously depending of the source. But thankfully you completely proove my point. Realta nua sold more than fate stay night DESPITE being +15 without any H scenes.
If h scenes were so important, realta nua would have sold a lot less than fate stay night, and it's the reverse.
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It's not a problem of aiming vn at adults. Books and movies can be aimed at adults too, that doesn't mean they should include porn because of that. Just try to include an explicit sex scene into a movie where it was before only suggered, and a lot of people will say that it is uneeded and that it degrades the movie. Being an adult is completely unrelated.
Also to proove how ridiculous it is to want sex scenes in vn i said this before:" Seriously, why having mosaiced sex scenes included is such a big deal? The funny thing is that even for these people who want to play for sex then they are screwed because the content is censored. And even if it's decensored, then it looks very bad because the artists don't make effort for what is hidden behind the mosaics (why would they?) "
There is completely not point in wanting h scenes in eroge.
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2 minutes ago, Qrqe said:
As I said, You should stop talking based on only western people. Go and try this conversation in some japanese eroge platform, then you'll see the majority. Man are you seriously saying that 5-10 people here are the majority, while thousands people are buying their eroges depend on the h-scenes? I'm giving you sale numbers, evidences etc and you are rejecting all of them while saying "but 5 people agreed with me in last thread, majority think as me".
You didn't give me sale number to proove fate sell a lot more than the anime adaptations of it, you just claimed it. There are a lot more evidence in favor of the anime selling more than the reverse.
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11 minutes ago, Qrqe said:
First of all being "popular" and "selling more" are pretty different things, and all of your talk are based on western people. Let me ask you in a different way then, how many of those "random anime fans" did buy the Fsn anime's blurays? 1 of 1000? Maybe even less. The reason why they wouldn't know that it was adapted from a visual novel is because of the popularity of Vns at western, with your logic Light Novels should sell only 10-15 copies because they are not popular here at all. Also if you are going to count all movies etc, then you have to count Realta nua, PSV / PS2 versions of Fate, Fate/Stay Night + Fate/Hollow Ataraxia Set etc's sales as well. Fsn is one of the best seller games of eroge history, you are too underestimating it.
In the anime market, having a lot of adaptations and blue ray is ONLY done for shows which sell very well. That's why some series don't have any BD or have only some part of the story adapted in animation.
10 minutes ago, Nekolover said:You are coming off now as being more delusional to me. Everything that requires work is art. You don't get to decide what art is. Also, I will like not your opinion of being the majority but some actual data to back up your claim. Otherwise, I disagree.
No offense, but you are the one who is delusionnal there, even people who watch porn wil never say it is art. Ask even random people who admit to watch porn and no one will say it's art.
Also just to know, what are you favorite Vn?
Why are so people so "sensitive" when it comes to nudity, porn etc?
in General Discussion
Posted
About your first statement, i'm sorry but it's wrong. Sexuality was still repressed in every bit of society at this period if you compare it to today standards; repression here has to be understood as a general background, general cultural standards and such; women had an harder time than men because women were considered inferior to men in every aspect. There was more indulgence toward men, but it doesn't change the fact that sexuality in itself was repressed and restricted (e.g. stupid things like the fact couples were advised to not have too much sexual relations in a week).
You mention middle age in several of your posts, whereas what's talked about don't enter into this period. For example restoration period started in 1660, which is not historically middle age at all. I don't see also the point in insisting about background about lawlessness of Europe, because it is also not directly related to the subject.
I know people of these periods discarded religious teachings, but it doesn't change the fact that society as a whole was influenced by these very teachings. Society and moral at the time was very dictated by religious principles. The fact people didn't always conform to them is unrelated to the standards of these periods, because after all, people are still people, you cannot so easily kick some natural behaviour out of human nature even if you solely declare this or this is wrong or not. So of course people in every period and even in middle age were very likely not limiting themselves to one 'authorized' position! All the Sexual positions we can see today are as old as humanity can get, but officially if they deviated from the official "teachings" they were still seen as wrong. There are some sexual practices are seen as perfectly common today, but were considred taboo or just wrong at these periods. It's not about the individual people, but the culture and general views of the time.
As a side note, For what i've read, i agree that it appears that there was a big contradiction between how you should ideally act 'stay chaste until mariage' and such, whereas prostitution was accepted. However, it appears to mainly concern middle age (views about matters like that vary a lot depending the period), so i don't know what you are getting at about it; by using words such as 'sex crimes'. It always existed in history, and like i said, prostitution may be illegal in some places but may be legal in others despite places like brothels may be illegal. Which is pure hypocrisy too. Also change prostitution for 'escort girls' and such and you have exactly the same thing with a different name. People were not more 'debauched' earlier than today, but now sexuality is much more liberated. Victorial morals are not what contributed to this, and it's rather the contrary, victorial morals are still at the origin of many problem related to prudery toward sex, nudity and such. Those victorian morals also influenced japan in such a way that they created contradictory laws influencing and contradicting their own original views about sex.
what you talk about regarding the servant cases, were abusive practices dating of this day not only related to the fact the servant were women, but also the fact they were poor. If you were a servant back to the old times, people considered that you deserved it, nature wanted it, and that you were of intrisically inferior extraction. In short, you were an inferior human being than those of higher birth and should respect and abide to those of superior social statute than you.
Chastity belt are real. You are right, they were maybe not especially created by victorians, their first design may have existed earlier, drawings depicting these devices existed at earlier periods. After documenting myself, i learned the myth about chastity belts is that there were used starting from the middle age to prevent people to have sex, which is probably innacurate. But even if Victorians were not the ones first creating it's original design, they were the ones greatly influencing it's purpose and at the origin of it's use later in history. By Victorian moral virtues, chastity belts were designed mainly to prevent masturbation. Medical reports describe the prescription of chastity belts (or similar devices, which might have no resemblance at all with a chastity belt) to prevent youngsters (of both sexes) from masturbating which in the 19th Century was thought to be wrong in every aspect. That fact that people still had sexual practices (you cannot stop people to refrain themselves from a perfectly natural behaviour) condemned at the time doesn't make the period less restricted toward sex relating to today. I don't know how you can say that.