reading untranslated VN

[Down]

Doesn't TA make it easier to look up words? Well I guess since looking up words in a physical dictionary requires more effort, they may stick in your head better.

Yeah, that's the point. Actually looking up the kanji or the word using a "physical" (well more like a phone app or something) dictionary makes things stick better for me. With TA looking up every definition just tires me but things don't stick so well. Might sound weird but it's just how it is for me.

And also I just like paper, so reading actual books is cool >_>

[Nosebleed]

I'm the opposite, anime has built up a ton of vocab for me. (ton is relative, but plenty of words did stick with me)

To the point where when I'm learning grammar and don't even need to read the translation of the example sententces to know what they meant.

 

I guess it's different from person to person.

[Bolverk]

Can somebody define "basic vocab". Is it N5 level of vocabulary, or does it include N4 as well? Approximately how many basic words do I need to memorize before attempting to read a VN? (This is of course after I learn basic grammar)

As the others mentioned there isn't really a fixed number you need to learn. Depends more on what your endurance is, if you can't handle looking up words. And the reading becomes more of a studying/analysing the text. You should prbly learn more vocab to speed up the process.. I didn't find this a problem in the start. Albeit it was hard, it was rewarding.

 

A natural thought when you start your first vn is to read a vn that is easy, or you don't mind not understanding the text. This is a rational idea.. But keep in mind you will be reading a vn you don't really enjoy. It might intensely piss you off. At least after a while. From personal experience I'd recommend choose a vn you find interesting and want to read, even if it's harder than your standard moege. Ofc you will understand less, but if you can handle that it's more rewarding imo. Clephas beginner list is great btw..

 

For me I noticed at the start I experienced I a lot of time connected the words I heard with how to read them. As I've heard a lot of the stuff from anime. But I had no idea how it was written or really pronounced. approximately 1000+ hours of anime seen. So no doubt that helped.

[Wahfuu]

People who say who can skip learning Kanji by using machine-assisted stuff like Jparser are utterly insane.

Alot of Jparser entries have tons and tons of fluff that only adds to confusion when you're trying to figure out what a words means in the context of a sentence, and apart from the fact that you're learning the word as some arbitrary brief translation into english (which is bad itself), alot of entries in edict are badly explained and poorly worded.
 

Of course, jparser (and edict itself) is pretty unavoidable when you start out, but the more you learn the more you quickly realize it should only be used as a reference, not a gospel. When you learn enough you REALLY want to switch into J-J dictionaries so you can learn the real nuance of a word. I see way more mistakes by japanese learner not because of poor fundamentals with grammar, but because edicts terrible method of explaining words just leads people astray and harms them more in the long run.

[Nosebleed]

No one said you can skip learning kanji entirely and go for JParser all the time, obviously you should try to learn kanji through other methods so you don't have to check up on JParser and read things on your own.

But JParser is good for learning common vocabulary and to start out with the basics in general.

 

You need to know the different meanings of a word when you're learning a language, even if it's not in the context of the sentence in question, that's when JParser comes in handy.

Even in a textbook you'll still be "translating" the word to know what its different meanings can be in your language since you're not japanese and can't just read J-J dictionary out of nowhere.

But after you know that word, you won't check up on its definition anymore, unless it comes in a really odd context, but you wouldn't use JParser for that.

 

Yes JParser definitions aren't flawless, but they're still useful.

We're talking about memorizing basic vocabulary with JParser here.

As in, knowing what a word means in most common contexts.

Not using it as the sole way to read VNs for the rest of your life, but as a starting tool.

 

You have to start somewhere and I don't think JParser for a start is that bad.

Indeed you shouldn't rely solely on it, you need to try and figure things out for yourself as you go as much as possible.

But to quickly look up common words it's not a bad tool and with easy VNs it works perfectly fine.

 

However, to learn more specific things in the japanese language, JParser is not the best solution, but I think someone shouldn't try to venture into the harder stuff until they've got a good grasp of the basics.

 

But the point is, you're not going to start practicing japanese by reading Dies Irae or Albatross, you're going to start with more basic VNs with very common vocabulary and JParser works fine for getting a nice start and build up.

 

I'm not saying to skip learning kanji entirely or anything, that's obviously a bad idea, but you don't need to learn 2000+ kanji to start a VN either.

[Ayana]

Exactly as Wahfuu says.. and for that reason I stopped using TA/Jparser/Mecab entirely when I felt confident enough. The two languages (Eng and Jp) are far too different from one another, and deciding to rely on a dictionary that transcribes one to the other all the time is generally a bad idea. I guess this is a pretty simple concept that everyone knows about, but progression is an important thing to be aware of when learning something new. Whatever methodology you're using to learn the language now shouldn't remain the same in the future. You must always strive to seek out a better way that more properly aids you in the learning process. In doing that, all you basically do is help further maintain your knowledge with the subject, and keep yourself from knowing less due to further stagnating in the same position. You either crawl upward or start slipping downwards, in other words.

Although, I still suggest that using Jparser and the like is an excellent method for getting the general idea of the language. Having it around even for a while is actually a great idea because it also raises confidence levels (it did for me greatly). Mistakes might be easily made in its use, but when a new method comes around I'm certain they can and will be fixed by the people undertaking them.

[Clephas]

People who say who can skip learning Kanji by using machine-assisted stuff like Jparser are utterly insane.

Alot of Jparser entries have tons and tons of fluff that only adds to confusion when you're trying to figure out what a words means in the context of a sentence, and apart from the fact that you're learning the word as some arbitrary brief translation into english (which is bad itself), alot of entries in edict are badly explained and poorly worded.

 

Of course, jparser (and edict itself) is pretty unavoidable when you start out, but the more you learn the more you quickly realize it should only be used as a reference, not a gospel. When you learn enough you REALLY want to switch into J-J dictionaries so you can learn the real nuance of a word. I see way more mistakes by japanese learner not because of poor fundamentals with grammar, but because edicts terrible method of explaining words just leads people astray and harms them more in the long run.

I should say something about this.

 

Because jparser will frequently combine kanji in weird ways,  overlook that a particle is actually a particle rather than part of a word, and almost always uses the alternate pronunciation for about one third of all common kanji, it isn't perfect.  However, I picked up kanji so well precisely because I used jparser.  That was because I spent so much time 'fixing' jparser's choice of furigana that I memorized all possible pronunciations for all forms of the most common kanji through simple repetition.  As a learning device, it is a bit Spartan in nature, though.  For one thing, if you don't go in understanding the essential differences between phonetic and symbolic written languages, you'll get your tires spiked from the beginning.  For another, you have to be able to instantly comprehend what they are trying to say and 'fix' it to the proper pronunciation.

 

Now that I think about it, learning kanji normally might be easier... I already had japanese down pat before I started using it, so my experience might not be a good reference point.

[Chronopolis]

I should say something about this.

 

Because jparser will frequently combine kanji in weird ways,  overlook that a particle is actually a particle rather than part of a word, and almost always uses the alternate pronunciation for about one third of all common kanji, it isn't perfect.  However, I picked up kanji so well precisely because I used jparser.  That was because I spent so much time 'fixing' jparser's choice of furigana that I memorized all possible pronunciations for all forms of the most common kanji through simple repetition.  As a learning device, it is a bit Spartan in nature, though.  For one thing, if you don't go in understanding the essential differences between phonetic and symbolic written languages, you'll get your tires spiked from the beginning.  For another, you have to be able to instantly comprehend what they are trying to say and 'fix' it to the proper pronunciation.

Now that I think about it, learning kanji normally might be easier... I already had japanese down pat before I started using it, so my experience might not be a good reference point.

 

I was about to disagree with this, but I suppose I did do 1500 words and ~300 kanji and genki 1+2 before cracking out Jparser and playing a VN. It's pretty easy to tell when Jparser is parsing the word boundaries wrong.

 

Jparser will help you learn words, tbh, but it's not that great for helping you learn less common (but still jyouyou) kanji's on-yomi readings (like　積雪　（せきせつ）). After you hit mid-intermediate level using jparser, you'll probably end up being able to read the on-yomi for any kanji that appears in a word you recognize on sight.

instantly comprehend what they are trying to say and 'fix' it to the proper pronunciation.

 

Well there are actually difficult shit like 中（なか、うち） 上（うえ、じょう）、　傍 （そば、かたわら）　that you probably won't be able to tell (but the meaning is similiar), and shouldn't worry too much about until you eventually read up on them/ and/or gain an intuition of them.

 

Then there's words with a lot of other definitions, like 冴える、. As a guideline I would say, the less sense the JParser definition makes, the more you should attach the word to the context you heard it in. Plenty of expressions and patterns can be easily picked up like this over time, if you pay attention to the tone and context and worry less about .

 

What I like about JParser is that it often notes the alternate, more casual meaning of words, e.g: 上等だ!

 

 

You need to know the different meanings of a word when you're learning a language, even if it's not in the context of the sentence in question, that's when JParser comes in handy.

Even in a textbook you'll still be "translating" the word to know what its different meanings can be in your language since you're not japanese and can't just read J-J dictionary out of nowhere.

But after you know that word, you won't check up on its definition anymore, unless it comes in a really odd context, but you wouldn't use JParser for that.

 

Yes JParser definitions aren't flawless, but they're still useful.

We're talking about memorizing basic vocabulary with JParser here.

As in, knowing what a word means in most common contexts.

Not using it as the sole way to read VNs for the rest of your life, but as a starting tool.

 

You have to start somewhere and I don't think JParser for a start is that bad.

Indeed you shouldn't rely solely on it, you need to try and figure things out for yourself as you go as much as possible.

But to quickly look up common words it's not a bad tool and with easy VNs it works perfectly fine.

 

However, to learn more specific things in the japanese language, JParser is not the best solution, but I think someone shouldn't try to venture into the harder stuff until they've got a good grasp of the basics.

Jparser is the fastest way to look up words. There's no reason to look up words in a different J-E dictionary if you have Jparser. As long as you know basic grammar (and you should keep learning it until you hit at least N3) and how sentences are structured, it will tell you which words are being used, how to read them, and their definition. It's pretty good at that (lets be honest, you're not going to use a J-J dict until quite a bit later), but you need to be aware that it's you who has to be the one piecing the meaning together.

 

Think of it a streamlined, but otherwise like any other normal dictionary. You wouldn't be able to get through a children's book without knowing basic grammar, even with a dictionary. Similiarly, looking up words like "to" in the dictionary is not very helpful. So ignore those super general particle definitions.

[Pabloc]

I'm not saying to skip learning kanji entirely or anything, that's obviously a bad idea, but you don't need to learn 2000+ kanji to start a VN either.

[Nosebleed]

I learned the meaning of particles when studying grammar, not through JParser. 

I don't recommend anyone uses JParser for particles either, you'll just facepalm and ragequit.

 

I only recommend it for nouns. It's worked for me thus far for easy things.

Anything beyond that (grammar and kanji memorization) is done outside of JParser.

 

My method is fairly similar to yours Pabloc, I had contact with anime continuously for about 2 years and decided to start with JP grammar this year and it was such a boost in my ability to read and comprehend stuff since I already had that continuous vocabulary built up from hearing things. It works for a nice, smoother start. And I haven't even touched RTK for more than 10 pages.

And it's because this felt so comfortable to me that I personally recommend it.

 

And i'm not saying it's a perfect method or the most efficient method, but it definitely felt like the easiest to get into.

 

Needless to say after you reach a certain level you should crank it up (I'm nowhere near able to read any J-J dictionaries though), but only when you sense you're capable of it. And if you're not sure, just ask around~

 

Well there are actually difficult shit like 中（なか、うち） 上（うえ、じょう）

[Zalor]

Man, I feel like I'm on the unpopular side by starting with Kanji before grammar. Am I really the only one (patriotic enough) to have chosen to follow Aaeru's guide? I'm already over halfway done with Heisig, I'm too invested in it to drop it now... As I said before, I know RTK won't teach me Kanji, but it will familiarize me to the point that I will have a head start when I do learn them. Are people's suggestions really to drop RTK and avoid it like the plague? (I'm already infected if that's the case).

 

I don't think that's a very good idea. Struggling with both Japanese AND uninteresting story will be just too much. One of the most challenging VNs I have read early on was Wanko to Lily - not because of hard vocab or writing, but because it was boring. Deciphering Japanese is quite tough when you are half-asleep.

I'd recommend choosing something that picks your interest for whatever reason. There was a list of beginner-friendly VNs somewhere on Fuwa, you can try one of those. Generally, the shorter the better. You will learn much more from a few short titles with different themes and writers, than from one longer VN. Also, your reading pace will be pretty slow at first, so you can end up stuck with longer stuff for quite long.

[Nosebleed]

Man, I feel like I'm on the unpopular side by starting with Kanji before grammar. Am I really the only one (patriotic enough) to have chosen to follow Aaeru's guide? I'm already over halfway done with Heisig, I'm too invested in it to drop it now... As I said before, I know RTK won't teach me Kanji, but it will familiarize me to the point that I will have a head start when I do learn them. Are people's suggestions really to drop RTK and avoid it like the plague? (I'm already infected if that's the case).

[Kelebek1]

Man, I feel like I'm on the unpopular side by starting with Kanji before grammar. Am I really the only one (patriotic enough) to have chosen to follow Aaeru's guide? I'm already over halfway done with Heisig, I'm too invested in it to drop it now... As I said before, I know RTK won't teach me Kanji, but it will familiarize me to the point that I will have a head start when I do learn them. Are people's suggestions really to drop RTK and avoid it like the plague? (I'm already infected if that's the case).

 

 

My first untranslated VN is either going to be that or Kanon. Kanon because I love it, and I am so familiar with the story that if I misread something in Japanese, I will know how I fucked up. Well I have a ways to go, but when I do start reading I'll take your advice.  

 

Well firstly I'd say I don't even know what you mean by "done." We constantly forget things, the only way to remember is with constant review to force our brain to keep it. Using it over and over, over a long period of time. So when you say "done," I don't know what that means. All the kanji you've gone through, can you recall all of them at a native's speed? if you listen/watch natives reading things, fucking hell they read quickly. I find I have a whole array of recall times, the most common words I read the most I recall quickly, but some can take me up to 5 seconds to remember, if I can even remember them at all, and everything's on a scale in-between. Comparing it with English, where I can look at any word and bam, the meaning is there in my head instantly, no matter how long and winding the sentences are, I just understand it straight away. Until you can get to that level with Japanese, I don't know how you can really say you're "done."

 

The main problem with RTK itself though, is that you have to take the whole thing as one block. It's not something to "work through," and certainly not for someone beginning Japanese. You're going to waste *so* much damn time. The main reason is because it's sorted by radicals, which means it gives kanji like 宵 which you'll very rarely run into ever, at #189, and 桂 at #198 for a Japanese Judas tree, 株 at #222 for stock, as in stock exchange. Talk about the stock market much in your life do you? Yet you have to wait until #1587 for 今, #1810 to learn 悪 for bad, and #1811 for 円 yen/circle, #1884 for 来, #1885 for 気, #1940 for 島 island, #2013 for 唇 lips etc etc etc. There are *so* many incredibly common kanji so far down the list to choose from.

 

Going by most used kanji in newspapers has the same problem, because what newspapers talk about, namely politics, official business, things like housing market, stock exchange (株 is listed as the 432nd most used kanji in newspapers for instance, whereas 犬 is at 1326th), immigration. All stuff you won't really need, *especially* not early on. If much later down the road you want to use newspapers and read about the state of Japan today from that angle, then you can go for it. But starting out, that's just wasted time, because you will no doubt forget those kanji. You'll almost never encounter them again, unless you go hunting for them by trying to read newspapers, which I wouldn't recommend unless you really care about Japanese politics. If you're learning from VNs, then unless you go and read something like Spice and Wolf which is focused on trading and being a merchant, I can't really see a lot of these kanji being useful.

 

I also disagree with the words he gives kanji, and I think the descriptions are ridiculously far-fetched for a lot of them too. Remembering 2 or 3 English sentences per kanji is just a bad idea. You'll end up spending more time trying to remember the English tied to a kanji, than the kanji itself, and when you're aiming for milisecond recall times to be able to follow conversations, that's all just way too slow. He explains at the start that he tries to tie things to English, and then "slowly remove the English" so only the Japanese is left, but I think that's too long-winded and simply not necessary. I think it's better to just straight up learn the kanji/word from a proper sentence, used in context, and not use a tonne of English to do it. Looking up the word in a dictionary is fine of course, but just without a massive fanciful story in English. Eventually you want to be using a J<>J dictionary anyway, so even when looking up words you don't use English. That'll help you get a better understanding of how the word can be used, and get around the issues a lot of J<>E dictionaries have in terms of accuracy, like others here have said.

 

So it's not that RTK is bad, but for beginners it really is. it's much more for review, in my opinion, when you're already half-way through and know a big chunk of the kanji there and just purely looking to expand vocabulary (and are learning to actually write kanji, which is what RTK was made for, and again is so low on priorities for learning). When starting out you want to be productive and efficient with your time, and put it into learning what you're going to use regularly, not what you'll forget in a few days. And that's exactly what RTK can't give you. Personally I think something like http://po-ru.com/projects/kanji-project/list/ is more useful, it's not just based off newspaper frequency, but the frequency over many different websites. No doubt some of them were newspapers I'm sure, but not all. 宵 isn't even on that list for instance. 株 still up there though in the 500s (right behind 犬 weirdly, and I swear I didn't check before writing the above paragraph, weird). But overall I think that list is at least a bit more representative about what you will actually encounter regularly, when not sticking entirely to newspapers.

 

Still though, learning single kanji is a really bad idea I'd say. Trying to pick up the meanings of kanji entirely out of context won't help you at all. If you want to learn kanji, learn them as words, as part of sentences (going hand in hand with the grammar), and never alone. Learning them as singles you'll never know the pronunciation you need, and for words which have a huge variety of meanings and/or readings as well, like 生, you're absolutely screwed.

 

So all in all, I think your time is put to much better use just going at VNs and giving a dictionary a pounding. Try to get some grammar down to actually start understanding the context the words are used in, and then just read and look up words. Memory is all about repetition. Google "forget curve" to get an idea. The 5th time you look up a word/kanji over the span of a week or two, it *will* start to stick in your head. But then, is that really the best to spend your time, looking up the same words over and over again? Well, that's up for you to decide. It's basically the same time spent as reviewing flash cards anyway, and either way you will need to review it multiple times to remember it. Getting your review while reading a VN is much more interesting and enjoyable than going through flash cards.

[iamnoob]

As a relatively new learner, can I ask what do you mean by I can't skip learning Kanji to play VNs? Right now I'm playing a easy VN (Chuuning Lover) using machine translations to convert Kanji into Romanji. 

 

I understand what you are trying to say when the machine translations are rubbish but why is it impossible - or at least not recommenced? - to skip learning Kanji? Because as of now the only problem I have is to have to search up 1-2 words for each long sentence in a VN since after watching anime I've got a basic understanding of the grammar.

 

Personally what I do is I listen to the voiced lines and can usually make out 70% of the lines with the remaining 30% having to look up some vocab words. The main aid for me using machine is for me to read the MC's lines as well as the 1 click definitions.

 

( By the way, I'm also using a site called Romanjidesu to help with definitions, it looks pretty detailed and I'm wondering how you veterans think it holds up in terms of accuracy )

[Pabloc]

^ Converting to romaji works only until you misread "carp" as "love" (both can be romanized as "koi").

MeCab/JParser work very well for easy VNs, but the less common words something uses, the less accurate they will be. And even in simple titles, they can get some stuff wrong. Plus, reading without looking anything up is simply faster (and as I mentioned above, romanization doesn't exactly solve all problems, because many words have the same reading and different meanings).

Btw., don't call those two tools "machine translators", it can be confusing.

 

I never used Romajidesu, I prefer offline dictionaries.

[Chronopolis]

Man, I feel like I'm on the unpopular side by starting with Kanji before grammar. Am I really the only one (patriotic enough) to have chosen to follow Aaeru's guide? I'm already over halfway done with Heisig, I'm too invested in it to drop it now... As I said before, I know RTK won't teach me Kanji, but it will familiarize me to the point that I will have a head start when I do learn them. Are people's suggestions really to drop RTK and avoid it like the plague? (I'm already infected if that's the case).

 

 

My first untranslated VN is either going to be that or Kanon. Kanon because I love it, and I am so familiar with the story that if I misread something in Japanese, I will know how I fucked up. Well I have a ways to go, but when I do start reading I'll take your advice.  

 That method is perfectly legitimate (it's not by Aaeru btw, http://forum.koohii.com/viewforum.php?id=1). RTK teaches to recognize kanji and gives a keyword, which may have some connection with one of the meanings of the kanji. It doesn't give you the on-yomi reading for compounds, I'm not sure how much easier it is to remember the on-yomi reading if you already recognize the kanji.

 

Throughout my study, I had to go through the process of distinguishing similiar looking kanji by looking to see which radicals differed.

 

塵　鹿、

籠、龍

理科　料理

等、寺

待つ　持つ

慰める、褒める

桃色、　挑戦

微かな、微妙、微塵、　（same kanji)

 

Doing RTK kinda front-loads this, meaning you'll have to do less of this remembering differences later on. Whether it's hugely. Proponents say it's much more effecient, but I didn't have too much problem just examining words along the way, to see if their kanji were actually the same, and learning the differences if they were different.

[Zalor]

The main problem with RTK itself though, is that you have to take the whole thing as one block.

 

Thanks for the long post, and I did read all of it. When I said "done" I didn't mean "finished", I meant I invested the time to get through over half of RTK. What I meant by that word, was that I am certainly not going to drop RTK after spending all that time learning new Kanji and reviewing them over and over. As for it being a whole block, I completely agree, which is why it would be stupid to stop now. Since a lot of common kanji are learned later on, it would be a complete waste of time to quit RTK before I even get to them. 

 

However, having taken (and suffered) through a year of Chinese in 9th grade. I can say that I much prefer learning Kanji with Heisig's method than by memorizing them through writing them over and over and over again for a stupid test. I was constantly forgetting Chinese characters for my course, but through Heisig and SRS memorizing tools I am maintaining an 85% - 90% retention rate; which is way better than what I had for my Chinese class. 

 

Also, for some Kanji that I learned earlier on, I have already forgotten their English stories but I still remember how to write them. Heisig was correct about the stories eventually leaving you but the Japanese staying, and it doesn't take that long for it to happen. Probably after a month or two of learning a kanji the story fades but its symbol and keyword sticks with you.  

[iamnoob]

^ Converting to romaji works only until you misread "carp" as "love" (both can be romanized as "koi").

MeCab/JParser work very well for easy VNs, but the less common words something uses, the less accurate they will be. And even in simple titles, they can get some stuff wrong. Plus, reading without looking anything up is simply faster (and as I mentioned above, romanization doesn't exactly solve all problems, because many words have the same reading and different meanings).

Btw., don't call those two tools "machine translators", it can be confusing.

 

I never used Romajidesu, I prefer offline dictionaries.

[Zalor]

As a relatively new learner, can I ask what do you mean by I can't skip learning Kanji to play VNs? Right now I'm playing a easy VN (Chuuning Lover) using machine translations to convert Kanji into Romanji. 

 

A big part of me is wondering why you want to convert kanji to romanji and not to hiragana. If you're going to read stuff in Japanese, you might as well use their phonetic alphabet. A lot of people I know who taught themselves Japanese recommend staying as far away from romanji and getting accustomed to reading the kana. This makes a lot of sense, as one of the reasons many Japanese pronounce English words with such a strong accent is because they learn many them with the katakana pronunciation, and not with the proper English pronunciation.  

[Nosebleed]

I also support hiragana over romanji if you care to learn or understand japanese phonetics.

The problem with romanji is that the system itself has different types of spellings (none of which are wrong either) that can induce error later on or just bad practices in general when pronouncing things.

[zoom909]

I also support hiragana over romanji if you care to learn or understand japanese phonetics.

The problem with romanji is that the system itself has different types of spellings (none of which are wrong either) that can induce error later on or just bad practices in general when pronouncing things.

 

just incidentally...

Rōma-ji ( ローマ字 )  not Roman-ji

[iamnoob]

I also support hiragana over romanji if you care to learn or understand japanese phonetics.

The problem with romanji is that the system itself has different types of spellings (none of which are wrong either) that can induce error later on or just bad practices in general when pronouncing things.

 

 

Well I am halfway learning it so i can't read it fluently yet. I have bad memory D:

 

Also I noticed that は = wa / ha  Even though there's a wa particle already.... what iz thiz madness

[Deep Blue]

noob question here, is it important to remember how to write the kanji itself if my purpose is just to understand Japanese and to read it but not write it?I ask this because learning kanji is one thing but remembering how you draw them is a different thing...for example one thing is to read 答,I know it means something like "answer" and by looking at it I can tell, but if i need to write down the kanji itself for "answer" i cant remember at all how to do it... the number of radicals or stroke number...

 

 

 

Well I am halfway learning it so i can't read it fluently yet. I have bad memory D:

 

Also I noticed that は = wa / ha  Even though there's a wa particle already.... what iz thiz madness

Yep, the first time I saw it I asked myself the same thing :/

[Kelebek1]

Also I noticed that は = wa / ha  Even though there's a wa particle already.... what iz thiz madness

 

Here's an explanation of the particle from a historical sense (if you really care at all): http://archive.org/stream/historicalgramma00sansuoft#page/256/mode/2up

 

Really gives you a better sense of the particles, knowing how they were used in the past. Really helps to resolve oddities in the language when you see where things came from. Also worth looking up the parts on の and が as well (hell, the whole book's interesting), the の section especially gives explanations that you don't find on usual learning websites, and then you can contrast it with が.

[Chronopolis]

noob question here, is it important to remember how to write the kanji itself if my purpose is just to understand Japanese and to read it but not write it?I ask this because learning kanji is one thing but remembering how you draw them is a different thing...for example one thing is to read 答,I know it means something like "answer" and by looking at it I can tell, but if i need to write down the kanji itself for "answer" i cant remember at all how to do it... the number of radicals or stroke number...

 

 

 

Yep, the first time I saw it I asked myself the same thing :/

you don't need to memorize how to write the kanji, though You still should learn to recognize the radicals: the 合　and the radical above it.