interested translator Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I'm still going to support the Kickstarter, since I was going to buy both versions (the Vita version has extra CG not in the 18+ version.) In the best case, I'll end up with vouchers for the 18+ version as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interested translator Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 according to koetsl: "I'm confident that many of the jp vita script edits in these scenes are not necessary to preserve an "M" rating in the US". - say goodbye to sexual anything in the visual novel...half the jokes will probably be gone now if what koetsl sees is what they go with. This is looking like If My Heart Has Wings problem all over again. You're going overboard. This is nothing like IMHHW. There's still sexual stuff in the Vita version. Things like http://www.gamer.ne.jp/news/201307230047/image/8/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyrt Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Honestly I would love to support the kickstarter but if they plan to edit the All-Ages version as well my code prevents me from supporting it in any way. I have strict rules against censorship of text and this would fall under that. If they do not edit the all-ages script then I'll probably support them as well (minimum money necessary for all 3 games) and then hope they give vouchers or something for the 18+ version down the line. With the new price range for stuff it's actually comes out to about half the amount I was willing to back in order to get the all ages and 18+ version...so while I am currently not going to back it with the knowledge of an edited script (they probably took out sexual humor and the like) if they change their mind on that and "promise" to release 18+ later then I'll probably back it. - interested translator: Did you read the quote from koetsl? he says many scrip edits in the jp vita scenes that do not seem necessary to preserve an M rating in the US...they are cutting dialogue and the only dialogue I can see getting censored is of a sexual nature. So this has plenty of chance to go the same way as IMHHW based on that evidence presented by koetsl. Admittedly I'm making an educated guess based on what I think is most likely to be cut to retain an M rating but there it is. I just looked at the picture and that will probably be cut too if dialogue is being cut then images definitely will be...or she'll be wearing a towel or swim suit or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decay Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 The all-ages script was already modified. In the Japanese Vita version, they made some alterations to Angelic Howl, for example: the cannibalism was removed Koestl has said that he will be reverting all "unnecessary" script changes. They cannot restore any scenes that were outright cut, but any script changes will probably be reverted back to how they were in the 18+ version. Basically, they think that outside of the h-scenes, nothing in the 18+ version would have prevented an M rating by the ESRB and that's what they're shooting for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interested translator Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Cool. I trust Sekai Project will do their best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyrt Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 according to sekai project: "Hi. We're sorry about the delay / separation of the 18+ versions, and we do understand why people would be upset. The 18+ games will come out if the trilogy is funded, and we're looking into options to provide some sort of credit for KS backers. Ideally, you will be able to back the trilogy on Kickstarter and then receive a discounted or free copy of the 18+ games when they're released. I can't make any promises about that, but it's something we want to do, and we will try to clarify prior to launching the kickstarter. Believe me, we have tried working around this issue, but the original rights-holders expressed a strong desire to maintain clear "separation" between the 18+ and M-rated products. With regards to "censorship," we have some leeway as localizers and may revert some textual changes made to the vita version where possible. And please keep in mind that a completely uncut 18+ edition will eventually be available, as long as the Kickstarter succeeds." so basically confirmation that Frontwing wishes to try for a cash grab (still think clannad's success is the cause of this). I will keep an eye on this but I honestly don't expect it to succeed now. I'll put minimum down for all 3 games but no more than that...need to save money if 18+ is going to cost money...I can just give away the all ages version (and if it succeeds I do intend to play and compare both games eventually so that might be interesting. Shame. Oh well time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satsuki Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Doesnt matter to me, don't plan on buying the 18+ ver anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambda Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 according to koetsl: "I'm confident that many of the jp vita script edits in these scenes are not necessary to preserve an "M" rating in the US". - say goodbye to sexual anything in the visual novel...half the jokes will probably be gone now if what koetsl sees is what they go with. ??? Koestl's tweet reads the opposite way to me... He's basically saying "we can add more of the 18+ script and keep an M rating because the JP Vita version's script is tame", isn't he....? I was only planning on buying all-ages, but the physical copies are only 18+ versions, right? That means only digital........... Sighhhh. Hoping for better news on that front... Although I'm not sad about any "censorship" this means considering the original author probably wrote the added parts.... This is the Frontwing-approved Frontwing-made all-ages version, after all.... Although I have no idea if the Fujisaki wrote the all-ages Fujisaki bits, etc., I'm at least confident it won't be If My Heart Had Wings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzyworld2 Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 ??? Koestl's tweet reads the opposite way to me... He's basically saying "we can add more of the 18+ script and keep an M rating because the JP Vita version's script is tame", isn't it....? I was only planning on buying all-ages, but the physical copies are only 18+ versions, right? That means only digital........... Sighhhh. Hoping for better news on that front... Although I'm not sad about any "censorship" this means considering the original author probably wrote the added parts.... This is the Frontwing-approved Frontwing-made all-ages version, after all.... Although I have no idea if the Fujisaki wrote the all-ages Fujisaki bits, etc., I'm at least confident it won't be If My Heart Had Wings. Our main releases (including physical copies) will be localized PC ports of the Vita games - including new scenes and CGs from both Akio Watanabe and Fumio. So no, there will be physical all-ages. Also @ the tweet, that how I'm interpreting it too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambda Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Our main releases (including physical copies) will be localized PC ports of the Vita games - including new scenes and CGs from both Akio Watanabe and Fumio. So no, there will be physical all-ages. Also @ the tweet, that how I'm interpreting it too... You made my day! There's too much info coming at once to search for it all...! All-ages versions of porn games, here I come (hoping from the bottom of my heart they still get funded, of course). Dizzyworld2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nohman Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Also reading the terms of service on the kickstarter they can bypass the entire H-content issue by simply having a patch available via the website for free and say all backers get a chance for an extra version after the initial release that will return it to its original state. This is just speculation on my part, but I wonder if that is even an option. Maybe having a patch (instead of a separate 18+ product all together) would be against whatever terms they have with Frontwing regarding the licensing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanahtlig Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 (why someone hasn't made something like Kickstarter that allows adult content I'll never know) Alternatives exist, but Kickstarter adopted this policy for a good reason. Payment processing for porn is significantly more expensive. By not involving themselves in porn, Kickstarter is able to provide a crowdfunding service that takes a relatively low cut. The alternative crowdfunding services for adult materials take a much larger cut (e.g., 30% for Offbeatr vs. 5% for Kickstarter), and thus aren't attractive to developers and publishers, especially for larger projects where the cut becomes substantial. Adult products (like videos, books, etc...) are considered high risk due to a history of higher cases of fraud and chargebacks. Because of this the few companies who do process for adult companies charge often 2 to 3 times more than non-adult payment companies. http://wiki.offbeatr.com/Fees_and_Costs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RinXD Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 This is just speculation on my part, but I wonder if that is even an option. Maybe having a patch (instead of a separate 18+ product all together) would be against whatever terms they have with Frontwing regarding the licensing? The only problem with that would be that I dont think steam would be ok with it considering they're rather picky about that kinda stuff especially if its supposed to be all ages Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenophilious Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 https://twitter.com/koestl/status/541843642944872450 I was planning to fund the Grisaia Kickstarter, in large part because I supported the use of Kickstarter to fund eroge translation. At this point, I'm probably not going to fund it, pending details of the 18+ release. I need the following to be comfortable supporting this Kickstarter: 1) A guarantee that an 18+ version will be released within a reasonable (pre-determined) time frame. 2) The exact details on the 18+ release, how and where it'll be available, and for what price (for Kickstarter supporters vs. everyone else) That's the minimum I'll accept. In addition, I need reasonable assurance that my dollar vote is going to the right place: funding eroge translation. I don't like the idea that my dollars would nominally be funding a product I don't want, and that's why this Kickstarter will be a tough sell to me no matter what the terms end up being. I'm not a huge fan of Grisaia, so they'll have to demonstrate that supporting this project sets (correct) precedent for getting the type of games I want. Pretty much took the words out of my mouth. They had me ready to fork over my money, but honestly, without info like that I wouldn't feel comfortable backing the Kickstarter, especially if I'm gonna have to buy multiple versions of the VN just to get the one that I want. I love Grisaia, but I'm just not willing to buy more than one version of Kajitsu, and I want the uncut 18+ version, simply because I don't like censorship and I want the full product. I want the version I have sitting on my HDD, nothing less. I just hope enough people are willing to buy the M-rated version, because unfortunately, I'm not going to. I might chip in anyway, but I'm not going to get two versions just to get the one that I want. That's stupid to expect people to do that. Kosakyun and RinXD 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RinXD Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Honestly I wouldnt think it would cost them much more if anything to make both versions considering the lines would be near similiar just one is devoid of adult content so I dont really see how this would be a issue for them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deep Blue Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I was ready to back this project but now I'm not sure anymore, if they clarify what are they are cutting off I might back it but right now I dont think so. I don't mind if they cut the H-scenes (most of the time i just skip them but then again this is a really personal thing I understand if someone gets mad about this) but changing the script of the game or taking out lets say gore content or things like that are out of the question and I'll not back something like that by any means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RinXD Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 They will have to remove anything that makes it 18+ so you lose a good portion of the story not to mention they're going for a steam release for the all ages version so that further increases the restrictions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenophilious Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Honestly I wouldnt think it would cost them much more if anything to make both versions considering the lines would be near similiar just one is devoid of adult content so I dont really see how this would be a issue for them I think it's more about not setting a precedent. They don't want to start releasing the all-ages and 18+ versions at the same time, and doing so would most likely make people expect that from now on. That said, doing that for a KS is just dumb. It greatly decreases the chances of it being successful, since from what I've seen a lot of people only want the 18+ version, judging from the Prefundia comments. FW seriously needs to reconsider if they want this licensing to be successful. I was ready to back this project but now I'm not sure anymore, if they clarify what are they are cutting off I might back it but right now I dont think so. I don't mind if they cut the H-scenes (most of the time i just skip them but then again this is a really personal thing I understand if someone gets mad about this) but changing the script of the game or taking out lets say gore content or things like that are out of the question and I'll not back something like that by any means. If Sekai doesn't make a full statement that covers all of these questions and more, there's going to be some very upset Grisaia fans. They're going to have to be pretty transparent this time, or they might lose a lot of interest and money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RinXD Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 They already have lost a lot of interest and money every repsonse on that twitter post is people saying they wont be backing it now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deep Blue Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Well sadly Sekai will do and say only what Front Wing wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RinXD Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 This is why Localization fails in the west cause they dont listen to the fans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakamutt Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Reading muh blog post #shamelessadvertising may or may not give you more concentrated information. I did kinda forget the 1 month thing, but considering it's still not confirmed, I'm not too bothered about leaving it out.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deep Blue Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Yep, exactly. Even big studios do this kind of stupid things like Namco, I remember when Ace combat 3 was released on the ps1 (jap ver) and then when they release it worldwide they cut off almost everything because they thought that it would not appeal the public outside Japan... What the hell are they thinking.. Reading muh blog post #shamelessadvertising may or may not give you more concentrated information. I did kinda forget the 1 month thing, but considering it's still not confirmed, I'm not too bothered about leaving it out.. Well he is saying that even the plot is being censored...yep I'm not backing it now if that's the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RinXD Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Well its the same thing with Phatasy Star online 2 fans have begging for a western release and as if to rub it in our faces they went ahead and localized it in SEA in english and IP blocked all western IPs from both the japanese game and SEA. It's nothing new for the west to get to the shaft when it comes to japanese games that involve anime or visual novels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deep Blue Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Well that's because we clearly hate anime/visual novels and we don't understand it, they are doing us a favor after-all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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