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Love Live! School Idol Festival Thread


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That's true but maths has always been one of my weaker subjects so I don't really know how to interpret the formulas and stuff. So I'm just taking a logical guess at what the system should be like. Any maths genius here who could explain how does it works? :P Would help lots haha

Math is probably my best subject... so...

I took a 2nd look and analyzed the equations, and they're actually easy to compare two different cards amd you can pretty much just do the x1.1 thing. Most of the variables can just be considered constant in the equation, and it turns out the only variables that actually matter when comparing two cards is their stats (obviously), their attributes (duh) and the bond. As long as you aren't changing the leader, what you do is take the stat of the card, add the bond level, then multiply by 1.1 as you've been doing. Every other part of the equation doesn't matter since they can be held as constants.

/tl;dr or understand:( Stat + Bond ) * 1.0 or 1.1 depending on attribute.

Now, there's actually a lot of number crunching if you want to compare two cards of the same attribute when choosing leader and they have different skills(makes a more complicated difference)

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Guys.................. It actually happened.....   I actually... got a Nico...     The tears won't stop.   Even if it was just one SR as I expected, for once, FOR ONCE I got a Nico, and on t

Well, I sorted through my screenshots, but due to the 25 screenshot limit, I had to omit some less important ones. Here's a list of screenshots when rushing the SR

In order to be grateful for the URs you have and so you won't make others feel bad, I have decided to create a guidelines of things you have to do for every UR you get in the future, depending on the

I tried doing it more formally and failed miserably because my approach was fail, but let's try some napkin math:

 

A good maxed out all-rare team atm should be at ~32k raw stats.

 

Adding 300 actually gets us 318 because of 2x SR center bonuses.

 

Anyway, we'll say final stats are prolly around 38k. We now have to compare 38000 to 38318 stat, assuming #1 is with all matching and #2 has one non-matching.

 

Good placement has varying results in reducing the amount of notes to the position, and obviously this gets less ideal if you have more non-matching members. I'll put it as the non-matching member getting 7% of the notes. That's probably a little pessimistic as the normal value is 11 + 1/9 but whatevs.

 

I'll now bullshit some values into the scoring algorithm and compare!

 

Score = floor(Sf * 0.0125 * A * C * T * M)

 

First a calc per note using some fudging of combo, accuracy etc on matching:

38000 * 0.0125 * 0.95 * 1.12 * 1 * 1.1 = 555.94 ( floor, so this goes to 555)

 

Now, we need to fit the modifier parameter to our 7% figure for the rest. Notes are going to 1.1 93% of the time... so we have (0.93 * 1.1 + 0.07 * 1) = 1.023 + 0.07 = 1.093 average modifier.

 

38318 * 0.0125 * 0.95 * 1.12 * 1 * 1.093 = 557.02...

 

Now the floor thing kinda bullshitted this so the score difference is 2 instead of 1, but whatever let's roll with it. Assume the average song has 250 notes. The score difference should be ~500, favoring including the higher-attribute no-matching member with 300 more stat. This assumes you optimize to that 7% for each song and stuff.

 

At this point, you should also consider the appeal skills of the different rares. The difference is... pretty minor, but even relatively small attribute boosts can matter as shown here.

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I tried doing it more formally and failed miserably because my approach was fail, but let's try some napkin math:

 

A good maxed out all-rare team atm should be at ~32k raw stats.

 

Adding 300 actually gets us 318 because of 2x SR center bonuses.

 

Anyway, we'll say final stats are prolly around 38k. We now have to compare 38000 to 38318 stat, assuming #1 is with all matching and #2 has one non-matching.

 

Good placement has varying results in reducing the amount of notes to the position, and obviously this gets less ideal if you have more non-matching members. I'll put it as the non-matching member getting 7% of the notes. That's probably a little pessimistic as the normal value is 11 + 1/9 but whatevs.

 

I'll now bullshit some values into the scoring algorithm and compare!

 

Score = floor(Sf * 0.0125 * A * C * T * M)

 

First a calc per note using some fudging of combo, accuracy etc on matching:

38000 * 0.0125 * 0.95 * 1.12 * 1 * 1.1 = 555.94 ( floor, so this goes to 555)

 

Now, we need to fit the modifier parameter to our 7% figure for the rest. Notes are going to 1.1 93% of the time... so we have (0.93 * 1.1 + 0.07 * 1) = 1.023 + 0.07 = 1.093 average modifier.

 

38318 * 0.0125 * 0.95 * 1.12 * 1 * 1.093 = 557.02...

 

Now the floor thing kinda bullshitted this so the score difference is 2 instead of 1, but whatever let's roll with it. Assume the average song has 250 notes. The score difference should be ~500, favoring including the higher-attribute no-matching member with 300 more stat. This assumes you optimize to that 7% for each song and stuff.

 

At this point, you should also consider the appeal skills of the different rares. The difference is... pretty minor, but even relatively small attribute boosts can matter as shown here.

I highly respect that you gave number proof, as I was too lazy to go calculate fake numbers. Also, I forgot to take into account number of notes received by the card in question, oops.
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which is better to use: a 3315 cool point Pure Hanayo, or a 3010 Point Cool Kotori? What about a 3500 cool Pure vs a 3000 Cool?

I usually follow these two rules when making my team, hope it helps.

1st Rule: Matching Attributes

[1] Extra 10% point increase is awesome

[2] The only time you ignore this rule is if the point difference is large (eg. SR vs N) and/or 2nd Rule applies.

 

2nd Rule: What are their skills?

[1] Skills make a ton of difference. I cannot emphasise that enough.

[2] It's very important for score ranking in particular.

[3] Generally go for skills that trigger on combos, as opposed to time (Higher difficulty = More combos)

     -> Not an issue when you start using Rs and above, but only ignore the combo>time rule if and only if the 1st Rule: [2] applies.

[Note] Combo based skills require perfects to trigger, i.e. You must be able to (nearly) perfect full combo a song consistently to gain the point advantage.

          -> If you aren't confident, raw points mostly is a better choice, considering Attribute Bonus.

Consistency is a must!

This allows you to decide if you should replace skill based cards with raw points card instead.

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Using your cards as example:

I put a Cool Kotori (3010pt) in my Pure team over a Pure Hanayo (3315pt). And let's say:

- Kotori's skill is: % chance 200pt increase every xx combo

- Hanayo's skill is : % chance to heal 2 stamina every xx seconds

 

At first, it looks like I've committed blasphemy, with -305 less total points.

 

However, Kotori's skill can easily make up the difference.

If I went with Hanayo, I'll receive 10% matching attribute bonus, but that's all I'll be getting.

Stack up those 200pts trigger from Kotori and she'll easily award a greater return compared to Hanayo.

A good way to illustrate this is by comparing your high scores with your current score whenever you full combo.

I can FC a song and still be 5k behind my high score, all because my skills didn't trigger as often. This alone should really emphasize just how OP skills can help you.

(And 5k extra points makes a lot of difference in event song ranking)

PS: This is also why I absolutely hate stamina heal skills, especially on SR/UR. Such a waste ~ <_<  (Which is why my Cool team has no Pure SRs)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So regarding your question:

[For both Pure & Cool Team]

- Use Kotori unless Hanayo's skill is similar/better than Kotori's skill (refer to [3] for 2nd Rule)

(I assume that Pure Hanayo card has a heal skill, like most Pure cards do)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Don't worry too much on formulas for now. Just remember:

- Strongest card in the centre

- Matching attributes everywhere else

- If you have cards of different attributes, place them in spots with least recurring notes

- Anything else, refer to the two rules I talked about

 

No one mentioned skills so I kinda felt the need to emphasise their importance. Hope this was helpful to everyone.

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I replaced my SR Honoka (smile) with a cool Kotori for an all cool team and the difference reflected in the score immediately in cool songs

Although SR Honoka didn't have that much of a higher cool stat it was still higher than Kotori by a couple hundreds.

 

This is why I also believe matching attributes is more important in a lot of cases because that  extra 10% boost will overwelm the score you'd get by a slightly higher total raw stat. At least that's what has happened so far in my experience.

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Alright, I think I got it this time (again):

 

For the sake of this example, let's assume we have a team of 10000 Pure, made of 9 on-trait Pure members. If we were to replace one of these pure members with a Cool member of the exact same pure score, then the final scoring would decrease by 1/90. This is because you lose the 10% bonus score on avg 1/9 of your hits, so you lose 1/90 total points. If you were to replace your original Pure member of 10000/9 pure points (1111 points) with an off-trait member, what point value would they have to have to make up for the bonus point loss? you can calculate the average points that the other members will gather with (8/9)(newtotalpoints*1.1) and the points the new member will earn with (1/9)(newtotalpoints). This value should be greater than the previous (9/9)(1.1*oldtotalpoints)=11000. So we have (8/9)(newtotalpoints*1.1)+(1/9)(newtotalpoints) > 11000 in order for the swap to be worthwhile. If you do some algebra you get (9.8*newtotalpoints) > 11000*9 and yo can work it down to newtotalpoints > 11000(9/9.8) for the swap to be worthwhile. That means that the new member must have 102 more points than the old member.

 

Of course that seems really jumbled, so if someone wants to follow-up and tell me if it makes sense, please do. I think maybe the best way to determine whether or not to swap in an off-trait is to weigh the trade-offs.

 

Originally your on-trait gives you (1/90)(totalscore) + it's own pure value. When you swap in an off-trait, you get ([new-#-of-on-trait-members]/90)(pure-score-of-off-trait) additional points. So if (1/90)(total-score-with-on-trait) is greater than (#-of-on-traits/90)(score-of-off-trait), then the choice becomes clear.  <---- I think this is wrong

 

[(#-of-original-on-trait-members/9)*(1.1)+(#-of-original-off-trait-members/9)]*(original-team-score) VERSUS [(#-of-new-on-trait-members/9)*(1.1)+(#-of-new-off-trait-members/9)]*(new-team-score). Whichever one is higher yields the better team.

 

The thing is that you have to take the number of on-trait members within your team into account because they distort the effective value of points. The more on-trait members you have, the more your raw points are worth. The less you have, the less raw points are worth.

 

It's probably not quite worth the effort unless you have a fully completed team that you dont expect will change for a very long time. If you're still in the process of finding someone to replace Ru Tatara, then you might not want to put the effort into big calculations, but if you've got 5 SRs, a UR, and a few perfect Cool Rares, then maybe it could net you the points you need to beat some people in the event song or something.

 

 

I spent a lot of time thinking this one out to try to find a quick and easy way, like multiplying two numbers together and comparing another two sets, but I couldnt find anything that easy. I'm not sure a perfect one exists, but as far as an easy way to get roughly similar results, I believe multiplying on-trait members by 1.1 will give you decent approximations. Or maybe I'm just dumb

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Hmm a quick question, for my cool team I have a SR Smile Nico with 3990 cool points versus a 3270 cool Kotori. The gap in the number is very huge so in this case I should be better off with Nico, am I right? Or is the x1.1 bonus on Kotori still better than having Nico on my cool team?

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Hmm a quick question, for my cool team I have a SR Smile Nico with 3990 cool points versus a 3270 cool Kotori. The gap in the number is very huge so in this case I should be better off with Nico, am I right? Or is the x1.1 bonus on Kotori still better than having Nico on my cool team?

I'd still say you'll want to go with Kotori simply because of her skill.

You can useNico, just make sure she's in the least note recurring spot.

Kotori is definitely be better when her skill triggers frequently - in theory.

Try out both and see what the outcome is.

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Just tried a couple of runs with Kotori. I'm scoring better with a Smile Nico who is about 700 points higher den Kotori on all tries. The difference is about 2~3k with 10~15 greats on the event song. I think if the point difference is too large skills won't make up for that gap. Then again it's a small sample size, might just be a problem of the skill not triggering during my runs

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Welp, did my first 2 event song runs after getting SR Umi. I was playing hilariously bad last night so I wasn't expecting much.

 

FCd twice, highscore is now 175.6k which should be moderately safe for top2k.

 

Also I spoke too soon about having everything S ranked and combo'd, didn't actually have mermaid Festa S-ranked... fixed that this run as well though.

 

No rares.

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I don't feel the competition that much, but it might be me just being forever 2000-4000.

I've just watched as I have slowly fallen from ~800 to where I am now, and I barely waste LP.

And so close, yet so far. I think this was a fluke

q4fWP93.jpg

Dropped on the 3rd slider in the beginning.

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Do you have any other full member attributes? I have my full Smile team, which is pretty cool.

So... I got another 1-good run of the event song. I'm cursed. I also accidentally spent a love gem to refill my LP, which sucked. I had 8LP already too, I meant to hit cancel ._.

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Do you have any other full member attributes? I have my full Smile team, which is pretty cool.

So... I got another 1-good run of the event song. I'm cursed. I also accidentally spent a love gem to refill my LP, which sucked. I had 8LP already too, I meant to hit cancel ._.

That's kind of like when you select the wrong team to play the event song.

Happened to me once. Although wasting love gems is more damaging. I feel for you.

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haha, I dont mean to force your hand about it xD

 

btw, I tried Yeokso's advice for making a team. I replaced my medium-value Pures with slightly lower-value non-Pures with bonus point abilities.

jzCfz4gFlo8XV_e.jpgjbnuNGAutHJBFC_e.jpg

^ This was done with my adjusted team. as you can see I FC'd it and got an A, around 10k less than my high score.

 

If you cant read, the team has 6 characters with bonus point abilities, and 29.9k Pure points.

jbnlw9zg9UVBkT_e.jpgjMt2dRI9jv0vu_e.jpg

^This was done with my normal 'max pure stat character w/o bonus point skills. As you can see, even without FC, or even close to a 200 combo, I managed to beat the other team by 15k points. The difference between the two teams is about 1800 pure points, in favor of the no-point-bonus team, so it seems that points and the 1.1 bonus are really important. Both teams used an SR Pure for friend boost.

 

This team has 31.7k points and 3 girls with bonus-point abilities.

 

I'll be testing a little bit more in the future, but the fact that I can get a 80 lower combo and still beat my score by 15k with a higher point team versus a better-ability team shows to me which is more important in the scoring.

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The appeal bonuses are pretty insignificant IMO. As for raw stat vs correct attribute, I tested it since I had someLP to spend. These were the results.

Correct Attribute

tTYc5b1.jpgvJza60o.jpg

Raw Stat

mZwtqrM.jpgzmZP4Ib.jpg

Not a big difference here, and in this particular song, there's very few notes that come to the off-attribute cards. I couldn't keep the number of greats the same, so knock off a few hundred, maybe a thousand and they're pretty equal, considering in this song, very few notes are in the two off-attribute's lane. If you have a well evey distributed song, the correct attribute seems to be superior to slightly higher stat.

disclaimer: This test and conclusion can be totally wrong, but it's just what I got from these two attempts of the song.

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I actually forgot a game-changing factor: I think it says something about the bond bonus only being applied if the card color matches the song. With this, the threshhold for usefulness of swapping out matching colors is likely to be higher.

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