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Story Decision  

6 members have voted

  1. 1. Story

    • Okami's Story
      1
    • Stanley's Story
      1
    • Arturia's Story
      0
    • Okami's Idea of Arturia's Story
      6

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And by the way, before getting to much into the plot, wouldn't it be better to think about the characters background a bit more? Like... What kind of life did they lead before entering that cave? Where they nobles, middle-class or poor? Did they have enough freedom to just walk around and enter a cave whenever they wished, or did they have to sneak out? How was the military academy? Did any noticeable events happen there that changed their personalities or the way they thought? Did they try to find out what happened to their families after joining the academy, or to contact each other in some way after leaving it?

 

And what kind of life have they led after leaving the academy? From what you said it seems that Orion's group had a relatively easy life, but what about the others? Do they have field experience? Had they ever witnessed someone die, or killed someone themselves? And how are they seem by their companions, the nobles and the people in general? Are they looked up at, or treated as tools? Are they satisfied with their current positions, or the ways of society? Do they try to rise in the ranks or to obtain more power? (I feel that at least Mahiro would do it) 

 

And the most important question: do they have some greater objective? Or do they just obey orders and try to stay alive? What are their priorities? Would they put themselves, their orders, their friends or their beliefs above the rest if they had to choose?

 

I know I'm asking too many questions and I might be a little obnoxious, (please tell me I'm not) but I feel that thinking more deeply about the characters backgrounds would help get a better grip on them. I heard so many times in acting classes (and read it in Stanislavski's "An Actor Prepares" and "Building a Character") about how important it is to detail characters and make then unique, and especially about how important objectives are that it got hammered down pretty deep in my head. ^^;

 

 

PS: Could you do a world map with the 3 countries territories?

 

PPS: I think it would be more interesting if each country had their own architecture, clothing and political system. Like one country being a monarchy or triarchy and having the royalty as the ruling class, one of them a "democracy" in witch a small group of people make all the important decisions (or the media is controlled by a small number of people, and the rest just go with whatever they say its right) and one a matriarchy ruled by a "descendant of the sun goddess" or something. Or one of the countries could be ruled by a supercomputer... Whose decisions would actually benefit it's programmers or the people who hired them. By the way, in what year is the story set again?

 

PPPS: Damn, this is a long post...

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Zucco I agree with you that we need deeper characters backgrounds but since we agreed to devote faw latter chapters for their childhood and days at the academy I thought I should leave thouse parts to when we get to that point (At this part I was planing to write thouse chapters in the 2nd volume after chapter 6 where they would acounter their friends in a battlefield). And as for their days before that I left them out with an excuse that they don't remember much before that day as they were only 5-6 but I also planned to add one of their days before that very important as it would turn out that one of them (Probably Noel) has a oni-chan that she forgot about but to give him big rule latter on as it would turn that after everything happened he got himself mixed with cannibals and eventually become their leader witch is big problem as he would be very god strategiest. As for their objectives I also thought to reveal thouse latter as the story progresses, and as about how they are treated I already told that Apachi warriors aren't treated like slaves and tools but are highly respected.

 

As for a map I will do after I finish writing faw more chapters, I also toth about having map but don't expect quality art I will just draw things as positions of cities, rivers, mountains, territories etc. It will fall upon you to make it look good. :rolleyes:

 

About each faction having their own architecture, clothing and political system it did cross my mind but I wouldn't go to deep into it as it would be too hard to put everything into manga and not go too far from the original story, I also would leave aristocracy and nobels to each 3 factions.

 

 

Now for character designs.

 

I really like #3 Minami true I think her drawing from a side needs some work.

For Noel I love her #1 design I don't know why you think that it didn't turn out so well I would definitely go with it (If anything I like how #1 Noel disain turned up the most of all characters).

#2 Hiori not bad but I think it could be improved, same goes for Akeno.

As for Orion I would definitely go with #5 one without bangs.

 

Also You forgot about Ririn she is MC too.

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About the character backgrounds... What I meant is that you yourself should have a really strong grip on the characters before writing the story even if you don't write down every detail about then. (Albeit I would appreciate if you did write as much about then as you can before it got to the drawing stage, since it would be really helpful when drawing their expressions, postures, mannerisms, etc. What you don't write down, I will try to make up as I draw and hope it turns out consistent with the following chapters  ^_^) Having deeper backgrounds would help making more interesting characters that act in more unique ways. And knowing their objectives also add consistency to their actions. Well, you can write things in whatever order you prefer, and you don't really have to tell us the answer to every question I asked right now. 

 

 

Just an example from "Building a Character". Well... this book is actually a guide for actors on the stage, but I think most of what the author says also applies to manga.

"It's possible to portray a character in general terms - a merchant, a soldier, an aristocrat, a peasant, etc. for the purpose of superficial observation of a series of categories into which people were formerly divided, it is not difficult to work out striking mannerisms, and types of carriage. For example, a professional soldier as a general rule holds himself erect, marches around instead of walking like a normal person, wiggles his shoulders to show off his epaulets, clicks his heels together to make his spurs ring, speaks in a loud, barking tone out of habit. A peasant spits, blows his nose without handkerchief, walks awkwardly, speaks in a disjointed manner, wipes his mouth on the tail of his sheepskin coat. An aristocrat always carries an top hat, wears gloves and a monocle, his speech is affected, he likes to play with his watch chain or the ribbon of his monocle. these are all generalized cliches supposed to portray characters. They are taken from life, they actually exist. But they do not contain the essence of a character and they are not individualized.
(...)
Other actions, who posses more acute powers of observation are able to choose sub-divisions in the general categories of stock figures. They can make distinctions among military men, between a member of an ordinary and a guard's regiment, between infantry and cavalry, they know soldiers, officers, generals. Among merchants they distinguish small shop-keepers, traders, department-store owners. They know what reveals the identity of an aristocrat and tell whether he belongs in the capital, in the provinces, is of Russian or foreign extraction. They endow the representatives of these various groups with features which are characteristic for them.
(...)

In the third category of character actors we find a still more heightened, detailed sense of observation. We now have a soldier with a name, Ivan Ivanovich Ivanov, and with features not duplicated from any other soldier. Such a person is undoubtedly still a military figure in general, but he is indubitably a plain soldier and, in addition, he possesses an individual name."

 

About the treatment of Apachi Warriors, 

I remember a character saying they where highly respected, 

(I wold give the rational analyses to Mahiro and that "We can do it!" speach to Orion)

but I was not sure if it was just the way the general population saw then or if they where respected by the authorities as well. Especially after you sent Kouga and Noel to fight a force 10 times their number. (It could be taken either as a sign of great trust or as an suicidal order) Also... They basically being foreign mercenaries and all, isn't there any resistance to then from any sector, and are they as loyal to their factions as the soldiers who spent their entire lives in then?

 

As for the days of the past...

Well, no need to go too deep into them, but I think that knowing a little bit about their childhoods (at least their social status) would help in describing their days in the academy, as well as the cavern scene.

 

 

As for the map... Thanks, I would appreciate that! No need for anything fancy,  i will try to make it look good later  ;)

 

About the different architecture and clothing for each faction, 

I don't think it would distance the manga from the original story... There is no need to describe everything in the manga like a novel, for instance. I can just try to make up something as I draw (albeit it would give quite some work... I hope somebody can help me with the drawings, or else we will have to choose between it looking unfinished or taking forever to draw each chapter. Also, the more the merrier! Arturia, krill, mellowmadman... anyone?)

 

Well, it might be good to use similar political systems.

 

About the characters design, 

I fully agree with you on Minami, Hiori and Akeno. Not sure about Noel though... Guess I will just try to make something we are both satisfied with. Wich one did you like better,

Arturia?

 

Oh, and I didn't forgot Ririn, I just meant that, if even it's not used in the final version, at least there is a design for her. 

 

Ps: I'm curious... Where are you from?

(Don't answer you are from The World God Only Knows)

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Hey sorru just got off work..

 

About the designs..I loved most of them and among them

 

Minami #3

Noel #1

Hiroi #2

Akeno's is alright, just feel like somethings is off though..

and Orion's version with  a but shorter hair, sorry can only see two and dont know which is which..

 

Okami, YOur story is flowing greatly, I feel like it would be rather simple to add it to manga, and that way it would be easier for the artists..

In regards to drawings, I would ofcourse like to help out, and since there has been alot of effort you two have put into this,  although i already mentioned that Okami is leading the story writing, i think Zucco should lead the artists..

Well thats how i view it xD..This is a Manga by us for us..so mostly you can go with whatever you feel like it and if the majority dont like it we can change it slightly..

 

Previously mentioned i think, i said that i could probably only draw faces although they are Orignal works of mine randomly thought of and drew them, When i had a character on screen or know of, the drawing feels smoother and can easily go further then that..

So with these character ideas, and designs, im sure i can help out with a bit..

 

In regards to Backgrounds, i still need someone to fill that spot..

SO if anyone who is reading this still would like to help out with this...just reply..

 

In terms of the map, I feel like setting it in a differant type of world would be best...Not like the world, Like COde Geass where there was those type of Factions but set in our world...

More like 4 Continents maybe 5, with multiple islands and such...Maybe you could say its similer to Earth but not entirely..THis could add to the Sci/fi genre..

 

About the Backgrounds, I do aswell think that Backgrounds build a story, Like my "Into the Night" i am working on..I worked on the Background first and the characters came from there..

Although most people like to write a certain way, Although my way/Zuccos or your way Okami, it would all be great and write your own way...If it needs changing then we will..

 

 

 

Ugh going to end this post here,,FIngers hurting as i had just burnt them with hot water and then had to type this out xD...

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I thought It might be better to have at lest first Volume written before going into background and other details that you mentioned but if both you and Arturia are agreeing that we should do that first then ok I will put writing chapters to staled and write thouse details first.

 

Arturia if you remember I mentioned in background part one (History of the world) that because of nonstop nuclear explosions during world war 3 world geography changed so that way we can have our own world while that being real world at a same time.

 

I will later check all questions Zucco has given and try giving explanations to most of them.

 

As for where I am from I tend not to mention it as lots of people are looking down on a country that I am from and with the reason too as it's not really a great place to live to say at least. There is also a fact that my country has been at war with USA just a decade ego and I wouldn't want people from there to have grudge against me because of where I live while I myself don't like it in a first place. But if you are really interested then ok I will tell you I am from Serbia.

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THats cool..I actually hardly know much about Serbia..

 

As with the Background, i think what zucoo means is that we could get the background information just for us, Not part of the storys plot...More like for our information only that will gradually be introduced into the story..
Well thats how i meant it to be xD.

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Cool indeed... looks like we have quite a diverse crew here! If MellowMadman11 join us, we will only be missing someone from Asia, Oceania and Antartica! : ) 

 

I also don't much about Serbia... Have to look it up.

 

As with the Background, that exactly what I mean, Arturia! And thanks for going along with it, Okami, tough I'm starting to feel a little bit like i've kinda been forcing my way of thinking on you...  :ph34r:

 

 

ps: About Orion's Design...  The one above, with spiky hair, is #5 and the one bellow, with shorter hair, is #8. I like how both of them turned out,  but I think #8 fits the setting better...  

 

pps: About how the work on art should be divided, I was thinking of doing the rough sketch of a few pages and sharing them with everyone so we can discuss it before moving on to the next fase. Then, I could draw the characters on some of the pages, while Arturia draws character of other pages. I was thinking of just drawing above photos for some backgrounds, or even using the photos themselves when appropriate. (Always from free image sources, like http://free-images.gatag.net/en.) Here is an example: (A scene from Bakemonogatari I starded drawing a few days ago but got too lazy to finish)

 

bakemonogatari_hq_page_01_by_zucco1-d716

 

On the other hand, assuming that we are amateurs and making something simpler like Chikan Otoko with only minimal work on the backgrounds could get things moving a lot faster, and the plot and characters are the most important part of a manga anyway. Either way... It might be better to just try doing it in both ways (maybe changing it depending on the importance of the scene) and see which works better!

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Here are some answers to a Zucco questions. (I will do this in a term of Q&A)

 

Q: What kind of life did they lead before entering that cave?

 

A: They don't remember much before that and I would stick with that.

 

Q: Were their nobles, middle-class or poor?

 

A: Since Their families where workers at neutral dig I would say middle-class.

 

Q: Did they have enough freedom to just walk around and enter a cave whenever they wished, or did they have to sneak out?

 

A: Considering that this was just one of smaller caves not too important I would say that they could enter when they wanted there weren't any police that forbidden to do so true they might still have to sneak past their parents.

 

Q: How was the military academy?

 

A: I have already written about this. It was rough but feir, First year was hardest before they passed Trials and prove them self but after that they goten more privileges.

 

Q: Did any noticeable events happen there that changed their personalities or the way they thought?

 

A: Yes offcourse it could be even said that this was where they were made into wath they are today, and most influence had a their first year and Trials as many things happened for thouse 3 mounts at trials. Trials were also a place where they had to kill somebody for a first time.

 

Q: Did they try to find out what happened to their families after joining the academy?

 

A: Their parents were dead, killed in the attack at a dig they always knew this, and they didn't have any other close families or even if they did they didn't really gotten a chance to do it.

 

Q: or to contact each other in some way after leaving it?

 

A: They swered that they will find each other one day but for a time they had to continue with their lives, they also didn't have any means of finding each other even if they wanted.

 

Q: And what kind of life have they led after leaving the academy? From what you said it seems that Orion's group had a relatively easy life, but what about the others?

 

A: Orion group had lived pretty easy lives as I said before, Noel group was the same with exception that they spend more time around military stations while Orion group spend more time around nobeles. For Mahiro and Minami it was slightly different as they were sent on missions even before the war and they have spent alot of time on missions but beside that they still had an easier life than at the academy.

 

Q: Do they have field experience?

 

A: I would sad that Trials could be considered field experience but if you are thinking about after getting out of academy then still yes except while Noel and Orion Groups have started being send on missions just after war started Mahiro group has been sent on missions even before so they have more field experience.

 

Q: Had they ever witnessed someone die, or killed someone themselves?

 

A: Yes, First time at a Trials but after that many times too, It is war and they are soldiers. Soliders who hesitate to kill when needed aren't soliders.

 

Q: And how are they seem by their companions, the nobles and the people in general?

 

A: One thing is the same for all 3 factions, good soliders are respected and everybody knows that Apachi warriors are one of the best.

 

Q: Are they looked up at, or treated as tools?

 

A: They are looked up at.

 

Q: Are they satisfied with their current positions, or the ways of society? Do they try to rise in the ranks or to obtain more power?

 

A: They are moustly satisfied with their current positions but it is always good to obtain higher ranks if possible true some of them might want it more then others.

 

Q: And the most important question: do they have some greater objective?

 

A: One of their higher objectives that they all share is to unite themselves one day, other then that some of them have other objectives in mind too (But that part needs more work, I have some ideas but I need to put everything together before I can write it).

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Wow, you actually answered every question... Thanks!  :)

 

Oh, just one more thing... Where their personalities more or less the same when they where kids,(Minami being upbeat, Mahiro kinda cold, Kouga a quite kid, etc.) or did some of them go trough a really major change? 

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Just stopping by to give my suggestion..In terms of Nobles and them living with satisfaction...Also with them being revered above other soldiers..I would like to suggest that later on in the story, one of their higher officer's ordered them to kill a friend(Might be one of the Mc or a friend from a journey), but then they refuced and that would lead to some conflict between them...Later they would abandon their Faction and decide to go on a search for the rest of their friends..Maybe one day they reunite apart from two..They swear to reunite and go against the three factions..in my opinion you could have a big Objective their xD but this thought came to mind when was reading earlier.

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Zucco I think that there personalities didn't change much just evolved when they got older with the exception of Hiori who was really quiet as a kid but changed later.

 

Arturia I actually had something other planed to give cannibals bigger role with them uniting in big numbers and being led by god strategist + eventually getting their hands on batter weapons they would for the first time become a real treat for 3 factions and then alot of interesting things happening with 3 factions for the first time having enemy other than one of the other two factions. But if you insist I will try to add that to a story too.

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I am finally able to get more time to this project as i have finally resigned...i am going to go into Photography course this year so i can have more time for this..
Soon i will try and get a few pictures of the characters in my design, just to show you if you would like me to help ya with the characters and such Zucco.
And Okami, Likewise...If you want help with a certain part of the story i am always here xD..
I will Try and think up a few ideas for later story and midway...

by the way how far and how is the first couple of CHapters going Okami..Theres no rush, but if we can get some chapters, we can move onto Page layout and changing the story into Manga format..Then we move onto Art and Background...

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I haven't done much work lately, I have some private things to take care of so I will probably be on staled for a few more days, my current progres is at the beginning of chapter 3. But as soon as I finish thouse things I will give some more time to writing and I will share evry chapter as soon as I finish it.  So expect chapters coming in a faw days (4-5 days moust).

 

PS: True, I will always have time to come and check out topic for new ideas or/and new art and give my opinion on them.

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Arturia, its good that you will have more time now. I look forward too seeing what you can do!

 

Bu the way, I know most of those drawings are 2 years old, but at least from what I've seem in "Forming a VN Team" you can do pretty well. Especially in the full body ones, despite what you said. Just try to pay a bit more attention to proportion when drawing the faces (you tend to draw the lips to low and the eyes to small... nothing that can't get better by following some tutorials. If you want, I can try to find some I used before. Also, coping drawings from artists you like is REALLY helpful!)

 

And don't worry to much about whether our drawings look the same or not. This is not a commercial manga. Like you said before, this is a manga made by us, for us. I want us to have fun while making it. And the more people taking part in the process, the merrier. And the more fun we have, the more fun the people who read it will have!... Probably. 

Also, I'd rather not assume too much responsibility... Especially since I draw way too slow, and it will take forever if I'm by myself...

:rolleyes: 

 

PS: This is all assuming you want to help with drawing the characters! If you would rather concentrate on something else, just say it!

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Well i wanted to give a try at my style drawing your character design...I tried Minami but i felt like my hand was shaking a bit to much so i couldn't draw the lines too great.

Also i know some proportions  are off especially the eyes but this was a rough one in a way..

DSCF0061.jpg

 

Sorry mind the Yellow in it..i just got this camera today so i havent really gone into the settings..

I will try the other characters soon.

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Well i wanted to give a try at my style drawing your character design...I tried Minami but i felt like my hand was shaking a bit to much so i couldn't draw the lines too great.

Also i know some proportions  are off especially the eyes but this was a rough one in a way..

DSCF0061.jpg

 

Sorry mind the Yellow in it..i just got this camera today so i havent really gone into the settings..

I will try the other characters soon.

No, I definitely like this. Seriously it looks good, but different from other stuff. super cool

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Thanks Arakura..

 

By the way Okami.. Um i would like to help write the story, but since i am unable to help much with the chapter you are on except with some hints and suggestion's..So i would like to suggest if i can write on a part later on in the story, or maybe a Remembrance  for some of the Mc's..

 

Anyway hope all is going well..

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Thanks Arakura..

 

By the way Okami.. Um i would like to help write the story, but since i am unable to help much with the chapter you are on except with some hints and suggestion's..So i would like to suggest if i can write on a part later on in the story, or maybe a Remembrance  for some of the Mc's..

 

Anyway hope all is going well..

 

 

I think that it might be a better idea for you to write dialogs for chapters that I already written as it seems that my English sounds weird (which I don't really notice myself) so it might be better for you to write dialogs. True if you prefer to write chapters I can give you a short info on how will story progres true 1 and the second volume (10-12 chapters) so you can write 3rd one.

 

As for things that I need to take care of, you see true, I live alone in a pretty big house, this house is actually only half mine and half is of my cousin who has another house in which he lives, but as we are not on good terms, we are going to sell a house split a money and witch my half I will buy smaller house that will be just mine. And there is alot of paperwork that's needs to be dealt with especially so when I have to take extra preciousness so he can't screw me up as trust between as is 0%. True it is only a short version.

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I managed to find some time to draw a Map that Zucco asked for.

Here's some notes about it.

I made it 8000x6000 resolution so wath you don't see to read you can just open it in full size.

R1, R2, R3, etc. Are the regions of factions, the bigger number of regions means bigger influence so capital is always in biggest number.

Right now I put only most important things in the map I think that we could latter expend it, like for example, we put a world map with only the most important things on it at the end of the first chapter and then at the end of evry chapter we add map as the last page of part where that chapter is happening. (For example, in the second chapter, we put map of Yorkwing in thrid map of Vileor later when the story moves to Rapista we made map of Rapista etc.) As I think this would help to add depth to a story.

I didn't mention Dead islands before they are islands (continent) that nobody goes to as they are full of radiation (Something like Chernobyl) and they won't be important before 4th volume.

 

MAP

507_Untitled_5.jpg

 

Any questions just ask.

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Well firstly i would like to ask, is this the World Map or just a part of it. Well secondly, i think a bit more land would be great, the Neutral seems to be too plain with just a desert as there Biome. One thing we could add which might seem cliche, is like a Neutral town in the middle for trade, but due to the neutral state, there is alot of background dealings and bad wronging. One thing i am also concerned in terms of the map is that the three nations are surrounded by the ocean. Although i do like how the three territories are nicely placed.

 

I like your map, The type of World i envisioned was, Three continents... one has Raepista, one is neutral and the last one has Midoristal and Rouria(Although they are quite a distance from each other and then we could have the Dead islands scattered around the world, Due to radiation...(say the history of that could be, they built nucleur power on the islands away from civilization but due to the previous war they were targeted by all sides and that then gave them the radiation that is not accessible.

 

One a side note, we could mention that one of the children's ancestors were involved in the building and living near the nucleur plant, and if you do wish to add those islands to the story, that child could find a lost memory there.

 

 

But of course these are just ideas of mine..No need to take them to heart.

 

Anyway good work.

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Yea, it is a world map, true not everything is on it, I draw only the most important things like positions of factions their regions and positions of cities in the witch beginning of the story is happening. As I said I would add more as the story progresses (like in games when you can see world map right at the beginning, but you get the details and cities only one's story moves to that part of the map). And yea, I thought about adding a neutral town too, just true, I thought of making it into poor town where people who were banished from their factions live and making it into some kind of cyberpunk style (true that part is still in progres). As for dead islands I already had a plan about how to add it into the story as I have a general idea about how will first 4 volume's progresses. I will write wath I had in mind for dead islands later going to sleep now.

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First of all, sorry for taking so long to answer the posts.

 

Thanks for the map, Okami! (Wow, the geography really changed a lot after the war... is this really the Earth?) Also, I really like cyberpunk! But it looks complicated to draw... Well, I guess I will try to learn how to do it.

Could you give a brief description of the climate of the places where the story takes place? I want  to use it as a reference when drawing the backgrounds and clothes. Oh, by the way, what are R1, R2, etc? Something like administrative estates?

 

And Arturia, the drawing is good, but I'm glad you agreed to write the dialogues. Could you post it when you've written the cavern scene? I want to try drawing it! No need to rush it, thought... And about the writing style, I think you should just write in the way you like best!

 

Now, the drawings:

 

Minami

minami__fuwanovel_creation_11__by_zucco1

She looks a bit more mature than intended...

 

minami__fuwanovel_creation_14__by_zucco1

 

 

Noel

noel__fuwanovel_creation_13__by_zucco1-d

Basically, the same as Noel #1, just drawn better. I like her better this way. I'm putting the original down for comparision

 

 

fuwanovel_creation_08__noel__by_zucco1-d

 

Hiori

fuwanovel_creation_09__hiori__by_zucco1-

hiori__fuwanovel_creation_12__by_zucco1-

 

I like #3 the best.

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