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littleshogun

Nekonyan's Two December Announcements

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I guess they ran into problems with the gamedevs since there is no game announcements like they said

But Yeah confirmation that Steam is still a dick for no reason :vinty: and they are delaying the game release till late January

Also update on the Fureraba fandisk that will be coming within a month or so as well (Cant wait! :Chocola:)

 

 

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1 hour ago, Stormwolf said:

Well, steam should act professional and actually give developers a reason for removing a game on steam. Deleting and ignoring sounds pretty childish.

Steam gave a reason... it's just a bad one. And judging by the letter some other dev posted when they got hit in this wave of bans, they not only gave a reason, they said "don't even try to resubmit this game" in the rejection notice, so it's almost expected that they wouldn't get a response? So, I dunno. I feel like they covered their asses, at least, on the "professional" side.

That said, the decision is still bat-shit crazy. Banning a game because it's got anime art and is set in a school is galaxy brain-level thinking.

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Well I guess it's quite a hard choice if they really want to release the hard copy, because it mean that they must not adhere to their original policy for not using crowdfund. Although apparently it'll be for the last resort only, because they say that they'll eventually do hard release without crowdfund after two successful big release. In the end, I guess it's up to them of how they'll do it because they say that they'll leave it to the fan, and if the fans were disagree with crowdfund then they won't do that although in turn it'll take longer time to release the hard copy. Personally to me I didn't care much about hard copy, but if you want that perhaps it should be an interesting news.

Back to topic, and as for the announcements in the end what we can do here is just wait and see for now. Hopefully it wouldn't took long time for the wait.

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1 hour ago, Antera said:

Might be unpopular opinion but I believe they should not waste resources for Hard Copies. (for now) 

Should only be unpopular among those who wabt to buy them, but i honestly doubt they'll make much if any orofit from hard copies.

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7 hours ago, Stormwolf said:

Should only be unpopular among those who wabt to buy them, but i honestly doubt they'll make much if any orofit from hard copies.

There will be almost no profit and lots of time/energy/resources wasted. they need to establish themselves more before thinking about hard copies 

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On 12/9/2018 at 4:32 PM, Kiriririri said:

Confirmation they don't know how to business :miyako:

You know, I'm usually a lurker and made an account just for this, but do you really have to be Fuwa's resident 'Negative Nancy'? Glancing at your profile, everything you post is usually either negative or bashing people for not learning Japanese. Just why be so negative, that just leaves a person to feel negative. (Wasn't going to mention but you said "All porn in VNs are gross" yet have a purple-software looking character as profile avatar and, correct me if I am wrong, their games contain a LOT of sexual content having played ChronoClock and Hapymaher.) Can we just make this a nice place that doesn't have the toxicity of Reddit?

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32 minutes ago, Rancelover935 said:

You know, I'm usually a lurker and made an account just for this, but do you really have to be Fuwa's resident 'Negative Nancy'? Glancing at your profile, everything you post is usually either negative or bashing people for not learning Japanese. Just why be so negative, that just leaves a person to feel negative. (Wasn't going to mention but you said "All porn in VNs are gross" yet have a purple-software looking character as profile avatar and, correct me if I am wrong, their games contain a LOT of sexual content having played ChronoClock and Hapymaher.) Can we just make this a nice place that doesn't have the toxicity of Reddit?

About Kiriririri, let's just say that this meme should be appropriate response to your post here. I agree though that we should try to make this place not as wild as Reddit, along with 4chan as well even though it might be hard to do. By the way, about Kiriririri himself I think the mods were pretty much already got used to it and gave some appropriate warning when his behavior was cross the line, so you didn't need to worry about that. That said I understand though if you felt put off by the negativity, because you kind of want to run away from Reddit's negativity there. So in the end, what I can say is that just don't bother by Kiriririri's post (Just think of it as bad meme if you felt negative) and just move on, even if I'm not the one who should tell you this. And yeah Kiriririri's avatar is Toriumi Yuuko from Hapymaher FD in which it's Hapymaher's fandisc that was still untranslated.

As for hard copy, while granted it's more expensive than soft copy and thus did have potential to bring more money, I agree with the opinion that Nekonyan here shouldn't be bothered by hardcopy because it would be too much effort for a new company. Also if we took a look at Sekai's case, we can say that most of their KS problem were in regard of the hardcopies promise which mean that it's quite difficult to do. Also if we see Frontwing cases, they crowdfund for every hard copy (Granted they sor of abused crowdfund as pre-order store, but still) which proved that hard copy need a lot of budget. As far as the company who managed to consistently produce hard copy, I think so far it's only JAST that managed to do it although it also came with other problem that they have though namely that their releases is quite sparse compared to even Sekai. In the end, I'll leave the hard copy decision to Nekonyan there and hopefully they already have some insight of how difficult it'll be to produce one.

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50 minutes ago, littleshogun said:

And yeah Kiriririri's avatar is Toriumi Yuuko from Hapymaher FD in which it's Hapymaher's fandisc that was still untranslated.

You mean the fandisc that contains sex scenes? Man, he really shouldn't contradict himself. Maybe he's been "gotten used to" but I do believe that he needs to be positive more, if we wanted negative nancies and toxicity we would just scurry on over to 4chan where you get called a retard for asking questions about a VN.  Actually taking the time to look at his profile, its easy to see he plays either devil's advocate/prince or neutral in most cases. Consistently bashing NekoNyan doesn't help anyone either(They are a new startup from this year, of course their business wouldn't be the level of MG in such a short time along with bashing them because they don't have progress on a few titles when they are consistently progressing other titles farther ahead ), or wishing people do not join the VN community or etc. That just doesn't represent the greater VN community and probably wouldn't be a good thing for new users to be seeing so often, even if he's just taking the piss most of the time when posting, it still just makes him seem even more mean-spirited. I guess the "Trash" rank above his avatar doesn't lie to anyone....

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10 hours ago, Rancelover935 said:

You know, I'm usually a lurker and made an account just for this, but do you really have to be Fuwa's resident 'Negative Nancy'? Glancing at your profile, everything you post is usually either negative or bashing people for not learning Japanese. Just why be so negative, that just leaves a person to feel negative. (Wasn't going to mention but you said "All porn in VNs are gross" yet have a purple-software looking character as profile avatar and, correct me if I am wrong, their games contain a LOT of sexual content having played ChronoClock and Hapymaher.) Can we just make this a nice place that doesn't have the toxicity of Reddit?

This post was mostly a reference to something I have said before when Nekonyan was formed and how they gave out many big promises that other companies have failed to deliver before and everyone bought what they said. I knew that they can't do it and look at where we are now. They confirm they can't do it.

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Nekonyan deserves to take flak for this.  In January when they first launched, they sure talked big about Japanese companies disliking localizers 'relying on Kickstarters', even though only two VN companies have a history of that.  They went on about it at some length.  Then it turns out that running a company is harder than talking trash, so before they've even released all their initial announcements they're turning to Kickstarter.

I'm glad they're around and releasing games. Even with them and Sol Press new on the scene, there's still far too many good games to ever have all of them released.  But the least they could do is acknowledge they publicly and disdainfully denounced a practice they're now considering embracing not even a year later.  Just pretending the first statement never happened isn't fooling anybody.

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7 hours ago, Nandemonai said:

Nekonyan deserves to take flak for this.  In January when they first launched, they sure talked big about Japanese companies disliking localizers 'relying on Kickstarters', even though only two VN companies have a history of that.  They went on about it at some length.  Then it turns out that running a company is harder than talking trash, so before they've even released all their initial announcements they're turning to Kickstarter.

I'm glad they're around and releasing games. Even with them and Sol Press new on the scene, there's still far too many good games to ever have all of them released.  But the least they could do is acknowledge they publicly and disdainfully denounced a practice they're now considering embracing not even a year later.  Just pretending the first statement never happened isn't fooling anybody.

Anyone with a passion for something that wants to turn it into a business will find out that it takes a lot to be able to run a business than just passion. Whether or not they denounced kickstarters, I read that they'll only consider that for physical releases, not for funding the TL of games(Why waste money on physicals people won't buy?). Also, people change, it is literally human nature to do so. If they changed their minds and believe they need the crowdfunding to have a physical release because they don't have thousands of dollars of spend on getting physical releases because their company is new, then so be it. They never promised physicals in the first place, if we are going that far back in the first place. I don't believe they deserve the flak, considering their releases are of good quality and they are going to deliver a ton of new titles that probably would not have been TL'ed. 

 

10 hours ago, Kiriririri said:

This post was mostly a reference to something I have said before when Nekonyan was formed and how they gave out many big promises that other companies have failed to deliver before and everyone bought what they said. I knew that they can't do it and look at where we are now. They confirm they can't do it.

They are a new company, literally not even a year old. How is that even reasonable? Do you understand how capitalism even works? You need money to make money, considering the people from NekoNyan were fan translators to begin with they probably weren't making 100's of thousands of dollars. Upkeeping a business with license fees, website prices, payment processing and other avenues that present expenditures really tend to drain a company's wallet. They literally said they are waiting for feedback about whether or not to use crowdfunding as a way for people to get physicals. That isn't hitting the big red "GO" button and letting them go crowdfund every single game they are translating, considering all TL'ed games really didn't do this. Even if they are struggling, every company struggles in the first year . MG? Just read their first translation release. Sekai? Don't get me started. SakuraGames? How are they even still managing to make it? MoeNovel? We all saw how censored and destroyed they made their TL'ed releases. I could go onto more but literally all of these companies were struggling at one point or another, and some still are. Also, c'mon, if you could run a business any better, please go create one and prove me wrong. 

Edited by Rancelover935

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3 minutes ago, Rancelover935 said:

They are a new company, literally not even a year old. How is that even reasonable? Do you understand how capitalism even works? You need money to make money, considering the people from NekoNyan were fan translators to begin with they probably weren't making 100's of thousands of dollars. Upkeeping a business with license fees, website prices, payment processing and other avenues that present expenditures really tend to drain a company's wallet. They literally said they are waiting for feedback about whether or not to use crowdfunding as a way for people to get physicals. That isn't hitting the big red "GO" button and letting them go crowdfund every single game they are translating, considering all TL'ed games really didn't do this. Even if they are struggling, every company struggles in the first year . MG? Just read their first translation release. Sekai? Don't get me started. SakuraGames? How are they even still managing to make it? MoeNovel? We all saw how censored and destroyed they made their TL'ed releases. I could go onto more but literally all of these companies were struggling at one point or another, and some still are. Also, c'mon, if you could run a business any better, please go create one and prove me wrong. 

Sorry that I hurt your Kittycat feelings bruh but this isn't about if they are new company or not. This is all about them first basically shitting on other companies doing this and that and how they will be so great and better. In the end they will do just the same thing as the other companies did and this just shows they had no idea how to do this business. If it was doable the other companies would have done it too first.

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39 minutes ago, Kiriririri said:

Sorry that I hurt your Kittycat feelings bruh but this isn't about if they are new company or not. This is all about them first basically shitting on other companies doing this and that and how they will be so great and better. In the end they will do just the same thing as the other companies did and this just shows they had no idea how to do this business. If it was doable the other companies would have done it too first.

Hm. But by their own assessment, they don't need to crowdfund. In time, they will supposedly have the funds to fund these physical copies without crowdfunding. This is more a case of "We've invested more into new releases, but this means physical copies will be delayed. Physical copies are not only more expensive to produce, there are less purchasers for these, and they often have no profitable return. The only way we can deliver these now is through crowdfunding. We ask the community, do you want these now, even if it means resorting to crowdfunding?" (my interpretation of the announcement).
Also, I think the context is somewhat different. They were firmly against constantly crowdfunding their releases. They still are. What was annoying and betrayed a lack of confidence in a company's ability was crowdfunding as default funding method for releases. But they are not saying they will crowdfund all (or any) of their releases; they are only considering crowdfunding physical copies, a far more expensive investment with less return.

I will not elaborate on how crowdfunding physical copies is essentially a pre-order system with a threshold that indicates whether the printing costs will cover themselves through guaranteed sales.

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The problem is this is what they actually said:

 

But before we talk about individual titles, I would say it's important to first off all talk about ourselves -- NekoNyan. You see, all of us had been pretty dissatisfied with how things were going in regards to the Western VN/eroge market. It just felt like many -- not all -- of the only few localizers don't really have a passion for what they're doing, nor do they seem to actually understand much about it.

We talked to many of the Japanese devs, and the truth is (unsurprisingly), they had been getting the same impression. That whole KS practice that just came to be the default for most companies is anything but liked over in Japan. One company we talked to said it'd feel like those localizers are trying to span a safety net, which would, in turn, give off the impression that they don't really believe in their title(s), nor care.

..

All right, let me now quickly share with you guys how we're planning to go about things in general, and the direction we want to take this endeavor.

...

- No crowdfunding. The first few releases have already been fully funded using our own, private money, so no worries there. We're likely going to offer pre-orders, though, and throw in some extras there for those who really want to support us ahead of release. Don't worry though, pre-order bonuses will also be included in all purchases up to a few weeks after release.

Edited by Nandemonai

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Just now, Nandemonai said:

The problem is this is what they actually said:

 

But before we talk about individual titles, I would say it's important to first off all talk about ourselves -- NekoNyan. You see, all of us had been pretty dissatisfied with how things were going in regards to the Western VN/eroge market. It just felt like many -- not all -- of the only few localizers don't really have a passion for what they're doing, nor do they seem to actually understand much about it.

We talked to many of the Japanese devs, and the truth is (unsurprisingly), they had been getting the same impression. That whole KS practice that just came to be the default for most companies is anything but liked over in Japan. One company we talked to said it'd feel like those localizers are trying to span a safety net, which would, in turn, give off the impression that they don't really believe in their title(s), nor care.

..

All right, let me now quickly share with you guys how we're planning to go about things in general, and the direction we want to take this endeavor.

...

- No crowdfunding. The first few releases have already been fully funded using our own, private money, so no worries there. We're likely going to offer pre-orders, though, and throw in some extras there for those who really want to support us ahead of release. Don't worry though, pre-order bonuses will also be included in all purchases up to a few weeks after release.

Indeed. Which is why they're asking their community instead of just going ahead and doing it because it's more economically viable.
If fans really do believe that that stance is one they should keep, then keep it they will. If the fans don't mind bending, they don't either. I do not see what is so wrong about a person/group changing their opinion with time. In this sense, I understand what Kiriri meant, though it is not I would've worded it. Instead of "they don't know how to business", I'd say "They now have a better grasp of the economical realities and understand that crowdfunding could open more doors.".

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55 minutes ago, Kiriririri said:

Sorry that I hurt your Kittycat feelings bruh but this isn't about if they are new company or not. This is all about them first basically shitting on other companies doing this and that and how they will be so great and better. In the end they will do just the same thing as the other companies did and this just shows they had no idea how to do this business. If it was doable the other companies would have done it too first.

Once again, you ignore the meat of what I said and go off on a tangent. The other replies literally say exactly what I did. They aren't considering using crowdfunding for the actual digital release like Sol press did for Newton No Ringo. Only for physical copies, once again. Completely ignoring what I said about the costs is pretty dumb, but do you honestly wholeheartedly think a company will deliver all of its promises in only under a year? Now had it been three years and they've completely changed to crowdfunding maybe your argument would have substance but the glass is honestly empty.

Two replies above me literally explains that discovering that crowdfunding might be more viable if the community wants the physical releases that bad. Not that they are going to fund translations through that method. It's pretty clear that this company and a few other indie devs and translators have their heart in the community and not in their wallets. Are you just intentionally being like every shitty Slice-of-Life protag, or is just fun being that mean-spirited online that you just get a rush out of being toxic?

You paint the picture like NekoNyan is intentionally going behind the backs of consumers and slitting throats. Like I said before, if your model of running a VN translation company is better, please prove me wrong or stop shitting on companies that are way more honest than nine tenths of all companies in the world today. Geez man. 

Edited by Rancelover935

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