Have you ever read a VN in which one of the heroines was secretly depressed/traumatized/borderline suicidal etc., and while doing her route, you helped her get over the depression/come to terms with the trauma/find a reason to live?

[Stormwolf]

2 minutes ago, ittaku said:

Depends on how the other routes are written in the background. I prefer it if it's implied the other heroines have their issues solved/attended to in some other way. The one I'm currently translating does that. You see the other heroines you haven't chosen quietly get better, even if you have nothing to do with them. I much prefer this, but it's also the hallmark of many games that have no bad endings which is also something I prefer.

It does kind of make the struggle the protagonist have with the heroine to help her deal with her problems pretty damn pointless though.

[ittaku]

1 minute ago, Stormwolf said:

It does kind of make the struggle the protagonist have with the heroine to help her deal with her problems pretty damn pointless though.

Nonsense, it's just an alternate universe execution. If you prefer to have them all die around you instead, that's your prerogative but I certainly don't want that.

[Stormwolf]

43 minutes ago, ittaku said:

Nonsense, it's just an alternate universe execution. If you prefer to have them all die around you instead, that's your prerogative but I certainly don't want that.

Alternate universe execution. Yes, lets just agree that when playing a vn we're dealing with alternate universes as well. Let's just agree with disagree.

[Corrupted]

On 12/3/2018 at 11:22 PM, Thyndd said:

To be fair most "depressed" heroines are not really depressed in the clinical sense; most of the times there's a situation that if properly addressed will naturally lead to an improvement.  

Yeah see, that was one with actual depression

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And no amount of help could help her in the end. That's unfortunately as realistic a portrayal as it gets 

 

Spoiler

I second that thought about DDLC feeling realistic. That one was so powerful because that's the more realistic end for people with depression; they never actually get over it. No fun to think about it, but once humans get mental illness it's all over more often than not. We are such fragile beings. We certainly can't be magically saved by some random lover like a VN MC; someone trying to help is just going to make things worse like it did for Sayori. We can only hope to slowly heal with time, or mitigate the symptoms with medicine.

 

DDLC Spoilers ^. I came to the tread looking for a troll who would suggest DDLC as a good read for someone trying to get over depression. Was disappointed. 

[Thyndd]

6 hours ago, Corrupted said:

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I second that thought about DDLC feeling realistic. That one was so powerful because that's the more realistic end for people with depression; they never actually get over it. No fun to think about it, but once humans get mental illness it's all over more often than not. We are such fragile beings. We certainly can't be magically saved by some random lover like a VN MC; someone trying to help is just going to make things worse like it did for Sayori. We can only hope to slowly heal with time, or mitigate the symptoms with medicine.

 

DDLC Spoilers ^. I came to the tread looking for a troll who would suggest DDLC as a good read for someone trying to get over depression. Was disappointed. 

That's the thing, isn't it. Depression as a mental illness is not a mood. It cannot be cured by the "power of love" any more than a flu can. It is however possible to offer love to sick people so that they feel cherished and more relaxed. It won't heal them per se, but it definitely will make the healing process a lot more bearable.

Edited December 8, 2018 by Thyndd

[Naterocks2000]

Was going to quote somebody but felt what I was going to say was better off not in response to anybody. I said on here before that I have been in a relationship with someone who had depression, and it wasn't a lie. The feeling of having to worry about someone who is very mentally unstable and could opt to take their own life without you around is something I will never forget. That, at least compared to what I have read in either manga or VN form, has never been properly conveyed.

As others in the thread have mentioned before, love cannot cure depression. It can make things much more bearable knowing that at least one person cares whether you are alive and breathing or six feet under. Sometimes, it may even lessen the impact depression has, though, I can't prove that but can base it on what she had said to me at times. In my experience, being close to somebody with depression leaves yourself vulnerable to feeling-like/becoming a victim to it. At times, the worry you feel, or anxiety can literally make you sick. In my case, I had really bad insomnia because I would worry she'd text me a goodbye letter or something of that nature, or when I was in her room I could easily find pills, razor blades, and other items that could cause serious bodily harm to her (Yes, she did go to a psychiatrist but nothing they gave really changed her besides making her into a vegetable for hours on end, and most of the time worsening her condition).

It can really weather a person's mental state, both having depression and staying close to one with it. That's not to say depression is that person's fault or that they aren't worth caring for, hell I loved her and stayed with her for 7 years and wasn't the one that gave up on the relationship. The amount of times I thought I would never see her again, or that I would hear she was put into the hospital for attempting to end her life and the way it made me feel can only be described as agony. It is a trauma I don't like to think about, that is why Yume Miru Kusuri struck a chord in me when I played through it. 

(Just wanted to say that it wasn't my intention to make this into a sob story of myself but more as a post of awareness about how depression can seriously impact people and their loved ones. Oh, and that the VN way of "MC love cures all" is bullshit and I wish more realistic depictions like mentioned previously in the thread were more frequently used.)

Edited December 9, 2018 by Naterocks2000

[alpacaman]

The way a depression evolves in most cases doesn't lend itself to a three act story structure that well. Light depression either disappears by itself or after a short time of psychotherapy and doesn't make for an especially interesting narrative anyway. Medium and heavy depression either takes several months to years of therapy (sometimes supported by medication) to cure or at least for the patient to be able to handle the illness properly and improvements usually happen incrementally and wavelike so it doesn't fit the typical "something sad happens but it helps the character find their determination" third act. And as soon as you reach a degree where the character has suicidal episodes the author needs to have lots of skill and tact, and in my limited experience being tactful is not the strong suit of most VN authors (at least in Japan).

Another thing is that the way characters work in Japanese VNs and anime often follows a rather simple cause and effect logic. The reason someone doesn't act "normal" almost always has to do with some event or circumstances in their past, so either eliminating the cause or or at least changing the character's view on it "cures" them. This might make engaging fiction, but it's not the way depression works. Depression can be triggered by specific events, but you can't cure it by having someone change their view on something or life in general (at least in its more serious forms).