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Is Kindred Spirits similar to SeaBed?

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Because I just finished SeaBed a few moments ago and I can definitely say, I really don’t like too much slice of life elements. I like it when it’s in small doses while a PLOT is going on. Because that’s what I think Slice of Life excels at. When it’s small and used to calm down after intense moments happen, however SeaBed was so much Slice of Life that, I just wanted it to be over. I think the VN was not for me. I like down time for my waifus and husbandos, but that shouldn’t take up 90% of the VN run time. 

There are exceptions, such that it’s a comedy. Being that the Slice of life moments are hilarious and I can just turn my brain off while reading. 

During one of my previous posts, everybody were recommending KS, but the caveat was that it was light on plot. And I was like, oh dear, I don’t wanna read another SeaBed. There has to be a yuri VN that has a solid plot line that will hook me in. 

SeaBed’s characters don’t even go through a character where they completely change by the end of the VN. So, I am left feeling like....nothing. Contrasted to what I felt after Subahibi. There was quite a bit of yuri romance in that VN. Especially Zukaro x Kimika. 

Another drawback of SeaBed, is that we don’t really see Sachiko and Tanako develop their feelings for one another since they are childhood friends. Which is weird because a good chunk of the VN is in flashbacks and them spending time when one another. 

I just want a yuri for 2019 where Girl meets Girl, develop feelings, shit happens, and they overcome that shit because of their love for each other. I am crying at some point. They live happily ever after because I chose the right route. 

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Only played Kindred Spirits, but to compare to what you want: Various stories where Girl meets Girl, develop feelings, and that's it. You're going "awww" at some point because of the cuteness. There is character development, but it pretty much comes down to "lesbian in denial to lesbian" or "frigid lesbian to lesbian".

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Kindred Spirits is a good feels and relaxation game. Play it if you just want to kick back and have a very pleasant time.

There's no super involved plot or anything, but I wouldn't say it has no story. It's a series of romance stories, where the characters' relationships are developing on a pretty regular basis. Like, genuine development instead of them just hanging out for a while before spontaneously hooking up. It's really well-done, while still largely avoiding groan-worthy melodrama.

I wrote a review for it a few years ago: https://fuwanovel.net/reviews/2016/03/16/kindred-spirits-on-the-roof/

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One is psychological drama/mystery and the other lighthearted romance. They could only be further apart if Seabed was a guro horror TBH, but both are excellent games in their own right. :wahaha:

EDIT: BTW, I'm a bit lost on what you're exactly looking for... If you want a strictly plot-driven yuri VN, where romance is not really the focus but is somewhat decently developed I guess Fatal Twelve and Aoishiro are your best bets. If you want to see the romance blooming throughout the game, Kindred Spirits, Highway Blossoms and Lonely Yuri are good choices, although they don't include any intense drama or drastic character development.

Flowers is maybe the yuri series most concentrated on character development, but it's also super melodramatic and not really that concerned with plot progression...? 

And if you're looking for "Subahibi but full yuri", I don't think that exists or will ever happen.

Edited by Plk_Lesiak

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3 hours ago, Plk_Lesiak said:

One is psychological drama/mystery and the other lighthearted romance. They could only be further apart if Seabed was a guro horror TBH, but both are excellent games in their own right. :wahaha:

EDIT: BTW, I'm a bit lost on what you're exactly looking for... If you want a strictly plot-driven yuri VN, where romance is not really the focus but is somewhat decently developed I guess Fatal Twelve and Aoishiro are your best bets. If you want to see the romance blooming throughout the game, Kindred Spirits, Highway Blossoms and Lonely Yuri are good choices, although they don't include any intense drama or drastic character development.

Flowers is maybe the yuri series most concentrated on character development, but it's also super melodramatic and not really that concerned with plot progression...? 

And if you're looking for "Subahibi but full yuri", I don't think that exists or will ever happen.

I am a bit lost here too.  Why is plot and romance mutually exclusive in this context? In my head I was thinking of a VN like where character x and y, would have a goal to accomplish. Save the world, Become billionaires, or something like get recover from a traumatic event. The goal can be anything but while they are trying to do that, they develop feelings for each other, shit happens, insert tearjerkering moments, character development and the typical GOOD END, BAD END, stuff. At first I thought flowers would be a good contender, but you mentioned that it’s not really concerned with plot progression....? Ok? 

 

So, I am not looking for “Subahibi but full yuri”; I know that doesn’t exist, but there has to be a “Fate/Stay Night but full yuri” or anything similar to that. 

 

Plus, Seabed is like 99% light-hearted. You’re making it seem as though it’s dramatic, but it really wasn’t. Hell even the TIPS scenes barely had any drama. There were only like two scenes where I felt dramatic tension, and the rest was your standard slice of life stuff. Plus the mystery is really weird, because what’s the mystery, the prologue establishes something, but by the end of it, there’s no reveal. It’s not like you have an “aha!” Moment when reading SeaBed.

 

(Sidenote: has anyone seen Maria Watches Over Us, because if Flowers resembles that, then crap. I have to keep looking :wafuu:)

 

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4 minutes ago, Happiness+ said:

I am a bit lost here too.  Why is plot and romance mutually exclusive in this context? In my head I was thinking of a VN like where character x and y, would have a goal to accomplish. Save the world, Become billionaires, or something like get recover from a traumatic event. The goal can be anything but while they are trying to do that, they develop feelings for each other, shit happens, insert tearjerkering moments, character development and the typical GOOD END, BAD END, stuff. At first I thought flowers would be a good contender, but you mentioned that it’s not really concerned with plot progression....? Ok? 

What Lesiak was saying is that in Kindred Spirits, Lonely Yuri and Highway Blossoms the romance is the main part of the plot. It's like the "goal" of the game is for the couple/couples (KS have more than one) to realize they love each other and get together happy. That's it. Even if there's something more, the deal of the game is to read for the romance progression.

Although you mention "recovering from a traumatic event", so maybe you're okay with some mundane drama?

I wanted to recommend Nurse Love Addiction, as there are some plot going on there, but the common route can be quite heavy with SoL, so I don't know what you'll think of that. Fatal Twelve is also a good choice, as it's very plot driven, but it can be a bit too light in the romance part.

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I think it's very tough to get a yuri VN with both a good measure of plot (not counting romance plot) AND romance. Given that your example is Subahibi, perhaps go for something that may be considered light on romance, but still classes as yuri? These are outside of my own personal knowledge, but seem like good contenders and have all but one been mentioned in this thread or your previous one: Katahane, Aoishiro, Ne no Kami, Fatal Twelve and The Shadows of Pygmalion.

Edited by Sayaka

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10 hours ago, Happiness+ said:

I am a bit lost here too.  Why is plot and romance mutually exclusive in this context? In my head I was thinking of a VN like where character x and y, would have a goal to accomplish. Save the world, Become billionaires, or something like get recover from a traumatic event. The goal can be anything but while they are trying to do that, they develop feelings for each other, shit happens, insert tearjerkering moments, character development and the typical GOOD END, BAD END, stuff. At first I thought flowers would be a good contender, but you mentioned that it’s not really concerned with plot progression....? Ok? 

I think it's a bit of a genre trope. Yuri is a relatively small niche and that by itself means less variety, and just as Maggie elaborated, many of those highly-rated yuri VNs are pretty much collections of well-written, romantic fluff, that skip on having a goal other than bringing the characters together. Those that focus on the plot, on the other hand, like Fatal Twelve or Shadows of Pygmalion, are simply light on romance. 

You stressed satisfying relationships in your post a lot and it just happens that yurige don't seem to combine those with a compelling intrigue that often (if ever). Even Flowers, which I personally adore, is more about interactions between the characters, their backstories and many small subplots rather than the overaching story (especially the first episode). It flows at a very relaxed pace with myriads of SoL scenes and occassional drama/mystery. It's beautiful to watch and quite enthralling with its characters, but don't really follow the setup - conflict - resolution rythm. It might indeed have more in common with an episodic SoL anime than the kind of hypothetical VN you tried to describe.

Edited by Plk_Lesiak

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8 hours ago, Happiness+ said:

I am a bit lost here too.  Why is plot and romance mutually exclusive in this context? In my head I was thinking of a VN like where character x and y, would have a goal to accomplish. Save the world, Become billionaires, or something like get recover from a traumatic event. The goal can be anything but while they are trying to do that, they develop feelings for each other, shit happens, insert tearjerkering moments, character development and the typical GOOD END, BAD END, stuff. At first I thought flowers would be a good contender, but you mentioned that it’s not really concerned with plot progression....? Ok? 

In most cases the main point of Yuri is to portray a relationship between girls (and it doesn't even have to be strictly romantic or sexual), so having a traditionally really involved plot is not that essential, and would sometimes even be a detriment. Works with heavier focus on plot do exist to some extent, but are definitely rarer and even more so if only looking at (translated) VNs.
Plus like any genre Yuri has it own tropes, customs and aesthetics, and SoL-like low-key and mundane character interactions is definitely one of them. I personally believe that this is one of the best ways to actually develop/present characters, but each to their own. Subtle ambiguity in the relationships is also one of the charming characteristic of Yuri, so if you are looking for strong conclusions Yuri might not be for you.   
 

8 hours ago, Happiness+ said:

Plus, Seabed is like 99% light-hearted. You’re making it seem as though it’s dramatic, but it really wasn’t. Hell even the TIPS scenes barely had any drama. There were only like two scenes where I felt dramatic tension, and the rest was your standard slice of life stuff. Plus the mystery is really weird, because what’s the mystery, the prologue establishes something, but by the end of it, there’s no reveal. It’s not like you have an “aha!” Moment when reading SeaBed.

SeaBed doesn't have explicit "drama" because all of the characters refuse to needlessly dramatise their situations. Throwing a fit, wallowing in sadness or confronting someone wouldn't help anything. That doesn't mean there isn't any drama, the character obviously grieve and feel lost inside, it's just not presented as explicitly as you would normally expect. SeaBed is purposefully very passive and low-key. Same with the mystery. There are definitely answers, but once again they are not just thrown in the face of the reader, and solving the mystery isn't really the point of the story. 

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Shadows of Pygmalion is not what you describe, but it is yuri and chuuni and heavily oriented towards overcoming plot things. I say it's not what you're looking for because it's a 15+ game, not 18+, and it's not nearly as interested in romance as it is in plot (though there is clearly a bit of crushing going on and one very hot kiss to keep you warm at night). I really enjoyed it, at any rate: https://fuwanovel.net/reviews/2017/03/08/the-shadows-of-pygmalion/

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On 12/3/2018 at 4:49 AM, Turnip Sensei said:

SeaBed doesn't have explicit "drama" because all of the characters refuse to needlessly dramatise their situations. Throwing a fit, wallowing in sadness or confronting someone wouldn't help anything. That doesn't mean there isn't any drama, the character obviously grieve and feel lost inside, it's just not presented as explicitly as you would normally expect. SeaBed is purposefully very passive and low-key. Same with the mystery. There are definitely answers, but once again they are not just thrown in the face of the reader, and solving the mystery isn't really the point of the story. 

That's not the case. Most of the VN is slice of life stuff. I am not saying they should dramatize all of it but the my gripe is that most of the VN is filled with stuff that's not character development nor pot stuff. Just mundane things. I mean every visual novel has SOL elements KnS, Higurashi, etc but SeaBed was just filled to the brim with it. Solving the mystery is not point of the mystery? ehhhh, I think that's but much. It's one thing for a VN to leave readers wondering, but SeaBed has too many of those questions. When it didn't warrant it. Without spoiling it, there's literally several questions that are left unanswered and you spent the whole VN WAITING for those questions to be resolved and they never do.... :<( I mean.... I feel like I should just write a spoiler-filled review on SeaBed to air out of all my feelings. While the VN is still fresh on my mind.

 

On 12/2/2018 at 6:41 PM, MaggieROBOT said:

What Lesiak was saying is that in Kindred Spirits, Lonely Yuri and Highway Blossoms the romance is the main part of the plot. It's like the "goal" of the game is for the couple/couples (KS have more than one) to realize they love each other and get together happy. That's it. Even if there's something more, the deal of the game is to read for the romance progression.

Although you mention "recovering from a traumatic event", so maybe you're okay with some mundane drama?

I am okay with some mundane drama. I just cannot deal with all of the SOL. It bores the shit out of me. What got me into seabed was that earlier this year @Turnip Sensei recommended it. I was in artsy visual novel mood. I bought SeaBed and let it sit on my Steam page for a while because I was reading subahibi and KnS2. Then I started reading it at the beginning of this fall semester, I didn't how heavy the SOL elements were until like 10 hours into reading.

On 7/9/2018 at 1:03 PM, Turnip Sensei said:

SeaBed is other worthwhile option, bit unusual and potentially really thought-provoking VN too. SeaBed ditches most of dramatic elements you would expect from a mystery, or just any story in general, and delivers a hypnotic story with dreamy, diary-like narration about coping with loss and living with your problems. 

Wow. This comment is really telling given the context lolz. Honestly, from this comment I was under the impression that it was going to be some deep sea mystery yuri VN. Man, was I wrong. 

On 12/4/2018 at 5:08 PM, Rain Spectre said:

This video does a pretty good job of explaining why people, namely yuri fans, like SeaBed. 

Yeah, I saw that video when it was uploaded it before I read SeaBed and after it. I was motivated because I wanted more mystery. I love mystery. I also love yuri. But slice of life, not so much. I love Zeria as much as the next person, but I really expected more of a mystery yuri drama from that review. Even if it was slow paced. But, my gripe is that it takes forever for stuff to happen. You really don't get a great deal of drama here in this VN. In other words, the seriousness of the situations are meh.

 

On 12/2/2018 at 8:15 PM, Plk_Lesiak said:

I think it's a bit of a genre trope. Yuri is a relatively small niche and that by itself means less variety, and just as Maggie elaborated, many of those highly-rated yuri VNs are pretty much collections of well-written, romantic fluff, that skip on having a goal other than bringing the characters together. Those that focus on the plot, on the other hand, like Fatal Twelve or Shadows of Pygmalion, are simply light on romance. 

You stressed satisfying relationships in your post a lot and it just happens that yurige don't seem to combine those with a compelling intrigue that often (if ever). Even Flowers, which I personally adore, is more about interactions between the characters, their backstories and many small subplots rather than the overaching story (especially the first episode). It flows at a very relaxed pace with myriads of SoL scenes and occassional drama/mystery. It's beautiful to watch and quite enthralling with its characters, but don't really follow the setup - conflict - resolution rythm. It might indeed have more in common with an episodic SoL anime than the kind of hypothetical VN you tried to describe.

Given your comment and everyone elses comment. Yuri is built in with certain cliches that lends itself more into the SOL category. Honestly, that's weird. However, I understand. Damn. I really thought the yuri genre would at least have one VN that's more action based.

 

I really appreciate everyone's comments, there's a winner.

 

On 12/4/2018 at 7:42 PM, Fred the Barber said:

Shadows of Pygmalion is not what you describe, but it is yuri and chuuni and heavily oriented towards overcoming plot things. I say it's not what you're looking for because it's a 15+ game, not 18+, and it's not nearly as interested in romance as it is in plot (though there is clearly a bit of crushing going on and one very hot kiss to keep you warm at night). I really enjoyed it, at any rate: https://fuwanovel.net/reviews/2017/03/08/the-shadows-of-pygmalion/

Yeah, I am going to read that. I don't care for adult content. I found this VN after trying the Fuwa recommendation system. So when I came back this post, I wasn't suprised when everyone else was recommending this too. I am a bit upset, because I feel like I am settling here. Even though, I had really broad scope. A VN that's a yuri with plot. I am going to take a look at Nurse Nurse Addiction

 

On 12/2/2018 at 6:41 PM, MaggieROBOT said:

Nurse Love Addiction, as there are some plot going on there, but the common route can be quite heavy with SoL

I will take a look at it. If the common route is quick and easy, that's nothing. I just don't wanna  another 90% SOL VN. SeaBed is 15-20 hours long. Yet, it took me about a semester to get through it all. Meanwhile Kara No Shoujo 1, I read that in 2 weeks. Easily. All of the routes.

 

On 12/4/2018 at 12:15 PM, Okarin said:

I wonder why everyone praises SeaBed, must be the dreaded "Subahibi effect".

I generally want my mysteries to be more engaging and better written.

For real though. I completely agree.

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Maybe I should have stressed the Slice of Life elements of SeaBed more when I recommended it...
 

15 hours ago, Happiness+ said:

That's not the case. Most of the VN is slice of life stuff. I am not saying they should dramatize all of it but the my gripe is that most of the VN is filled with stuff that's not character development nor pot stuff. Just mundane things. I mean every visual novel has SOL elements KnS, Higurashi, etc but SeaBed was just filled to the brim with it. Solving the mystery is not point of the mystery? ehhhh, I think that's but much. It's one thing for a VN to leave readers wondering, but SeaBed has too many of those questions. When it didn't warrant it. Without spoiling it, there's literally several questions that are left unanswered and you spent the whole VN WAITING for those questions to be resolved and they never do.... :<( I mean.... I feel like I should just write a spoiler-filled review on SeaBed to air out of all my feelings. While the VN is still fresh on my mind.


For me SeaBed is very special because how mundane and noncommittal it is. Slice of Life to it's logical extreme. It's sometimes boring and nothing happens, because life is like that. There's lots of random flashbacks to old vacations and other events, because remembering fun times of past helps to forget the what ails you at the moment. Many of the conversations are pointless, because that's what conversations usually are and people still like to talk to each other. And like I've said before, there is hardly any explicit drama, because no-one wants to make a huge show of themselves. It's easier to suffer inside, downplay own problems, smile and assure to people around you that you are fine. Isn't that what most people do in their lives?

But I can understand that for many people this might feel like a betrayal, or why they would find it hopelessly uninteresting. Even the narration is passive, dry, and lacks emotion, and while that can be attributed to Sachiko's mental state, it doesn't make it very exiting. SeaBed challenges many of the traditional rules storytelling and writing, so it's no wonder that everyone doesn't like. But criticising it for not fitting with your expectations or usual norms, is kind of besides the point. SeaBed wants portray the lives of the characters in all their mundaneness (what else would life be?), and I think it does that effectively and well, even if it's not what is normally expected. Not that this is going to make the story any less boring for someone who already finds it so, but I think it is important to understand. 

I feel it's really encouraging to have a touching story about loss and living with your problems to be so mundane. Why does every story have to be exciting? Are you not allowed to grieve without being dramatic about it? Even something like character development is questioned. No-one is going to stay exactly the same, but the changes are often subtle, ambiguous. Traumatic event doesn't mean you have to change as person. It's okay to be you.
"Mystery being not the point", is maybe too strongly worded, but SeaBed isn't interested in taking delight in plot-twist or grand conclusions, like mysteries usually are. For the most the characters aren't even really interested in solving or chasing it either. The mystery is more like a basic framework for the story to function. There's still interesting revelations, subtle hints and foreshadowing if look closely enough (I'm pretty sure I missed some), but on a grand scale of things the mystery is not what matters.
But that doesn't mean the story of Sachiko's silent anguish, Takako struggling with losing her memories, and Narasaki's tragic burden is less meaningful. On the contrary, I think SeaBed is effective and important because of it's life-likeness, for better or worse.
 

Anyways, that's just how I feel. If you have questions about unanswered mysteries, I can try to help.

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