Regarding MoeNovel and what can be done.

[adamstan]

Well, if you don't like the game - don't buy it, that's easy. However all that talk about "giving an example", "fighting the censorship", "long term consequences" seems little too far-fetched to me.

Princess Waltz is very old game - it was licensed to JAST before Pulltop decided to do localizations themselves. I can't agree that it's better to not have any Pulltop translations, if they won't be +18. Bad translations are different thing. As I remember reading somewhere on VNDB forums, the problem is that Pulltop/Moenovel outsources all their TL work - so the quality is totally random. Here's quote from vndb (dk382 and Pabloc)

Quote

The way agencies like AGM work (which staff moenovel in its entirety) means that you will get a random selection of translators every time. You should not try to establish any sort of quality trends with Moenovel, because they always use a different group for every translation, and they're usually bad. It's a pull of the slot machine, basically, and the odds are weighed to be bad nine times out of ten.

To make things worse, each random translator form this selection deals with a random fragment of the script. They either don't have access to other scripts, or they just don't bother to read them. And since guys at AGM don't seem to know what "editing" or "QC" even means, I'm pretty sure not a single person involved in the translation actually knows the entire story.
Considering how heavily JP relies on context, even that alone would be disastrous. And now add bad translators and rushed deadlines to the mix... >_<

But still - I think ASFOS is good game on its own, even without h-content. Recent "Adventure of a lifetime" was decent too - and it cannot even be called censored, as JP version is all-ages too.

As long as they provide decent replacement for h-scenes, so the story isn't disrupted (like they did with ASFOS, as opposed to wild and random cutting that happened to Konosora), I'm okay with it.

44 minutes ago, Nandemonai said:

Giving MoeNovel money will only tell them that their current strategy of releasing badly-translated censored games is working.

I read that their version of "Cross Channel" turned out bad, so I'm not buying it. But bad "Cross Channel" translation isn't a reason to not enjoy the other releases that - maybe by luck or chance - turned out to be OK. So I will give them money only for decently-translated censored games And, as I said above, the censorship has to be performed skilfully as well.

It think what it boils down to is this - for me, not all h-scene removing is equal to "butchering the story".

Edited June 5, 2018 by adamstan

[Funyarinpa]

I think the only surefire answer is that the genre needs time to mature in the West. Sure, VNs -even translated ones- have been around a long time, but it's staggering to think how few high profile VNs received an official localization before the last, say, three years. 

Scummy companies like MoeNovel is part of the birthing pains of any budding industry, particularly any artistic niche. This doesn't justify what they do, but rather it's to show that we need the industry to branch out a bit more to be more inclusive, easier to participate in, and start to generate some amount of competition to the point we can freely choose to not support any work by MoeNovel or their like and still have tons of works to look forward to.

[bakauchuujin]

16 hours ago, Funyarinpa said:

This doesn't justify what they do, but rather it's to show that we need the industry to branch out a bit more to be more inclusive, easier to participate in, and start to generate some amount of competition to the point we can freely choose to not support any work by MoeNovel or their like and still have tons of works to look forward to.

I feel like we have now probably goten to the point where there is enough competition for this. Mangagamer has increased the amount of good titles they release, same with SP and Jast turn out a new title once in a blue moon. There is also Frontwing and Visual Arts who want to bring over their VNs to the west. Also there are some new companies with interesting titles like Sol Press and Nekonyan. Then there are also companies linked to kickstarters like Degica who are responsible for localizing the Muv-Luv series, Views Co. Ltd responsible for Dies Irae. The ones I mentioned are just the ones I could think of at the top of my head and I know that there are more localizers out there that localize their titles better than Moenovel. Also I would like to mention that the amount of votes Moenovel's recent titles have goten on vndb has been abysmal, so this means that they likely sell very few copies to the core VN fanbase.

Edited June 6, 2018 by bakauchuujin

[Dreamysyu]

1 hour ago, bakauchuujin said:

the amount of votes Moenovel's recent titles have goten on vndb has been abysmal, so this means that they likely sell very few copies to the core VN fanbase.

Or it could mean that people who buy these VNs don't even know that vndb exists, or, at least, don't have accounts there.

[bakauchuujin]

19 minutes ago, Dreamysyu said:

Or it could mean that people who buy these VNs don't even know that vndb exists, or, at least, don't have accounts there.

I said core VN fanbase, not overall sales. Pretty much the people who know enough to know about the options available. My post was about people having enough options to choose from so that if they are informed they can choose to not buy from Moenovel. Those who are not familiar with vndb likely don't know what is available to them. It was not meant as a claim that they had abysmal sales.

[phantomJS]

1 hour ago, bakauchuujin said:

I said core VN fanbase, not overall sales. Pretty much the people who know enough to know about the options available. My post was about people having enough options to choose from so that if they are informed they can choose to not buy from Moenovel. Those who are not familiar with vndb likely don't know what is available to them. It was not meant as a claim that they had abysmal sales.

The reason people keeps buying from Moenovel may not be simply be because of a lack of alternate options.

I think Pulltop titles have a rather distinct feel when compared to other VN companies titles (I'm saying this having read through Kanojo to Ore to Koibito to, Kono Oozora both EN versions, Koisuru Natsu no Last Resort, Cross Channel, and Haruka ni Aogi Uruwashi no). If someone is looking for mainstream or pulltop specific titles in EN, then they are stuck with Moenovel. MG titles are clock full of nukiges, JAST and SP have niche titles (with the exception of saku saku, which is the closest EN VN I can think of which is pulltop-like), all of which may not appeal to Moenovel's target audience.

Anyway, a bad TL should be more than enough to stop steam users from buying Moenovel stuff from our perspective, but that clearly did not happen and has no signs of happening anytime soon. If those horrible TL did not stop people from buying their releases, what makes you think having more options (and educating people of those options) will 

Couple all of these with the fact that most anything on MG, SP, and JAST are far more expensive than Moenovel's stuff, I don't think their sales will drop anytime soon, and hence Moenovel (and their business practices) are here to stay for quite a while, sadly  ...

Edited June 6, 2018 by phantomJS

[Freestyle80]

I just dont buy their releases, i played both of their games through other means 

 

rather support even Sekai instead