VirginSmasher Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 hours ago, bakauchuujin said: As long as they are able to gain money they will continue doing localizations this way. I think we should be vocal in trying to convince other people not to buy from them since the longer they are alive the more titles they will ruin. Even if we do, Steam VN fans are too stupid and will buy the VNs anyways. It's what keeps MoeNovel alive after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antera Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 35 minutes ago, tymmur said: History tells otherwise. Back in the early 80s, video games started to earn a lot of money. Some rich investors in New York figured it would be easy money. They bought some game companies and started some new ones. They didn't understand why people would buy and assumed people would just buy anything. Atari got bought and profits increased. The programmers/game developers asked for a pay rise, but was denied because "they were people working in a production line and were no more important than the people putting the games into boxes". The elite/veteran from the development department quit and formed Activision, the first company to produce games for hardware produced by somebody else (Atari 2600). Next the investors came up with the idea that since quality in games wasn't something they understood, the way to earn more was to produce more. This meant they started releasing one game each week, which meant games coded in two days. The market got flooded with unplayable games and it lead to the great video game crash of 1983. All of the "once a week" companies died, but sales of the already produced games continued at lower and lower prices. With the flooding of really cheap junk games, the quality games at $50 or whatever became so hard to sell that quality companies started to die as well. While many sources states this to be a worldwide event, it was actually an American thing as only NTSC games were affected. Europe was protected due to PAL only hardware. In short: don't underestimate the foolishness and destructive power of corporate ignorance. It may have happened a long time ago, but investors with cash and no insights appears over and over to cause chaos as many times as possible. I believe Moenovels damage in containable due share fact that VN market is still niche market (growing but not that big yet). main base already knows how bad Moenovel is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakauchuujin Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, tymmur said: In short: don't underestimate the foolishness and destructive power of corporate ignorance. It may have happened a long time ago, but investors with cash and no insights appears over and over to cause chaos as many times as possible. Ye corporate people only care about earning money as quick as possible, stability is not something they generally consider at all. If you look at the US the banks are doing all they can to remove the regulations implemented due to the last crash. This means that they are doing all they can to make sure they have no regulations even if it is sure to cause a new worldwide ecconomic crash. Ofc some companies care more about quality and building a reputation, usually smaler companies not connected to investors. In terms of VN companies I would say a company like Mangagamer is an example of a company that cares much for their reputation and fans, basically they have a passion for VNs and would rather build a reputation over a longer time to earn money even though it might not maximise money in the short run. Moenovel seems to be the oposite, they only care about maximising their profits as fast as possible. Low prices does well on steam and they know that. I am not sure as to why they don't do 18+ patches but my gues would be that they don't because in that case the japanese fanbase would complain that western people got a better deal. This way they don't destroy their already build trust from the japanese fanbase while maximising their profits from the west atleast until their bad rep potentially hurt them, which they probably don't care much about because the english base is just a quick cashgrab to them. Ofcourse the reason I proposed is just a specualtion, but it makes sence in regards to how they wrote about the japanese edition of the Lovekami spinnofs being powered up version (including 18+ content). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernoplex Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, tymmur said: In short: don't underestimate the foolishness and destructive power of corporate ignorance. It may have happened a long time ago, but investors with cash and no insights appears over and over to cause chaos as many times as possible. Ah, you do have a point there. I am not familiar with 80s and 90s game industry but still, I want to believe that corporate greed knows its boundaries somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veshurik Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 I already send a ton of sacrasm messages to MoeNovel and try to bring his attention to it, but zero emotions... Agh... Seriously, they don't have a conscience! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakauchuujin Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Veshurik said: I already send a ton of sacrasm messages to MoeNovel and try to bring his attention to it, but zero emotions... Agh... Seriously, they don't have a conscience! If you look at their twitter it is easy to see that they only answer positive comments. Since they answer the positive ones it is clear that they ignore any form of critizism and that it is not just that they don't look at comments. Edited March 28, 2018 by bakauchuujin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirginSmasher Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 3 hours ago, Veshurik said: I already send a ton of sacrasm messages to MoeNovel and try to bring his attention to it, but zero emotions... Agh... Seriously, they don't have a conscience! My question is why are you even trying to change their mind in the first place when you know nothing will come of it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenophilious Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, bakauchuujin said: If you look at their twitter it is easy to see that they only answer positive comments. Since they answer the positive ones it is clear that they ignore any form of critizism and that it is not just that they don't look at comments. Yeah, I bash them every time they make a major announcement, and they've yet to respond in any form (which isn't really that surprising, considering I'm just insulting them). They only answer easy, positive questions that don't reference the fact that all the games they touch had porn in them at one point or that their translations are shit. If it's not praise, simple questions about releases, or fanboying/fangirling about IMMHW or one of their more recent releases, they'll ignore every comment you send their way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tymmur Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 minute ago, Zenophilious said: Yeah, I bash them every time they make a major announcement, and they've yet to respond in any form (which isn't really that surprising, considering I'm just insulting them). To be completely honest, if somebody writes nothing but insults to me, then I will ignore it. I have released software and based on experience more than 90% of the negative feedback comes from "experts" without no idea what they are talking about and they often ask for impossible tasks. If you want to say anything negative in a feedback, make it constructive feedback or you will be sure that it will be ignored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenophilious Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, tymmur said: To be completely honest, if somebody writes nothing but insults to me, then I will ignore it. I have released software and based on experience more than 90% of the negative feedback comes from "experts" without no idea what they are talking about and they often ask for impossible tasks. If you want to say anything negative in a feedback, make it constructive feedback or you will be sure that it will be ignored. I insult them because it makes me feel better. I know they won't listen to feedback and won't compromise when it comes to h-scenes, so there's literally no point in giving them constructive criticism. Like I said, they don't even respond to people politely asking if they will ever release 18+ patches for their games, so why should they listen to constructive criticism? They only exist to cut ero from WillPlus eroge, crap out a quick TL, and shove it onto Steam for a quick buck. Expecting anything else of them is pretty ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakauchuujin Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, Zenophilious said: I insult them because it makes me feel better. Personally I prefere to just talk about all the shit they do on the discussion page on steam to try to inform people not to buy from them. Also while I deeply regret having bought the Lovekami spinnoffs before I found out there would be an 18+ edition in Japan atleast that made it so I could give a negative review of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tymmur Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, Zenophilious said: I insult them because it makes me feel better. You really should think about the feelings of oth.... nahh who am I kidding? They get what they deserve (though not enough) and you benefit from it. I'm 100% with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirginSmasher Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 13 minutes ago, Zenophilious said: They only exist to cut ero from WillPlus eroge, crap out a quick TL, and shove it onto Steam for a quick buck. Expecting anything else of them is pretty ridiculous. At least it gives fan translators some noble quest to fix every VN they release, even if the VN they released is some mediocre moege. Antera and Infernoplex 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomJS Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Saw some earlier posts questioning the wisdom of steam users. I guess it's justified. I don't understand why are there so little mentions of the rubbish translation ... Based on the above, I don't think MoeNovel's activities can be stopped ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggiesGoMoo Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 1 hour ago, phantomJS said: Saw some earlier posts questioning the wisdom of steam users. I guess it's justified. I don't understand why are there so little mentions of the rubbish translation ... Based on the above, I don't think MoeNovel's activities can be stopped ... Steam users also give very positive reviews for Sakura games, which I hear are atrocious. Maybe Moenovel is just a tumor, while steam users are the malignant growth phantomJS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plk_Lesiak Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, PiggiesGoMoo said: Steam users also give very positive reviews for Sakura games, which I hear are atrocious. Maybe Moenovel is just a tumor, while steam users are the malignant growth It's all about expectations. Sakura games maybe are shitty, but they also have good art and are a cheap, convenient source of ecchi. They simply have their own fanbase of horny teenagers and pretty much no one else touches them. Hence, those people that know to avoid them don't buy them and can't write Steam reviews on them. It's a bit different with Moenovel... But seriously, the general quality of JP game localization is pretty shitty, so I don't find it strange that people outside the elitist niches like ours wouldn't care that much about it. They're not used to having anything better than just barely passable translations. Edited March 29, 2018 by Plk_Lesiak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomJS Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 5 minutes ago, Plk_Lesiak said: It's a bit different with Moenovel... But seriously, the general quality of JP game localization is pretty shitty, so I don't find it strange that people outside the elitist niches like ours wouldn't care that much about it. They're not used to having anything better than just barely passable translations. There's a difference between a barely passable translation, and a obvious MTL translation, yet most of the reviewers for MoeNovel's IMHHW release didn't mention about it at all. Why is this so? .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plk_Lesiak Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, phantomJS said: There's a difference between a barely passable translation, and a obvious MTL translation, yet most of the reviewers for MoeNovel's IMHHW release didn't mention about it at all. Why is this so? .... Was it really an MTL? I thought it was just of very poor quality. And the probable answer would be - if they're expecting shitty translations of JP games by default, only seeing a good one is something worth talking about. And well, it's not like it was the SakuraGame kind of stuff, where it's not even edited in any way - just pure, barely comprehensible gibberish. Edited March 29, 2018 by Plk_Lesiak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Poltroon Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, Plk_Lesiak said: Was it really an MTL? I thought it was just of very poor quality. And the probable answer would be - if they're expecting shitty translations of JP games by default, only seeing a good one is something worth talking about. And well, it's not like it was the SakuraGame kind of stuff, where it's not even edited in any way - just pure, barely comprehensible gibberish. The IMHHW translation was of poor quality, but not MTL. A lot of it could be understood, even. I assume it was tackled by multiple translators, and only some had no idea what English was. Nandemonai and Plk_Lesiak 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomJS Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 5 hours ago, Plk_Lesiak said: Was it really an MTL? I thought it was just of very poor quality. And the probable answer would be - if they're expecting shitty translations of JP games by default, only seeing a good one is something worth talking about. And well, it's not like it was the SakuraGame kind of stuff, where it's not even edited in any way - just pure, barely comprehensible gibberish. The common route was poorly translated. The heroines routes definitely were MTL (at least for Ageha and Asa's routes. I Bought this a while back, and deleted it having felt cheated once I went into these 2's routes). 4 hours ago, Mr Poltroon said: The IMHHW translation was of poor quality, but not MTL. A lot of it could be understood, even. I assume it was tackled by multiple translators, and only some had no idea what English was. Or perhaps the routes were so poorly translated that it felt like MTL. I still think it's MTL. Poorly translated imo is something like Edelweiss. The routes in MoeNovel's IMHHW are far worse than that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Poltroon Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 6 minutes ago, phantomJS said: Or perhaps the routes were so poorly translated that it felt like MTL. I still think it's MTL. Poorly translated imo is something like Edelweiss. The routes in MoeNovel's IMHHW are far worse than that Very terribly and poorly translated sound better to you? The translation may have been really bad at points, but it can be understood outside Ageha's route (which was not only poorly translated, it was also rewritten to remove segments. By somebody who doesn't know how to write English). Machine translation cannot be understood. As I recall, Amane's route and the twins were easier to understand than anything else on the VN. Pure machine translation it is not, but maybe it was edited from there at points? I still doubt it. I assume you simply lack experience with translations made by people who don't know English, if you think Edelweiss is nearing the bottom of the barrel. It isn't even close. phantomJS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantomJS Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 3 minutes ago, Mr Poltroon said: Very terribly and poorly translated sound better to you? The translation may have been really bad at points, but it can be understood outside Ageha's route (which was not only poorly translated, it was also rewritten to remove segments. By somebody who doesn't know how to write English). Machine translation cannot be understood. As I recall, Amane's route and the twins were easier to understand than anything else on the VN. Pure machine translation it is not, but maybe it was edited from there at points? I still doubt it. I assume you simply lack experience with translations made by people who don't know English, if you think Edelweiss is nearing the bottom of the barrel. It isn't even close. Perhaps you are right. Maybe it's just my bad luck that I choose to read Ageha's route first, and perhaps it's heavily influenced me when i tried Asa's ruote, lolz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkZedge Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 The world is in danger, hope that whatever they pull into their greedy and shitty clutches won't be anything important Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirginSmasher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 24 minutes ago, DarkZedge said: The world is in danger, hope that whatever they pull into their greedy and shitty clutches won't be anything important Ensemble isn't important. Don't worry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veshurik Posted April 2, 2018 Share Posted April 2, 2018 At least until they decide to pick up Koi no Canvas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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