Things that you want to see less of in Visual Novels

[frc_]

Oh, I forgot my biggest gripes:

Less invisible characters. Not drawing so much as a portrait for a character the MC talks with for ten minutes is plain lazy.

Less background reuse. If a route ends with a huge gathering of people in the streets, showing me the same sparsely populated road that I already saw on day one is lazy and disappointing.

Edited March 17, 2018 by frc_

[McDerpingheimer III]

1 hour ago, Dergonu said:

Less meaningless choices. I want the choices I pick to make a difference. Meaningless choices are my biggest pet peeve in VNs. Like, why are they even there?! Grrr... 

When you say meaningless choices, do you mean ones that end up railroading you into one choice (“but then, maybe i shouldn’t. let’s do x”) or ones that don’t have impact on the plot or route flags? I definitely understand hating the first kind, but I think the second kind is nice for fluff and involving you in the story a bit more.

9 minutes ago, frc_ said:

Oh, I forgot my biggest gripes:

Less invisible characters. Not drawing so much as a portrait for a character the MC talks with for ten minutes is plain lazy.

*looks at Rewrite*

Thanks Key 

[Dergonu]

7 minutes ago, McDerpingheimer III said:

When you say meaningless choices, do you mean ones that end up railroading you into one choice (“but then, maybe i shouldn’t. let’s do x”) or ones that don’t have impact on the plot or route flags? I definitely understand hating the first kind, but I think the second kind is nice for fluff and involving you in the story a bit more.

I mean choices that have absolutely no reason to be there, maybe changing one or two lines of dialogue, but not changing the route/ outcome in any way. 

A good example of this is Katahane. The game is full of choices, but 90% have absolutely no use, and only make tiny changes to the dialogue. 

Choices are there to change the outcome of the story, so pointless ones rubs me the wrong way. 

[Plk_Lesiak]

11 minutes ago, Dergonu said:

I mean choices that have absolutely no reason to be there, maybe changing one or two lines of dialogue, but not changing the route/ outcome in any way. 

A good example of this is Katahane. The game is full of choices, but 90% have absolutely no use, and only make tiny changes to the dialogue. 

Choices are there to change the outcome of the story, so pointless ones rubs me the wrong way. 

I think it depends a bit. If the game wants you to get immersed and identify with the protagonist, giving you such small, non-consequential choices has its uses. It gets you involved and lets you shape the main characters' attitude to your liking. The first Sunrider does it well in my opinion, while the choices you make in most cases don't have any bearing on the ending or on what happens in the second game, they just get you emotionally involved in the moral dilemmas and challenges the protagonist faces. The second game went to shit in my opinion also because it took away that feeling of control, even if it was always illusory.

I hate meaningful blind choices and ones that are completely counter-intuitive much more than I dislike even the most meaningless/pointless ones.

Edited March 17, 2018 by Plk_Lesiak

[Dergonu]

Just now, Plk_Lesiak said:

I think it depends a bit. If the game wants you to get immersed and identify with the protagonist, giving you such small, non-consequential choices has its uses. It gets you involved and lets you shape the main characters' attitude to your liking. The first Sunrider does it well in my opinion, while the choices you make in most cases don't have any bearing on the ending or on what happens in the second game, it just gets you emotionally involved in the moral dilemmas and challenges the protagonist faces. The second game went to shit in my opinion also because it took away that feeling of control, even if it was always illusory.

I hate meaningful blind choices and ones that are completely counter-intuitive much more than I dislike even the most meaningless/pointless ones.

To me it does the opposite. If I want to feel like I'm in control of the protagonist's choices, I need to see an actual response to that choice. Just changing one piece of dialogue in that one scene doesn't make an overall change to how the characters look at the protagnist overall. It just changes that one line, then they go back to normal. So, in turn, nothing actually changed. For me to enjoy the effect of choices, they need to actually have lasting repercussions, or else they are just pointless. So, even if they don't lead to an ending, they should show some kind of change beyond just a singular line of dialogue.

[Silvz]

1 hour ago, tymmur said:

Less violence (not counting say killing monsters)

Less cruelty

 

 

I think this is very subjective and depends on the game. Stories focused on those will obviously have them - Euphoria, Uminekoish, Swan Song, Subahibi. I agree that if the story is not about these subjects, of course there should be less. I hate when there are rape fetishes on games in general, but it is worse when they come when you didn't expect it at all. One thing that I don't remember seeing in a VN is cruelty against animals, which I'm totally against.

1 hour ago, tymmur said:

Oh that reminds me:

Less BL (at least if I'm supposed to be the reader)

Besides the whole "you don't need to read them", I don't think yaoi/BL is strong enough, at least in English, to the point people care. Of course we who want them are glad to see the genre expand, but for someone who doesn't like them, it is very hard to stumble on them without knowing. That said, I really recommend No, Thank You!!! as it has one of the greates plot developments I have seen in my VN experience. It is not the best, but it does everything right. Unfortunately, the sex scenes are not avoidable - but nothing that a skip button cannot solve.

1 hour ago, PiggiesGoMoo said:

Fewer fight scenes!!  I know I"m in the minority here, but I really think the VN format doesn't lend itself to these types of scenes very well.  The static reused CGs make those scenes seem very repetitive compared to manga and anime.  

I will say that Majikoi tries to work around this limitation in an interesting way. Rather than using CGs, it just moves/flips character sprites around on screen. I think it can get away with this because there aren't any "magical powers" AFAIK, and the fights are short.  I had a really hard time reading through the long fight scenes in Dies Irae and Sorcery Jokers, even though I enjoyed the latter overall (not the former, please don't kill me).

I think you'd like Rose Guns Days, at least regarding the fighting scenes. Instead of having them described, there is a mini game with some illustrations behind, and the achievements are nice 7th expansion easter eggs. And if you want, you can skip the mini game entirely and still have the full story, no penalties at all.

[bakauchuujin]

13 minutes ago, Dergonu said:

To me it does the opposite. If I want to feel like I'm in control of the protagonist's choices, I need to see an actual response to that choice. Just changing one piece of dialogue in that one scene doesn't make an overall change to how the characters look at the protagnist overall. It just changes that one line, then they go back to normal. So, in turn, nothing actually changed. For me to enjoy the effect of choices, they need to actually have lasting repercussions, or else they are just pointless. So, even if they don't lead to an ending, they should show some kind of change beyond just a singular line of dialogue.

I feel like it depends on how it is used. For instance I remember that in nisekoi yomeiri you have to choose yes 3 times to eat something chitoge made (think it was chocolate, been a while since it played it so not sure). In this case 2 of the choices were meaningless, but it was a fun jab at how horrible Chitoge's cooking is. Also in starless

Spoiler

when you drive away from the house the turns you take don't matter as all of them will end up making you crash, however I think it does a good job at selling how hopeless the suituation is as well as just piss of the person playing it which I think is intentional. 

 

Edited March 17, 2018 by bakauchuujin

[Silvz]

32 minutes ago, McDerpingheimer III said:

When you say meaningless choices, do you mean ones that end up railroading you into one choice (“but then, maybe i shouldn’t. let’s do x”) or ones that don’t have impact on the plot or route flags? I definitely understand hating the first kind, but I think the second kind is nice for fluff and involving you in the story a bit more.

*looks at Rewrite*

Thanks Key 

The funny thing about this is that previous games didn't have images either, but at least all characters were fully voiced, even minor side characters. It's sad that Rewrite had so many unvoiced lines, and that a relevant character, the journalist, had to wait for the newest version to have a sprite.

[Norleas]

Less " しょうがない " (can't be helped).

[tymmur]

13 minutes ago, Norleas said:

Less " しょうがない " (can't be helped).

Being part of the Japanese mentality, there is only one thing I can say about your wish: しょうがない

[DarkZedge]

less dumb protag, less childhood friends, less using the same tropes over and over, less meaningless choices, less content that feels like filler, less BL, less yaoi, less otome, more good yuri games because most are shit :T, more gameplay vns that allow you to skip battles or combat after the first time you've completed it for the consecutive re-plays, less moeges. and a lot more but can't be arsed to write down more.

Edited March 18, 2018 by DarkZedge

[Happiness+]

Less pointless H-scenes. For example, Kara no shoujo and F/SN has these sex scenes that add nothing to the plot.

At least make them skippable in dialogue, like the character can just say "no thanks."

Ever17, Higuarshi, Clannad, etc do just fine without these sex scenes.

 

If you're a horndog, then at least have the sex scenes be consequential.

For example, Like the MC gets in trouble for fornicating.

[VirginSmasher]

8 minutes ago, DarkZedge said:

less moeges

You beautiful man.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, tymmur said:

 

More traps (10000000000000000 sounds like a good number)

 

3 hours ago, tymmur said:

More Translated BL 

Fixed for you.

 

[finiteHP]

I agree with a lot of these, but I’m too lazy to list them all.  I’ll add one that only applies to OELVNs:

Less use of Japan as a setting.  This includes everyone having Japanese names in a western school.  JVNs have that setting covered.  If we want Japan, we’ll play ones from Japan.  Show us what you can do with your country and culture.

[tymmur]

5 minutes ago, SeniorBlitz said:

 

Fixed for you.

 

I'm not even going to try arguing with you. All I will say is that if all you got to support your case is some fake quotes you just made up, then you are off to a pretty bad start.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, tymmur said:

I'm not even going to try arguing with you. All I will say is that if all you got to support your case is some fake quotes you just made up, then you are off to a pretty bad start.

I'm just joking around. 

You don't have to argue or anything.

Though more Translated BL and more Traps would be nice.

[tymmur]

4 hours ago, frc_ said:

Less background reuse. If a route ends with a huge gathering of people in the streets, showing me the same sparsely populated road that I already saw on day one is lazy and disappointing.

While I mostly agree, adding tons of backgrounds with minor differences will increase the size, hence increase the need for disk space and download time. Alternatively there is the disc version, but that too has size constrains. There is also the issue of how much time should be spend on drawing backgrounds vs drawing event CGs. Often there is a budget and X hours to draw everything. Sure I want a complete set of BGs and preferably a new variation each time if it makes sense, but I'm not sure I want the side effects.

 

1 hour ago, SeniorBlitz said:

Though more Translated BL and more Traps would be nice.

Fair enough. I will go get the shovel and dig a hole. Don't tell@SeniorBlitz. He seems to love traps and I want to have one ready for him, but it will be better if it's a complete surprise

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, tymmur said:

Fair enough. I will go get the shovel and dig a hole. Don't tell@SeniorBlitz. He seems to love traps and I want to have one ready for him, but it will be better if it's a complete surprise

Derg already killed me by RNG no need to.

[wyldstrykr]

less moenovel

less sekai kickstarter

less machine translated vn

 

[Sayaka]

Visual novel developers and companies across Japan saw this Fuwa thread and, inexplicably, decided the wishes in this thread absolutely must be granted.

And thus it came to be that Fuwanovel eliminated the entire medium of visual novels.

[VirginSmasher]

15 minutes ago, Sayaka said:

Visual novel developers and companies across Japan saw this Fuwa thread and, inexplicably, decided the wishes in this thread absolutely must be granted.

And thus it came to be that Fuwanovel eliminated the entire medium of visual novels.

And then the tropes in VNs that weren't cliches before all of a sudden became cliches now because of the lack of tropes after the mass eradication of VN tropes of 2018.

[ittaku]

2 hours ago, VirginSmasher said:

You beautiful man.

Is that an indirect vote for more BL?

[VirginSmasher]

10 minutes ago, ittaku said:

Is that an indirect vote for more BL?

It's up to your imagination. 

[Sayaka]

26 minutes ago, VirginSmasher said:

And then the tropes in VNs that weren't cliches before all of a sudden became cliches now because of the lack of tropes after the mass eradication of VN tropes of 2018.

"Ughh, why must every single VN be set in an old people's home? Plus the MC never shuts up, AND I'm sick of seeing their face. And what's with all these (infrequent) well-written, authentically awkward and clumsy sex scenes? I'm tired of hearing how annoying girls' bras are to unhook."