Jump to content
solidbatman

What Are You Playing: Video Game Edition

Recommended Posts

I've been playing Tales of Vesperia and it's just as good as it was when I first played it(Though the english dub is a bit of a wash since they had a new guy do Yuri's new lines)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 06.12.2018 at 2:53 PM, LemiusK said:

Lead us not into temptation, as they say.

...annnnd I fell into it. Bought Hitman 2. Furthermore, it's the Gold Edition, costing $129. Sigh. Kinda regretted it after a few hours of gameplay. I mean, it's a great game but... it feels kinda... empty, compared to the visual novels I could have bought. All the great exploration of this sandbox game can't make up for the richness of good storytelling of visual novels.

Can't refund it, of course, since it's been more than two hours.

But I kinda expected this to happen. I've always been impulsive, not to mention that I'm the sort who would buy things to make myself feel better, only to have buyer's remorse soon after. That's kinda what happened last night, why I changed my mind and bought this game, to make myself feel better. And also because I thought it might have been time to move on from visual novels from now on.

But Hitman 2 turned out to be a lot more stale than I expected. Its gameplay of allowing you to execute kills through multiple methods was fun enough... for a while. But it's just about as fun as solving a puzzle box through multiple methods. There's no substance to the puzzle box. It's a puzzle box, and you solve it. That's it. There's no story, no characters that would comfort you. It doesn't care if it makes you happy or sad because it's not a story that would make you happy or sad - it's a puzzle box. You solve it and you another brain, that's it.

Anyway, I'm sure there are tons of other people out there who love this game and find my complaints stupid or whatever. Doesn't really matter anymore, does it? Money's gone, money's gone...

Gonna look into selling my 3DS (and my Pokemon Moon game) to make up for the loss. Hope I could at least get back $100 since the screen's full of blemishes.

I'm with you! Luckily, I didn't buy Hitman 2 because I just have a "no buy" policy with games. I need to try them first and if I really like them, I'll pay for them. Also I realized I'm not really a gamer... I love great gameplay but it's so rare for me to find the gameplay that I'd want to play over and over that I don't even try anymore. I'm looking for the stories and characters, period. 

Sooo, I shrinked my "plan to play" list very heavily in the past few months and couldn't decide what to do about Hitman series. Hitman Absolution is one of my favorite games of all time just because of its story: it had this Tarantino vibe to it with humor and sexiness, and great locations... luckily, Hitman 2016 was free on PS Plus. I enjoyed it very much at first but then the locations started being so boring and bland... they didn't even bother to do interesting scenarios. I dropped the game even though it felt like a great game. Then tried Hitman 2 a few days ago (first episode was free) and it's just... uh, okay? Stunning visuals but it just feels so shallow. I can't stand that, so dropped it, too. xD

Really sorry you spent 120$+ on it... I know how it feels because I am impulsive, too. Know that Jump Force game? Fighting game with all Shonen Jump characters... gosh, it was so bad and I spent 60$ on it. Couldn't return because stupid PSN store does not allow refunds. =/ I'm very careful with games now and tell myself to calm down before buying something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyways, I'm playing Dark Souls III DLC. 

Have to say, I'm a bit tired with the game as of now but the beautiful locations and fun enemies keep me going. I wish it wasn't as labyrinth-like, though since I kind of want to get through it quickly. My attention is short and I got a bit worn out by the 2nd half of the game, mostly during Archives level... the final two bosses were amazing, though, just like the first half of the game. 

My conflict is that there's Sekiro coming out in less than a month, plus I have Dark Souls I and II + Bloodborne. Not really sure if I'll play DS II and Bloodborne, though... I did play BB in the past and got pretty far but stopped because I couldn't understand how co-op works. Want to finish it now but I'm not sure... and DS II feels a bit strange. It's very different from DS for some reason... can't decide if I like it. Anyways, three huge games left and I am still with DLC for DS III, haha. I know if I'd put the DLC away, it would be difficult for me to get back. All DS are quite different and when you put them down, the skill gets down - and it's not like my skill is worth mentioning. =_=

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 15.02.2019 at 12:11 PM, boomer said:

Guns of boom, I want to be a champion in this game and hope I will

by the way, my clan is in the top, if you want to play with top players in this game you can join us "Konotop Kills Clan".

also, you can get game here 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, about 18 hours into Xenoblade Chronicles 2. (Can you guess where I am? You have until the end of the next sentence to find out, so stop reading here if you need to think.)

I've just started Chapter 4, I think? I'm in the save screen after a boss fight. Though I like the characters and all that, I am somewhat bothered by how much this game was lauded. I've invested considerable time, and I feel it doesn't quite give me as much as I'd like in return. I'll now talk a bit about the game and the boss I juts fought:

Spoiler

I am overall intrigued with Pyra's past. Clearly some things have gone on in the past, and though she doesn't feel particularly comfortable sharing, it's not like she's actively trying to hide things too much. Rex knows not to pester people about their past if they don't feel like sharing at the moment. This is fine. We'll find out in due time.

The places feel like they're scaled in a way that they could be actual cities and villages! That's the first time I've seen in a game towns that seemed to be scaled appropriately to contain all the citizens in them. It's amazing! I love it! So large.

In line with that, exploration is kind of fun, but I guess I dislike grinding and all the little fights on the way from place to place. That's why I'll stop doing side-quests for the most part for now. There's time to do that when I become under-levelled or post-game.

I also like the characters in the main cast outside of Varnham. I like their interactions and the comedic moments too.

What bothers me a bit more is just the way the plot progresses. It feels like a shounen anime, and that's... that's pretty bad for somebody such as myself.
So there's this team of big bad guys that's following us, and they surely have the power to destroy us (as far as we know), but every time they attack us understaffed and we beat them and they're just like "I wasn't being serious lol" aside from a couple of instances we ran away.
The boss fight right at the end of Chapter 3 rubbed me the wrong way to a sufficient extent that I came here to vent: It starts with two of the baddies joining up (Surely that's enough. The rest of the bad guy team is out grocery shopping). We grind away their health for five minutes and we transition into a cutscene that basically goes "We spent the last five minutes fighting just for sport. NOW we will activate our ability that'll completely stop you guys." which they do and it works. Big guy Varnham is finished running away with the hostage the bad guys didn't actually give a darn about (fine) and returns to kick arse with his sheer experience. He does a bit of that, but ultimately no miracles. So Rex does what he does best and disregards all good sense and his allies in order to charge and get kicked in the face (I'm generally fine with Rex-type good guys, but I hate this particular aspect of charging fruitlessly at stronger opponents -- which he has only done every single time he's fighting someone stronger). It's at this point that the shounen power-up occurs, and here comes super-powered Pyra that's not Pyra any more. For once the bad guys seem seriously outmatched, they bugger off, Pyra returns and passes out. Apparently being fine whilst fighting means nothing for after the fact. But never-mind passing out, Varnham is dead because he was one-vs-one'd by Malos whilst Ahkos was eating popcorn or something instead of taking the opportunity with all the good guys on the ground -- he needed to wait for Pyra's power-up before doing anything more, of course. With Varnham dead, it's time to grieve (except I feel nothing for the character, but that's just me).

I suppose this is all fine, especially since the bad guys' objective might not necessarily be to kill all the good guys, which is why they've consistently failed to do so even though it's clear they could if they actually tried and the plot allowed it.

 

The questions will now be "Why did Pyra transform?" "Who was that?" "Why only now and not the other 5 times?" "Can't you just stay that way every time we need to fight big badies?". Maybe most of these will actually have proper answers, but I fear for anime BS-ery like "We only use the biggest move at the end, or there'd be no stakes!".

Anyway, bothered by the game so far. I'd like to continue, because I've heard nothing but good things, but for the amount of time I've invested, this seems like terrible time:enjoyment ratio to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Mr Poltroon said:

So, about 18 hours into Xenoblade Chronicles 2. (Can you guess where I am? You have until the end of the next sentence to find out, so stop reading here if you need to think.)

I've just started Chapter 4, I think? I'm in the save screen after a boss fight. Though I like the characters and all that, I am somewhat bothered by how much this game was lauded. I've invested considerable time, and I feel it doesn't quite give me as much as I'd like in return. I'll now talk a bit about the game and the boss I juts fought:

  Reveal hidden contents

I am overall intrigued with Pyra's past. Clearly some things have gone on in the past, and though she doesn't feel particularly comfortable sharing, it's not like she's actively trying to hide things too much. Rex knows not to pester people about their past if they don't feel like sharing at the moment. This is fine. We'll find out in due time.

The places feel like they're scaled in a way that they could be actual cities and villages! That's the first time I've seen in a game towns that seemed to be scaled appropriately to contain all the citizens in them. It's amazing! I love it! So large.

In line with that, exploration is kind of fun, but I guess I dislike grinding and all the little fights on the way from place to place. That's why I'll stop doing side-quests for the most part for now. There's time to do that when I become under-levelled or post-game.

I also like the characters in the main cast outside of Varnham. I like their interactions and the comedic moments too.

What bothers me a bit more is just the way the plot progresses. It feels like a shounen anime, and that's... that's pretty bad for somebody such as myself.
So there's this team of big bad guys that's following us, and they surely have the power to destroy us (as far as we know), but every time they attack us understaffed and we beat them and they're just like "I wasn't being serious lol" aside from a couple of instances we ran away.
The boss fight right at the end of Chapter 3 rubbed me the wrong way to a sufficient extent that I came here to vent: It starts with two of the baddies joining up (Surely that's enough. The rest of the bad guy team is out grocery shopping). We grind away their health for five minutes and we transition into a cutscene that basically goes "We spent the last five minutes fighting just for sport. NOW we will activate our ability that'll completely stop you guys." which they do and it works. Big guy Varnham is finished running away with the hostage the bad guys didn't actually give a darn about (fine) and returns to kick arse with his sheer experience. He does a bit of that, but ultimately no miracles. So Rex does what he does best and disregards all good sense and his allies in order to charge and get kicked in the face (I'm generally fine with Rex-type good guys, but I hate this particular aspect of charging fruitlessly at stronger opponents -- which he has only done every single time he's fighting someone stronger). It's at this point that the shounen power-up occurs, and here comes super-powered Pyra that's not Pyra any more. For once the bad guys seem seriously outmatched, they bugger off, Pyra returns and passes out. Apparently being fine whilst fighting means nothing for after the fact. But never-mind passing out, Varnham is dead because he was one-vs-one'd by Malos whilst Ahkos was eating popcorn or something instead of taking the opportunity with all the good guys on the ground -- he needed to wait for Pyra's power-up before doing anything more, of course. With Varnham dead, it's time to grieve (except I feel nothing for the character, but that's just me).

I suppose this is all fine, especially since the bad guys' objective might not necessarily be to kill all the good guys, which is why they've consistently failed to do so even though it's clear they could if they actually tried and the plot allowed it.

 

The questions will now be "Why did Pyra transform?" "Who was that?" "Why only now and not the other 5 times?" "Can't you just stay that way every time we need to fight big badies?". Maybe most of these will actually have proper answers, but I fear for anime BS-ery like "We only use the biggest move at the end, or there'd be no stakes!".

Anyway, bothered by the game so far. I'd like to continue, because I've heard nothing but good things, but for the amount of time I've invested, this seems like terrible time:enjoyment ratio to me.

I feel like the answers they give you for those are actually going to be pretty satisfying. However, the game absolutely suffers from the "win the fight, lose the subsequent cutscene, survive anyway" formula, and I don't blame you for holding that (or something in that ballpark) against it, which it sounds like you do. So that's a totally fair complaint.

I think what I loved most about Xenoblade 2 was its epic sweep, which pervaded the other elements of the game more than they did the core plot. The music, the art, and the setting were all phenomenally evocative. They make me feel like I'm there, on this fantastical world with its cloud sea, its titans, its blades, and rising up above them all, the world tree. I also love it for the localization, a mindblowingly beautiful rendition of the world. I'm in love with the names, and with the accents (god, Morag's accent...).

The plot, well... it'll consistently get better from where you are, for sure, but it's never going to knock your socks off. The characters will do a better job of carrying you through the game than the plot will, and even they're merely good, not great. I'm a big fan of Nia, though, and of some others who I won't mention because spoilers, and I suspect you'll end up a Nia fan too. It's hard not to.

Basically, Xenoblade 2 has its share of flaws and weak points, but the high points are so damn high for me that I can't speak of it without reverence.

 

Now, on to what I'm playing... I've finally managed to get back into playing a JRPG, for the first time in... god I don't even know how long, ten months? And I've resumed Octopath Traveler. This game is so goddamn good. I stalled out on the game a long time ago right after finishing each character's first chapter, but since I've gotten back to it, I've finished about half the second chapters, and I've grabbed all the first round of secondary jobs. I'm thinking I might attempt Tressa's chapter three as well, right now, since it's one of the lower-level ones and since I'm already in the right place to do it.

To my surprise, my favorite character so far is Ophilia. She kinda looks like a goody two-shoes, and in fact she is, but she somehow pulls it off in a way that's not boring. She's also cool, thoughtful, and above all, capable. I'm magnetically attracted to capable people. Ophilia's chapter two felt like a perfect testament to her—no evil people ruining everybody's lives (see: Tressa's chapter two, or Cyrus's whole storyline) or people acting with unfathomable motives (see: Olbert's storyline, or Therion's), just a couple kids going through a rough patch in life and needing a little help, which Ophilia provides with the utmost grace and humility. I hope they carry out doing this style of story for her through the rest of the game, honestly. Having this kind of variety in the tales they tell really keeps the game fresh, and I found that I just really like that kind of story, and it's not one you see terribly often in a JRPG.

Work has me kinda busy right now, but I'm gonna keep carving out the time to play Octopath Traveler, on the weekends if nothing else. Really enjoying this one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm currently digging into Fire Emblem: Three Houses...

Judging by my experience with the old ones and the last few entries, this one feels grindier (on normal mode, anyway), and it feels like they made the class system way too complex... However, that is also its attraction, since you can technically put anyone in any class, if you are willing to force them into the mold by upping their skills. 

Story-wise, it is hard to judge... basing things in a school, even a half-religious military academy, reminded me a lot of the tons of SOL VNs I've played over the years.  So far, I think the non-core characters are weaker than in previous entries, personality wise, even with bond scenes.  Generally, each House has the leader and his immediate assistant, who generally have a strong focus in the story for that House (just my observations so far).  These, the protag's father, and the heads of the Church leave a much stronger impression than most of the members of the House, which annoyed me deeply, since that feels like Nintendo is getting a bit lazy.

Gameplay-wise... it is Fire Emblem.  If you've played Fire Emblem before, you will understand what I mean.  Oh, there are some twists and they removed some elements from more recent entries (no doubling characters into a single space, for instance), while including others from other entries (such as Valentia's exploration). 

Overall, my experience so far is positive, but I'm recalling why Fire Emblem games generally leave me frazzled afterward.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I finished the eight stories in Octopath Traveler, and I went to do the bonus dungeon... then got demolished by the game changing the rules on me in the second half of the last fight, which was ~2 hours after the most recent save point, and which was, I believe, only the second fight I've lost in the entire game. Jerks. I don't know if I have the patience to build a team to meet the new rules of engagement, especially given how difficult and time-consuming the first half (I think?) of the boss fight was. We'll see. At least beating the eight sub-bosses before it (who I will have to fight all over again...) each gave a lot of background lore for the game which really tied the whole thing together. Anybody who didn't do this last dungeon (and the game is honestly pretty secretive about it) basically missed out on half of the game's backstory, which is... kinda weird TBH!

So maybe I'll go back to that and finish it off at some point, but in the meantime, I've started in on Fire Emblem: Three Houses, and have chosen the Edelgard's Fanboys Black Eagles for my house. Onward to drama!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 29/07/2019 at 10:16 AM, Clephas said:

I'm currently digging into Fire Emblem: Three Houses...

Judging by my experience with the old ones and the last few entries, this one feels grindier (on normal mode, anyway), and it feels like they made the class system way too complex... However, that is also its attraction, since you can technically put anyone in any class, if you are willing to force them into the mold by upping their skills. 

Story-wise, it is hard to judge... basing things in a school, even a half-religious military academy, reminded me a lot of the tons of SOL VNs I've played over the years.  So far, I think the non-core characters are weaker than in previous entries, personality wise, even with bond scenes.  Generally, each House has the leader and his immediate assistant, who generally have a strong focus in the story for that House (just my observations so far).  These, the protag's father, and the heads of the Church leave a much stronger impression than most of the members of the House, which annoyed me deeply, since that feels like Nintendo is getting a bit lazy.

Gameplay-wise... it is Fire Emblem.  If you've played Fire Emblem before, you will understand what I mean.  Oh, there are some twists and they removed some elements from more recent entries (no doubling characters into a single space, for instance), while including others from other entries (such as Valentia's exploration). 

Overall, my experience so far is positive, but I'm recalling why Fire Emblem games generally leave me frazzled afterward.

'grindier', you say? What do you mean by that?

To be clear, I agree that there's a lot of grind to be had. If you take every opportunity the game gives you to do things and maximise experience gains and do whatever battles you can afford to do, then yes, it is grindy, and you will soon outpace the difficulty curve.

But if you actually pace yourself, use the less time consuming mechanics (seminars and resting) whenever you feel you're the right level for the month's mission (instead of doing as many optional battles as you can or visiting the monastery multiple times), it ends up being both less time-consuming and you're the correct level for tackling the missions strategically instead of through brute force.

If by grind you just mean the running around the monastery then... I see where you're coming from, but I don't agree. It's certainly one of the big selling points for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fire Emblem is definitely tiring to play, but enjoyable. My problem with games like this is that I really sweat how "suboptimal" I'm playing, but I hate the idea of reading a guide, and I hate the time sink of save scumming. So I'm trying hard to just play the game and not worry too much, but it still exerts a little psychic pressure on me to be better at, say, intuiting the answers people want me to give them.

I've never played a Fire Emblem game before, so this will probably sound silly to all you people who've played a lot of them, but it feels very Persona-like for me, and they both stress me out the same way for the same reasons.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Fred the Barber said:

Fire Emblem is definitely tiring to play, but enjoyable. My problem with games like this is that I really sweat how "suboptimal" I'm playing, but I hate the idea of reading a guide, and I hate the time sink of save scumming. So I'm trying hard to just play the game and not worry too much, but it still exerts a little psychic pressure on me to be better at, say, intuiting the answers people want me to give them.

I've never played a Fire Emblem game before, so this will probably sound silly to all you people who've played a lot of them, but it feels very Persona-like for me, and they both stress me out the same way for the same reasons.

Okay, you probably saw my reply to Clephas above but this game is made for newcomers. Trying to optimise everything is not only tiring, it also sucks away the enjoyment from anything that isn't story. It really isn't worth it or necessary, in any difficulty.

(Doesn't spoil anything. Just game mechanics up to chapter 3.)

Spoiler

 

Level yourself until your on the recommended level for the month. You don't need to do more than two battles a month, or more than one visit to the monastery. Does 'Rest' seem like a waste? Nope. It's worth every sacrifice in the time you don't spend slowly optimising away the challenge. Seminars to help people get motivation and the skills for classes.

If you're having problems with being stressed out, I cannot recommend casual mode enough, if you aren't using it. Especially if you're the sort of person that cannot bring themselves to move on after losing a character and just restarts. Casual mode simply saves time. Lost a unit to an easily emendable mistake? No need to waste turns going back and rewatching the enemy turn or restarting the map. Especially near the end of missions. Not every mistake you make is a "Well played, AI and RNG". Sometimes they're just "#$%& that misclick!" or "I did the maths wrong by one...". It's not worth your time to reload saves over this.

You also seem to be worrying about the correct answers for people. The only thing they do is affect the support level and... well, rest assured that you have more than enough time to be best friends with everyone and more. Even if you picked every option they hated.

 

 

Anyway, the advice above mostly reflects my own experience. I did a playthrough of the game trying to do everything in the optimal way, and I must've done pretty well because 3/4ths into it I realised I could solo maps with a single character if I really tried and just stopped caring. Not only did I save a bunch of time, I also enjoyed it more.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd say it's much more difficult to mess up in FE than it is not to. Certain characters are just ridiculously overpowered and, if in trouble, you can just 1-man entire missions. The real challenge is in not killing everything with those so that you can share exp between all your party!

 

Regarding Three Houses, I must say I expected the overinflated reviews and have been disappointedly... not disappointed. The gameplay is the same as usual, fairly simple and easy no matter which difficulty you choose (which makes it great for newcomers and more casual players), but a bit of a let down for people looking for a tactics game. My main complain, however, is in the story. While the characters are a mixed bag of great designs with touching backstories against walking archetypes with the especial skill "Bore you to Death", what I've seen of the story as of now has been a, if you'll forgive the expression, complete shitshow. The plot is a mess, the monthly timetable makes the pacing feel very unrealistic, the villains are just that, villains... Surprisingly enough, the game actually kicks itself in the balls and self-denies some opportunities for great moments, too.

I do wonder if, by realizing that the casual modern FE is a really easy money cow, Nintendo has just completely given up on creating compelling stories for the franchise.

Now, this all sounds super negative, but really, I'm just focusing on my grievances. If you play Three Houses expecting "another FE", you'll be pleasantly not surprised and have a good time with the waifus/husbandos. If you expect a JRPG with some meat, you'll go starving.

Edited by Jun Inoue

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Jun Inoue said:

I'd say it's much more difficult to mess up in FE than it is not to. Certain characters are just ridiculously overpowered and, if in trouble, you can just 1-man entire missions. The real challenge is in not killing everything with those so that you can share exp between all your party!

 

Regarding Three Houses, I must say I expected the overinflated reviews and have been disappointedly... not disappointed. The gameplay is the same as usual, fairly simple and easy no matter which difficulty you choose (which makes it great for newcomers and more casual players), but a bit of a let down for people looking for a tactics game. My main complain, however, is in the story. While the characters are a mixed bag of great designs with touching backstories against walking archetypes with the especial skill "Bore you to Death", what I've seen of the story as of now has been a, if you'll forgive the expression, complete shitshow. The plot is a mess, the monthly timetable makes the pacing feel very unrealistic, the villains are just that, villains... Surprisingly enough, the game actually kicks itself in the balls and self-denies some opportunities for great moments, too.

I do wonder if, by realizing that the casual modern FE is a really easy money cow, Nintendo has just completely given up on creating compelling stories for the franchise.

Now, this all sounds super negative, but really, I'm just focusing on my grievances. If you play Three Houses expecting "another FE", you'll be pleasantly not surprised and have a good time with the waifus/husbandos. If you expect a JRPG with some meat, you'll go starving.

Interesting. I know I've not got the most discerning taste, but I loved the route I finished.

Might I ask where you are in the story? And if you'll detail anything, please put it in spoilers as well as which chapter and route you're on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Mr Poltroon said:

Interesting. I know I've not got the most discerning taste, but I loved the route I finished.

Might I ask where you are in the story? And if you'll detail anything, please put it in spoilers as well as which chapter and route you're on.

Yes, of course, not gonna discuss details out in the open. I'm doing the Black Eagle house route.

Spoiler

I'm right at the point where Edelgard's gone full Disney villain and decided that she trusts her professor enough to make him part of her plan... except for the small detail of betraying the entire church.

Her storyline's also kind of a mess, probably a result of it being an indivisible part of the game's story, but her context being absolutely optional, so it all comes pretty much out of the clue, and doens't have that much tension to it. You simply don't know enough, about her or the plan, to feel the weight that the whole thing is supposed to have, or to make any informed decisions. What should have been obligatory interactions in the common route, where the game could have showcased both during the story and during missions the difficulties the Empire finds itself in, and how they affect her, you get nothing at all.

 

In regards to what I assume is mostly the common route for everyone, it's all just kind of too spread out. The villains just randomly pop out; we need an enemy for the month's mission? I know take that random NPC and make it so they were actually a villain all along, transformed into them! And, well, speaking of the monthly mission, it's kinda insane if you think about it. This means the story actually moves at a glacial pace. You get a piece of plot, then get thrown 3 "weeks" of filler, and more plot. The first week you explore and chat with everyone, the second week you fight side/optional battles, the third it's seminar/rest, and the fourth story. Rinse and repeat, every month, forever. It's uninspired.

 

Perhaps the most grievous example I can think of is during chapter 10 (I think?), when you confront "Monica", then Solon shows up at the end and banished you to Yu-Gi-Oh's shadow realm. But, before you have half a second to consider it, the game immediately throws you an easy cheat, powers you up and has you escape within the minute, all with a very vaguely-explained price that doesn't really make sense if you think about it. The seriousness of the whole "forbidden spell of Sahras" (or whatever) is risible in hindsight, since the game itself kills the tension of the scene.

At the end of the day, it's just another FE, and my problems simply stem from expecting more from the franchise.

Edited by Jun Inoue

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I honestly am enjoying the Black Eagles route... I mean, I do find it entirely predictable.  However, that is the case with most game stories out there... 

Spoiler

Edelgard's outlook on life and society make her incompatible with the Church.  As such, and in combination with her various comments during conversations previous, I knew it was inevitable that things would go the way they did.  Since Rhea set off my 'fake' meter almost immediately with her attitudes, I happily joined Edelgard's cause.

I do think that this game would have been an ideal time to ditch the 'traditional' silent protagonist, as the concept is generally handled poorly in 90% of games, regardless of nationality.   Having passed the time skip, I feel that I should drop a few thoughts...

1.  Professor points should be at least a little less annoying to gain... the same for renown.  Ii hate mini-games, and fishing is one of my least favorite of the type. 

2.  Nintendo did the game a disservice by making most of the game's story and character development either through interludes or at the beginning/end of the months.  This applies to all characters.

3.  Strolling around the Monastery DOES get old really fast... even with the clunky fast travel system.  Going everywhere to find lost items and people to talk to got old, fast.

4.  What this game does do well are a few good scenes... that show off how weak many of the others are.  To be straight, there is a huge bump in quality after the time skip in terms of story scenes.  This contrasts the rather excessively long 'buildup period' that is the time before the skip, where it seemed they were dropping mysteries (predictable ones)  and revelations on you for the heck of it at times.  Not to mention that most of the characters losing their adolescent 'charm' generally made it easier to take them seriously, lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Clephas said:

I honestly am enjoying the Black Eagles route... I mean, I do find it entirely predictable.  However, that is the case with most game stories out there... 

  Hide contents

Edelgard's outlook on life and society make her incompatible with the Church.  As such, and in combination with her various comments during conversations previous, I knew it was inevitable that things would go the way they did.  Since Rhea set off my 'fake' meter almost immediately with her attitudes, I happily joined Edelgard's cause.

 

My problem with that is how the game forces you to make an uninformed choice.

Spoiler

You know jack shit about her plan (since you can't move past having a C with her), and she sounds/looks like a villain straight from a Disney film when it all goes down. It's way too obvious that smth is wrong with Rhea from minute 1, and 90% of your interactions with your father are literally "don't trust Rhea" conversations, but Edelgard also goes full nuts, supposedly trusting you and making you part of her plan (for which Hubert chastises her), then completely leaves you out of it during it's climax and betrayal.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Jun Inoue said:

My problem with that is how the game forces you to make an uninformed choice.

  Hide contents

You know jack shit about her plan (since you can't move past having a C with her), and she sounds/looks like a villain straight from a Disney film when it all goes down. It's way too obvious that smth is wrong with Rhea from minute 1, and 90% of your interactions with your father are literally "don't trust Rhea" conversations, but Edelgard also goes full nuts, supposedly trusting you and making you part of her plan (for which Hubert chastises her), then completely leaves you out of it during it's climax and betrayal.

 

This rolls back into my issues with character development... there weren't enough moments that showed building trust to make me 'feel' the relationship between the protagonist and the students, and that is also why I thought they should have dumped the silent protagonist bit, at least for this entry.  There is just this absolute assumption that the protagonist is this godly super-teacher that put me off more than a little...  I mean, give me a few Onizuka moments to make me feel like I understand how my protagonist is connecting with someone like Edelgard (and the bond conversations don't count, since they are just an episode 'after' the relationship has been formed).  I don't mean go into insane detail... I mean bring life to what happens during the month for each chapter.  Just doing activities, fighting battles, and tutoring... that just isn't enough.

Edit: To be clear, I didn't want anything on the scale of Persona's progression, but I would have liked to see the protagonist interacting with the students without me constantly being the voice for her.  

Spoiler

Also, I should note that I didn't see Edelgard as a villain in this case... there is a distinct difference between a villain and a potential antagonist.   I dunno if you saw it, but it was rather obvious that Edelgard is meant to be an echo of Reinhardt from Legend of the Galactic Heroes... she even has her own Oberstein (Hubert). 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, Clephas said:

 

  Hide contents

Also, I should note that I didn't see Edelgard as a villain in this case... there is a distinct difference between a villain and a potential antagonist.   I dunno if you saw it, but it was rather obvious that Edelgard is meant to be an echo of Reinhardt from Legend of the Galactic Heroes... she even has her own Oberstein (Hubert). 

 

 

Spoiler

I meant it in the sense that she's all about trusting you, then she suddenly shows up with troops and a guy maniacally screaming "kill anyone who resists!!!!" and gives no explanation to her teacher or friends/students other than "this is something I have decided to do, so step aside or I'll kill you".

The game does a bad job of making it poignant, it's just another "twist reveal" the game springs on you, like a few others before. You have to choose to kill or protect Edelgard without knowing crap about her intentions or situation, and with her looking like she's simply gone full villain. Then, if you choose her, the game activates yet another trap card and shows you that, gasp, Rhea is some horrible monster and the choice was obvious all along!

 

Edited by Jun Inoue

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 04/08/2019 at 11:19 PM, Jun Inoue said:

Yes, of course, not gonna discuss details out in the open. I'm doing the Black Eagle house route.

  Hide contents

I'm right at the point where Edelgard's gone full Disney villain and decided that she trusts her professor enough to make him part of her plan... except for the small detail of betraying the entire church.

Her storyline's also kind of a mess, probably a result of it being an indivisible part of the game's story, but her context being absolutely optional, so it all comes pretty much out of the clue, and doens't have that much tension to it. You simply don't know enough, about her or the plan, to feel the weight that the whole thing is supposed to have, or to make any informed decisions. What should have been obligatory interactions in the common route, where the game could have showcased both during the story and during missions the difficulties the Empire finds itself in, and how they affect her, you get nothing at all.

 

In regards to what I assume is mostly the common route for everyone, it's all just kind of too spread out. The villains just randomly pop out; we need an enemy for the month's mission? I know take that random NPC and make it so they were actually a villain all along, transformed into them! And, well, speaking of the monthly mission, it's kinda insane if you think about it. This means the story actually moves at a glacial pace. You get a piece of plot, then get thrown 3 "weeks" of filler, and more plot. The first week you explore and chat with everyone, the second week you fight side/optional battles, the third it's seminar/rest, and the fourth story. Rinse and repeat, every month, forever. It's uninspired.

 

Perhaps the most grievous example I can think of is during chapter 10 (I think?), when you confront "Monica", then Solon shows up at the end and banished you to Yu-Gi-Oh's shadow realm. But, before you have half a second to consider it, the game immediately throws you an easy cheat, powers you up and has you escape within the minute, all with a very vaguely-explained price that doesn't really make sense if you think about it. The seriousness of the whole "forbidden spell of Sahras" (or whatever) is risible in hindsight, since the game itself kills the tension of the scene.

At the end of the day, it's just another FE, and my problems simply stem from expecting more from the franchise.

Finally. I had to play it up till this chapter before I was able to comment. For full disclosure, I started and finished with a different house. This had a few consequences (no real spoilers):

Spoiler

If you do not pick Black Eagles, you simply do not get to know Edelgard to the point where you would suspect her -- at most you'd gather she's not a fan of crests. As a result, once the time comes it hits you sideways like a truck.

The game assumes that either you are putting effort into gathering the context on your own, or you're not going to end up on her path. Whether this is truly the case... I don't know. Support conversations build up easily enough and they alone might get you interested in her even when you're not otherwise focused on the monastery.

All of the context that exists is essentially that the major nobles of the empire banded together to render the Emperor powerless, and then invested into implanting a major Crest into one of his children, so that the next Emperor would have a powerful Crest (and they probably hoped to also control the next Emperor as they did their father -- alas, Edelgard and Hubert are stubborn and crafty). Edelgard now intends to change how Crests are perceived so that none have to suffer as her family did for such worthless reasons (she never reveals how, but since she attacks the Church at this point, it is likely through antagonizing the Church).
I wonder how much of what I just said is stuck behind optional content for the path? I think we may only hear the details of this plot from a Hubert-Hanneman support, of all things.

The villains are attempting to infiltrate their main enemy, the church, but I suppose it doesn't feel all that good to have friendly NPCs transform into foes. But say what you will, there is one thing I loved about this that I don't see all too often in other JRPGs. We struck a good blow to the bad guys before the end of the game! Solon was a genuine big part of their forces, and we took them out.
Additionally, and Seteth even mentions this, it is telegraphed that both people that turned out to be disguised disappeared from the monastery for a time, coming back as if everything was normal. It's not like they're pulling these twists out of nowhere, even if you don't find them satisfying (and I can see why one wouldn't).

The pace is a complaint that's understandable. In an effort to allow the player control and customisation over what to do with their characters, they also give them time. You honestly don't need all the time if you're even half decent at the game. Resting gets you from plot mission to plot mission just fine, and exploring the monastery once and doing a paralogue don't stop the story, but they do interrupt the flow of the main one -- I will give you that.
Allowing the player to play how they want once again allows them to ruin their own fun by wanting to see everything and optimise the best they can. Alas.

 

And I don't really get what's bothering you about chapter 10. Bad guys try to stop powerful teacher with unusual Crest, little did they know he had the bloody Goddess inside, whoops dead. I loved the way this played out as a result.

On 05/08/2019 at 10:17 AM, Jun Inoue said:

 

  Hide contents

I meant it in the sense that she's all about trusting you, then she suddenly shows up with troops and a guy maniacally screaming "kill anyone who resists!!!!" and gives no explanation to her teacher or friends/students other than "this is something I have decided to do, so step aside or I'll kill you".

The game does a bad job of making it poignant, it's just another "twist reveal" the game springs on you, like a few others before. You have to choose to kill or protect Edelgard without knowing crap about her intentions or situation, and with her looking like she's simply gone full villain. Then, if you choose her, the game activates yet another trap card and shows you that, gasp, Rhea is some horrible monster and the choice was obvious all along!

 

Finally, I will conclude with "there is nothing obvious about that choice."
I agree, however, that Edelgard could've actually tried a bit harder to justify herself and not look plainly evil. I don't know if she later justifies her secrecy and lack of care, but as of now I see no reason as to why this was this way.

Edit: I have played up to part two, and, in retrospect, I feel I better understand why Edelgard failed to justify herself.
As you saw, she didn't even attempt to do so. Over the course of the school year, and even during the final confrontation where you choose between her and the church, she repeatedly holds herself back from saying she wishes you were with her. In a classic anime manoeuvre, she is racked with guilt as to what she is about to do, and doesn't want to push you down her thorny path. In fact, she doesn't seem to believe you would betray the church (which makes sense given the rest of the game). The most she dares ask is that you turn a blind eye for a bit. The player doesn't get the option to go get a coffee and let the women at it, but from this perspective I better understand why Edelgard wasn't attempting to pull people into what she was about to do. More specifically, she wanted to avoid involving her classmates with whom she spent many good times. She was willing to sacrifice many lives, such as her subjects, but the emotional impact of 'classmates of a year' (when she has precious little nice human relationships otherwise) VS 'random peasants' is obviously different.

 

This is a game where understanding doesn't occur as events come to pass, but only afterwards. My perspective on characters shifts as I see their interactions and learn new background about them. As you say, this will dull the impact of many scenes and make twists seem as if they come out of nowhere, but I appreciate being able to figure things out all over the place, random conversation at a time.
My favourite bit so far is now being able to understand what the heck was up with the opening cutscene.

I have to say; everyone says you should start with Black Eagles, but I vehemently disagree. Terrible house to start with.

Edited by Mr Poltroon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Spoiler
9 hours ago, Mr Poltroon said:

I wonder how much of what I just said is stuck behind optional content for the path? I think we may only hear the details of this plot from a Hubert-Hanneman support, of all things.

Almost everything. The game stops your relationship with Edelgard at C since everything else is post-time skip. Meaning that, even if you decide to invest in her, you’ll still know crap when shit hits the fan.

  Hide contents

Additionally, and Seteth even mentions this, it is telegraphed that both people that turned out to be disguised disappeared from the monastery for a time, coming back as if everything was normal. It's not like they're pulling these twists out of nowhere, even if you don't find them satisfying (and I can see why one wouldn't).

The problem is that this is literally retconned into the story. You know nothing of this until the very moment it is “discovered” and way too late. And this is one of my biggest complaints. Way too many important things and choices are either retconned or impossible to properly make until after the fact (like choosing to side with Edelgard or the Church).

  Hide contents

And I don't really get what's bothering you about chapter 10. Bad guys try to stop powerful teacher with unusual Crest, little did they know he had the bloody Goddess inside, whoops dead. I loved the way this played out as a result.

It’s exactly because the idea is great that I hated its execution. The event is supposed to be dramatic, we agree on that, yes? The MC goes full “trapped in Jumanji.” The problem here is that the game works really hard to immediately defuse the feeling of urgency, which unsurprisingly works against the drama of the situation. You get locked and your students go “he’s fine, he’ll probably show up in like a minute” and, lo and behold, the goddess throws a cheap deus ex your way and you’re out and about. Why do I call it cheap? Because the “sacrifice” isn’t clear. You give up smth you didn’t know you could give up; she simply says, “it’s fine I can break you out of here, but we won’t be able to keep talking like now”. Why? Because you’ll “fuse for real”. So, you were sort of half-fused…? And completely merging means she’ll be a part of you but lose the ability to talk to you? Why? How?

More grievously, this happens in literal seconds. Instead of making you, the player, feel like this is a huge problem to overcome, before you have had time to consider the implications of being trapped for eternity in this space, you’re out. It’s funny when I consider that this would have been an amazing point for the time-skip. Instead, the game shoots itself in the foot by killing a cool scene and squanders its potential in favour or doing the time-skip later on, in a really weird place.

9 hours ago, Mr Poltroon said:

Edit: I have played up to part two, and, in retrospect, I feel I better understand why Edelgard failed to justify herself.

As you saw, she didn't even attempt to do so. Over the course of the school year, and even during the final confrontation where you choose between her and the church, she repeatedly holds herself back from saying she wishes you were with her. In a classic anime manoeuvre, she is racked with guilt as to what she is about to do, and doesn't want to push you down her thorny path. In fact, she doesn't seem to believe you would betray the church (which makes sense given the rest of the game). The most she dares ask is that you turn a blind eye for a bit. The player doesn't get the option to go get a coffee and let the women at it, but from this perspective I better understand why Edelgard wasn't attempting to pull people into what she was about to do. More specifically, she wanted to avoid involving her classmates with whom she spent many good times. She was willing to sacrifice many lives, such as her subjects, but the emotional impact of 'classmates of a year' (when she has precious little nice human relationships otherwise) VS 'random peasants' is obviously different.

But she does not. The immediate mission doesn’t allow you to choose until you’ve won, and the literal implications of her orders are “kill my professor and classmates”, since you don’t get to even consider surrender. She phrases it as “kill anyone who gets in our way”, but you and the class are literally the only people outside of Rhea in there. Edelgard opens to you before this whole ordeal, even takes you to her coronation, but can’t bring herself to actually take the step to make you part of her plan. Is it because she doesn’t want to pull you into that whole mess? Kinda doubtful, when her entire plan is "kill the professor and classmates unless they are ok with me literally going full crazed villain in their faces and just let us desecrate the sacred tomb they have been told to protect."

I just don't buy it, you know? Almost every single one of my problems/complains could have been avoided or done much better with a little extra work, and most if not all the pivotal plot points of the story (up to where I am right now) completely fall apart when under scrutiny. @Mr Poltroon

Edited by Jun Inoue

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Spoiler
8 hours ago, Jun Inoue said:

Almost everything. The game stops your relationship with Edelgard at C since everything else is post-time skip. Meaning that, even if you decide to invest in her, you’ll still know crap when shit hits the fan.

Yes, but you don't get those details by progressing with your relationship with Edelgard, either. They come from other conversations or after you've chosen.

8 hours ago, Jun Inoue said:

The problem is that this is literally retconned into the story. You know nothing of this until the very moment it is “discovered” and way too late. And this is one of my biggest complaints. Way too many important things and choices are either retconned or impossible to properly make until after the fact (like choosing to side with Edelgard or the Church).

I have no idea who you've been talking to, but everyone and their mother mentioned Tomas recently returned to the monastery after being gone for a while in the early chapters. It's just not mentioned in any story segment.

8 hours ago, Jun Inoue said:

It’s exactly because the idea is great that I hated its execution. The event is supposed to be dramatic, we agree on that, yes? The MC goes full “trapped in Jumanji.” The problem here is that the game works really hard to immediately defuse the feeling of urgency, which unsurprisingly works against the drama of the situation. You get locked and your students go “he’s fine, he’ll probably show up in like a minute” and, lo and behold, the goddess throws a cheap deus ex your way and you’re out and about. Why do I call it cheap? Because the “sacrifice” isn’t clear. You give up smth you didn’t know you could give up; she simply says, “it’s fine I can break you out of here, but we won’t be able to keep talking like now”. Why? Because you’ll “fuse for real”. So, you were sort of half-fused…? And completely merging means she’ll be a part of you but lose the ability to talk to you? Why? How?

More grievously, this happens in literal seconds. Instead of making you, the player, feel like this is a huge problem to overcome, before you have had time to consider the implications of being trapped for eternity in this space, you’re out. It’s funny when I consider that this would have been an amazing point for the time-skip. Instead, the game shoots itself in the foot by killing a cool scene and squanders its potential in favour or doing the time-skip later on, in a really weird place.

You are asking Why and How magic works. If you're fine with Crests and Faith and Reason existing and creating unexplainable phenomenon, surely you'd be fine with this too? At any rate, at this point in the game the player really doesn't know much more than that Sothis was capable of independent interaction with you and that's what has to be sacrificed. Indeed, I do not see why this would bother you.

Spending more time contemplating being stuck in a void, huh? I'll be completely honest with you, my thoughts during this scene were no more than "I want to see how we quickly break out of this inescapable void and flabbergast the bad guys!". The game spends so much time telling us how great we are (since we can rewind time and do everything perfectly) and we have a Goddess working with us, I was prepared for instant return in the style of "Actually, you never had a chance. Sorry bad guy."
Clearly we were looking for different things here, and thankfully for me, the game sided with my mindset on this one.

The timeskip is situated in such a way that it happens right as war breaks out. I will refrain from commenting on the placement of the timeskip because I think other routes paint a better picture of it than this one.

8 hours ago, Jun Inoue said:

But she does not. The immediate mission doesn’t allow you to choose until you’ve won, and the literal implications of her orders are “kill my professor and classmates”, since you don’t get to even consider surrender. She phrases it as “kill anyone who gets in our way”, but you and the class are literally the only people outside of Rhea in there. Edelgard opens to you before this whole ordeal, even takes you to her coronation, but can’t bring herself to actually take the step to make you part of her plan. Is it because she doesn’t want to pull you into that whole mess? Kinda doubtful, when her entire plan is "kill the professor and classmates unless they are ok with me literally going full crazed villain in their faces and just let us desecrate the sacred tomb they have been told to protect."

The Holy Tomb was a secret location that they didn't know about nor had access to until this exact point in time. The attack had to occur now, and Edelgard's personality and obsession with control made her choose the "show them how serious we are so they stand aside" over "play nice and show weakness so they let us raid the tomb".

Now then. I agree that I'd prefer we got to choose to stand aside but... Byleth is really attached to the Church, and Edelgard's powerplay in an attempt to settle things quickly makes him decide to stop the raiding first and ask questions later. Even at that point, Edelgard, again, is unwilling to ask for help or justify herself. She is a stubborn goat with a personality not exactly well-suited to making allies. She says it again and again that she sees everyone (but Byleth) as inferior, and how that makes it difficult to truly bond, and how her position of power makes it so she feels she can't show weakness.

Say what you will, but characters have flaws and Edelgard's obsession with power and showing no weakness really screw her in this "Let's not look totally evil" department. If you've played any further than this choice, you soon see how she finally feels like she can show some vulnerability to Byleth, after always keeping everything inside.

I will agree with one thing: The player does not really have enough to make a choice on... except that's the point. Byleth sides with Edelgard because they believe in her; Byleth decides they don't want to kill Edelgard, or let her be killed. It's not a "Who's right" decision. It was an emotional one. That's also something I quite like. For all you know, you're siding with the villain!
As an aside, I really believe they should have made it harder for siding with Edelgard to be anyone's first route. It really isn't well-suited for a starting experience, in my opinion.

 

Edit:
Now that I had a night's sleep, I feel like my reply does nothing more than explain why I'm fine with things as they are, and does not acknowledge the idea that the game would be better with some changes, as you suggest. There are a few cases I agree, most clearly of all the mission where you fight Edelgard and then get to make a choice. I would've much preferred the ability to stand aside. I can understand Byleth's choices here, but I don't think it would've been far-fetched for him to be conflicted and not really do much, assuming you've been pursuing Edelgard with your supports and interactions.

Initially I thought that the monthly mission scenario led to odd situations, as the urgency of situation's wasn't properly conveyed, but that isn't quite true. Upon replay, I now see that while most situations are important, they equally require preparation. The most urgent one was the kidnapping, and it entirely depends on your own speed at finding the kidnapper. Being able to construct your own pace is very important for this game's enjoyability, so I don't think changing the month to month structure would be wise.

I'm fine with Tomas and Monica.

I also think like the scene where he fuses with Sothis is exactly what I wanted out of it. An epic moment, not a dramatic one. I'm not certain if more time in the void would've made the experience better for me...

(I may have referred to Byleth with male pronouns over the course of my post because mine usually takes that form)

@Jun Inoue

I believe I am getting a clearer picture of what you didn't like, and it does seem like a fair bit of your concerns did not affect me or I manage to explain them away within the story to the extent that I am satisfied.

Edited by Mr Poltroon
Added some more replies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×