[Spoilers] Star Wars VII Discussion

[Nosebleed]

Warning: I will assume people who read this thread have watched the movie.
If you haven't, there will be heavy spoilers below. You have been warned.

 

Okay so I watched the movie last night in a theatre with a couple of my friends and we discussed it a little bit but I wanted to think back on it before making a thread here. Now that i have slept on the issue, here are some of my thoughts on the newest movie.

First off, let me just start by saying I really enjoyed the movie and have no regrets about seeing it. It never once got boring to watch and it packed all the action you could have wanted from Star Wars in 2 hours. Visually speaking, it was also great, everything from character designs to special effects felt like the producers have watched Star Wars and wanted to remain faithful to its style and what its fans love, and I really tip my hat off to that. In terms of soundtrack, something Star Wars is also known for, I found the movie to be less memorable in comparison to the first movies, but nonetheless utilizing the music to its benefit, so at least there was no jarring flaws with the soundtrack either. The fights, oh man the fights, from spaceships to light saber fights, the choreography was fast paced and spot on in its delivery, really showing the potential modern day film combat can bring.

I think it was a very nice way to kick off the franchise once again, but with everything that's good, there's going to be some bad associated with it, and after thinking about it I do find some important flaws this movie has that sort of break the immersion a little bit, and as I'm sure it is the same with a lot of people, most of these flaws come from the characters, but some with the story.

Starting with the movie's plot itself, please tell me I'm not the only one who feels like the entire movie was just a huge rehash of episode IV. Now look, I'm all cool with playing the nostalgia card, I was thrilled when I saw the Millenium Falcon, Han Solo, Chewbacca, C3PO, Leia and all the other things and references from the previous movies show up, but the overarching plot and narrative of the movie was literally the same as episode IV's plot: Droid has something important > Empire wants it > Random people find it > They bring it to the rebelssistance > Dark side has a new death star > They're going to destroy everything > Death Star hasa fatal flaw > Our heroes end up saving the day after drafting up a plan.

There was no element of surprise when it came to the story itself, everything played out exactly like in episode IV, except this time the Death Star was the size of a planet and fed off on suns. For the love of god, who builds these death machines with a tunnel that leads to the core so it can just be destroyed? I mean, you'd figure Empire 2.0 would learn from the mistakes of its predecessors, but I guess not.

It's not that the story itself doesn't hold up, it's just that it felt so much like a clone of Episode IV with small little tweaks that it feels a little cheap when you think back on it. When I left the theatre, I thought the movie was fun, had lots of great moments, but in the back of my head I just think "I've seen this story already", and that's sort of a joy kill.

But moving on to the characters, and where I find the biggest problems with the movie to lie.

Starting off with the new protagonist, Rey. Rey is basically Luke 2.0 when it comes ot her origin story. I know she is his daughter, but you could have made her a bit less obviously the same as Luke in terms of background. However, my biggest problem with Rey comes from the fact that she's essentially a Mary Sue. Do you know why Luke had charm? Because he starts off as a kid with little experience and gets defeated in the first movies, and then gets strong enough to fight back, but even when he fights back, he's still pretty much on par with Darth Vader and not even a match for the emperor's powers. But Rey? Rey can literally do anything in the film, she's pretty much flawless in everything she does there, so much so that the movie almost ends up devolving into this "So how is Rey going to save everything now?" type of back and forth. She's able to pilot the Millennium Falcon right from the start, better than freaking Lando Calrissian in episode VI, even though she doesn't appear to have any prior experience with it. But even accepting that she's somehow a skilled pilot, you can not tell me her becoming a Jedi master in mere minutes, when Luke himself had to train with Yoda to be able to even offer some kind of meaningful resistence, is somehow justified. I was baffled that she suddenly is able to use the force to such an extent that she can defeat Kylo Ren every time and escape every single trap she's put in, it just didn't feel believable that such a Jedi newbie could go so far when they had not had any sort of experience whatsoever and I was a little underwhelmed by her character because of it. I applaud them for introducing a strong female protagonist, she really felt like she could grow so much, but I did not expect that growth to be like this. If you introduce a character and make them exceed at everything they do right from the start, there's honestly not much to like or relate to about them, they just become this figure that you know is never going to lose, and that broke off the tension for me a lot of the times.

Moving on to Finn. I don't have a lot of problems with Finn's personality and way of acting and I actually really found his premise to be the most interesting out of all the characters. He was freed from the grasp of the First Order and wants to get away, a completely reasonable choice to make, but my major problem with his character was how he came to be. He's a soldier who was trained from when he was a child to be a lifeless murderer, just like every single storm trooper ever, and you're going to tell me he, and just he could suddenly flip a switch inside his head that made him realize: "Wait a minute, this is fucked up" ? I had a very hard time coming to terms with the way this character is born, and I honestly still do, it just doesn't feel consistent with everything that's happened before. Outside of that, there's that one part where it's revealed Finn was essentially just a janitor in Death Star 2.0, yet he's essentially able to deactivate its shields and know basically everything about the biggest death gun the empire has yet built, I can't help but question how these people instruct their troops if even a janitor is able to take out the entire base if they just have outside help. 

Lastly, Kylo Ren, or should I say, emo kid who's totally not going through a phase, dad! When I first saw Kylo Ren, I thought he looked menacing as hell, his character design is so good and the light saber he has just helps make him look all edgy. But the moment you're revealed who he is and the moment he takes off his mask... oh boy the disappointment settled in. Why did you take off the mask, Ren? He looks like he's about to cry every time he takes off the mask like some emo teenager who had daddy issues. Now don't get me wrong, I'm okay with a more emotionally unstable version of Darth Vader, there's a lot of potential in him for the upcoming films and even Darth Vader himself started off as more emotionally unstable, but Kylo Ren just didn't have the presence you'd normally think of when you think of a main villain, and the fact that he clearly showcases how strongly he uses the force, yet gets instantly defeated by Rey was really the biggest issue I had with the movie. Rey being a Mary Sue and Kylo Ren being really weak at the end just didn't add up to me and I feel as though she should not have won so easily against someone who's supposed to be the next Vader.

But I don't think all hope is lost, my thinking is that Kylo Ren will now be transformed into a murder machine like Vader was in the upcoming movies and Rey will actually get strong using the proper methods, then we'll have a more decent fight between the two, but man these two characters really felt like they had their roles reversed and the immersion kinda broke at the end because of it for me.

To close off the rant, I still would like to say I loved the movie and I think there's extra potential for the upcoming movies because of it, so there's nothing that makes the movie really bad or anything of the sort, and if you're reading this thread without having seen it, I avidly recommend you do so, because it really is great. Nonetheless, when you compare it to its prequels, I do think this movie had some rather apparent flaws, which I genuinely hope will be fixed in the future, and of course I'll be going to both sequels whenever they come out.

So what are your thoughts on the movie and the reboot of the franchise in general?

[Dergonu]

I very much enjoyed the movie. The visuals were stunning, it gave of a strong sense of nostalgia seeing the old characters back in action, and it had me crying like a baby when Han Solo died. (Seriously, why!!!)

 

That being said I agree with what you said about the characters... Rey just suddenly knows how to use the force that well, despite the fact that every other jedi before her needs extensive training to do LESS than she was able to in the movie? ... Yeah ok.

Kylo Ren was badass, he clearly knew how to use the force and although he looks idiotic without the mask, he was a seriously badass character. He even has a moment at the end where he throws away the things that is holding him back, that being the light side and his father by killing Han Solo. So one would think this means he is now even more dangerous and more powerful, fully accepting the dark side ... Then he just loses to this new chick ... What ..?

I really hope they bring back Kylo Ren as a super powerful, badass sith lord in the the next movie. If they just waste such a cool character that quickly I will honestly be super dissapointed.

 

Lastly, BB-8 was hilarious and awesome. That thumbs up with the lighter was like the best part of the whole movie.

[Nosebleed]

Lastly, BB-8 was hilarious and awesome. That thumbs up with the lighter was like the best part of the whole movie.

Yeah BB-8 was a true bro. The entire theatre laughed at that specific scene, it was great.

I still believe Han Solo is alive!! It won't end like this!!

Also, one other gripe I had with the movie is that Leia became a general. Like, she's Luke's sister and can use the force, why didn't she become a Jedi, such a waste of an awesome character imo.

[Dergonu]

Lastly, BB-8 was hilarious and awesome. That thumbs up with the lighter was like the best part of the whole movie.

Yeah BB-8 was a true bro. The entire theatre laughed at that specific scene, it was great.

I still believe Han Solo is alive!! It won't end like this!!

Also, one other gripe I had with the movie is that Leia became a general. Like, she's Luke's sister and can use the force, why didn't she become a Jedi, such a waste of an awesome character imo.

Yeah its a little weird that she didn't become a jedi. Maybe it has to do with the whole jedi plan of Luke that failed. Kylo Ren murdered all the jedi and Luke ran away. Might feel a little strange for her to be left as the only jedi after that.

Maybe Luke wouldn't let her in order to protect her or something like that.

Or you know ... plot convinience

"Wait a minute! We have another skywalker right here! She can continue Luke's teachings!" "No. No she can't. Shh!"

[Nimbus]

As someone who enjoys the other three Star Wars movies (for there are only three) I quite enjoyed Episode 7 but I had a lot of the same issues as you did.

This movie felt more like a two hour long fan-fiction. Almost identical in every way to A New Hope, there was absolutely no surprises here. I wasn't even surprised they killed Han Solo, the only question going into that scene was "are they going to kill Chewie as well?'
Kylo was cool up until the mask came off, he should've kept it on until he met with Han.
The romance between Finn and Rey felt really rushed and should've been expanded on in the next episode but I suppose they need to do at least ONE thing different from the original trilogy.

My biggest problem with this movie was that I ultimately left unsatisfied, and not in a good way. I feel as if I didn't see a whole movie which you could say is the point given that it's part of a trilogy but this is where A New Hope and The Force Awakens differs; A New Hope worked as a stand alone movie.

[Zenophilious]

While I haven't seen the movie and have no interest in seeing it, thank you for actually talking about what you didn't like in it.  All I've heard so far is that all the characters are great and interesting, and the plot is amazing.  I've heard literally nobody being critical of it, which is incredibly dumb, considering that the general consensus seems to be that it's not as good as the OT.

[Nosebleed]

A New Hope worked as a stand alone movie.

That is because it initially was meant to be one, unlike the prequels or this new entry. I don't think the cliffhanger is a big issue because The Empire Strikes back did the same thing and it was still fine in the end. What I can see as an issue for that feeling of "there's something missing" is the fact that the movie doesn't really go into many details regarding the state of things, you're sort of thrown into the action with very little backstory and the movie only gives you small hints of a greater plot that's to come.

I think that because now they already planned for it to be a trilogy, we really will oly see the full potential of the reboot once all 3 movies are out, which could both be a good or bad thing depending on the perspective.

 

While I haven't seen the movie and have no interest in seeing it, thank you for actually talking about what you didn't like in it.  All I've heard so far is that all the characters are great and interesting, and the plot is amazing.  I've heard literally nobody being critical of it, which is incredibly dumb, considering that the general consensus seems to be that it's not as good as the OT.

Yeah I definitely feel like some people hugely overestimatethe movie's worth, just like some exaggerate things and say it's garbage. It's neither a full blown masterpiece, but neither is it trash, it has several flaws that become very clear once you stop and think back on the story and the characters, but during the movie I think most people had a good time, and overall it was a positive experience for me, so even though I'm pointing these things out, I'd still say the movie deserves a 7 or 8  out of 10. If you are a Star Wars fan, I don't think there's any reason to miss out on it. 

[shadowolf64]

I really enjoyed it. I definitely had some problems with it overall. You mentioned one of my biggest which is how does Rey know all these force tricks even though she has never been trained or seen it. Especially the force command one where she tells the storm trooper what to do with voice commands. She has never seen or been told the force can do something like that and yet she does it. Maybe in the next movies it will be explained somehow (oh she was a reincarnation of this badass jedi or she saw through the force people showing her how to do this) but right now it seems odd. 

The fact that it felt very similar to episode iv was both kinda cool and a little odd. I don't think I would count it against the movie since I think it worked but that may be because it has been a number of years since I've seen episode iv. 

Also when Kylo Ren takes off his mask he looks like a dork, not an intimidating sith. Maybe that's the point though. 

Overall I loved the movie and am looking forward to where they go next. Glad to see Star Wars back as I am a huge fan of the setting. 

[BookwormOtaku]

Lastly, BB-8 was hilarious and awesome. That thumbs up with the lighter was like the best part of the whole movie.

Yeah BB-8 was a true bro. The entire theatre laughed at that specific scene, it was great.

I still believe Han Solo is alive!! It won't end like this!!

Also, one other gripe I had with the movie is that Leia became a general. Like, she's Luke's sister and can use the force, why didn't she become a Jedi, such a waste of an awesome character imo.

Well, in the EU (now Legends) as I remember right it takes her a while to develop her force powers since she has to balance training with her growing responsibilities with the Republic so I didn't have that much of a problem with it...though I admit by the time she's the age she is in FA she's a Jedi (I think; I kinda dropped the EU after the whole Jacen thing was taken care of), so...

 

As for me, I really liked it. The characters were great and I enjoyed it despite the glaring similarities to New Hope.

BTW, anyone besides me wondering if the writers read some of the EU/Legends seeing as how similar Kylo Ren and Jacen are?

[ittaku]

I think you should look back on what you all wrote and see how it comes across - there's a lot of "it was so good, but..."

I saw the movie and didn't find it offensive but by no means was it a great movie. I was torn by it since I grew up with the originals, then was betrayed by the prequels, and had no expectations from this one. I struggled because I was moved by some scenes, excited by other scenes, yet yawning and cringing at other times.

That said I didn't find it unpleasant to watch overall and greatly enjoyed the bulk of the action scenes and the pace of the movie... but the writing was rather poor, and you've all alluded to it without actually being conscious of it.

The plot devices were convenient contrivances that really didn't make much sense and couldn't be explained away with coincidence and the force. Why on earth would Rey be so powerful so quickly when not even aware of her powers prior to it compared to a trained -something-. Why was she such a good pilot that could fly anything? Why was she instantly good enough to fend off a light saber battle from a trained expert? Why would R2D2 go to idle mode and then conveniently wake up without Luke really being any closer. How did the pilot manage to get back to the rebellion -his character wasn't developed anywhere near enough for us to feel any connection with him. How would he know how to fly anything including a Tie fighter? Why did the rebellion just happen to also be the planet Han took them to and conveniently came to save them without any forebearing and conveniently had the light saber. Carrie Fisher's acting was really weak and unconvincing - she has almost no on-screen presence with a voice that has no authority for someone that's meant to be a general and barely any emotion comes through. Why did she hug Rey so warmly when Rey returned when she didn't even know her - I guess she sensed that Rey observed Han's death but what would Leia mean to Rey? The jokes done with the old characters are pretty flat and borderline cringeworthy. Han Solo's son actor was a dweeb with no real impact and wildly unconvincing as somewhere between a super powerful force wielder and wimpy emo teenager at the same time. The bad leader looked like Voldemort again (so many bad guys look like him lately). How did the first order get so powerful so quickly when the empire was totally obliterated? How could they not piece together from that much map where in the universe that portion of the map came from, and why did it even need lines connecting its path to wherever he went. Where'd the map even come from and why was it even made? How did the first order happen to allegedly have the other pieces of the map and then we find R2D2 has the rest too. Are we meant to believe that Han made the ultimate sacrifice to effectively do what he had to do to save his son somehow - I'm sure that's how they'll explain it but it's basically unnecessary as far as I can see. What happened to all the stormtroopers being clones (someone explained that this wasn't the case after the clone wars but that's not in the movie universe as far as I remember). The redheaded bad guy was almost comically bad in his acting looking like something between the comical starship troopers and Hitler.  I could go on, but suffice to say this old man wasn't really blown away by the poor writing tying things together. It just felt like a fanflic with an unlimited budget.

Ironically, the story paying homage to the original star wars 4 didn't bother me one bit as I saw that as intentional canon and they made no effort to disguise it.

[Dergonu]

@ittaku

First of, excuse any spelling errors. There are bound to be some. I suck at writing long answers. ugh...

Though I agree that Rey was way too much of a convinient fix to everything like being able to use the force way to easily and her flying being perfect with no training was a litlte ifffy, some of the things you mentioned are fairly easily explainable. I'll list my answer to all of them. The ones in bold are the ones I do not have an answer for. Both of them I agree was a big flaw in the writing.

 

R2 woke up after Rey awakened her powers, so it was probably not Luke he was waiting for, but instead a new Jedi so he could show that jedi the map and bring them to him. 

How did the pilot get back? They explained that, he surivived the crash and he knew about the bases' location. Not really that suprising. His character developement doesn't have anything to do with wether he can surivive the crash or not.

I take it if you are a good pilot you can fly most ships, so him being able to fly a tie fighter isnt that suprising. It would be odd if all the ships in the galaxy operate completely differently to the point where its impossible to fly for such a skilled pilot.

The first orders sudden rise to power is very flawed, yes, seeing as the empire was all but annihilated.

The old characters acting and jokes were by no means bad. Don't really know how you figured that.

Why did Leia hug Rey? ... Well you know, her husband just died. Guess she needed someone to hug. Not really anything suprising about that.

The bad guy looked like voldemort ... Ok, what does that mean, how is that relevant to reviewing the movie.

The map? They said why they couldn't map it out. It was because the piece they had showed a system they were not familiar with. They literally did not know where it was.

Where did it come from and why was it made? Thats a good question. I have no idea, and I feel that should have been at least hinted at.

Dont really understand what you mean with Han Solo. He tried to get his son to come back home, compelling to the part of him that was still leaning towards the light side. This was a big turning point for Kylo's character. He abandoned the little part of the light side that was poking at his conciousness, (something we see him talk about previously in the movie,) and killed his father to sever his ties with it so he can fully embrace the dark side.

The storm troopers are all trained soliders, taken from their homes at birth, most likely the actual storm trooper legions were destroyed as the empire fell. The first order used this method instead in order to train new soliders. This is explained in the movie.

Once again you talk about the read headed bad guy and his acting. I didn't really notice anything bad about this guys preformance. Any specific examples?

 

Right, think that answers most of your questions. Wont say the movie is absolutely amazing, but its not as flawed in writing as you make it out to be.

[kingdomcome]

This movie is really solid, I don't think I've come out of the cinema happier. The new actors did a wonderful job and they all integrated with each other nicely. I don't think I've laughed so much in a movie before, and there wasn't a cringe worthy moment in there. So much nostalgia with all the old actors, and I think the send off for one of our favorites was great.

What I miss from the prequels was the coruscent like cities (highly advanced technology, bustling with life); the political scenes with the Senate and Jedi Council; and the awesome lightsaber battles with highly skilled warriors. You can tell they're going for the original trilogy style.

[Dergonu]

This movie is really solid, I don't think I've come out of the cinema happier. The new actors did a wonderful job and they all integrated with each other nicely. I don't think I've laughed so much in a movie before, and there wasn't a cringe worthy moment in there. So much nostalgia with all the old actors, and I think the send off for one of our favorites was great.

What I miss from the prequels was the coruscent like cities (highly advanced technology, bustling with life); the political scenes with the Senate and Jedi Council; and the awesome lightsaber battles with highly skilled warriors. You can tell they're going for the original trilogy style.

Well we did see one of those cities for about 1.4 seconds before it was destroyed completely by the new death star sun weapon.

RIP senate meetings.

[kingdomcome]

Well we did see one of those cities for about 1.4 seconds before it was destroyed completely by the new death star sun weapon.

RIP senate meetings.

Funny you say that, because after the movie I remembered this scene and was so disappointed. I was thinking that they just destroyed my chance of ever seeing a prequel like movie (without the bad bits). I assume there are other planets like this, because they did destroy a few of them in just that region.

[ittaku]

Thanks for your thought out response. I wasn't after explanations by the way so you missed the point of my post. I was trying to point out that things were too convenient and even for a fantasy/sci flic I was unable to suspend disbelief enough for those convenient plot devices to be convincing.

[Dergonu]

Thanks for your thought out response. I wasn't after explanations by the way so you missed the point of my post. I was trying to point out that things were too convenient and even for a fantasy/sci flic I was unable to suspend disbelief enough for those convenient plot devices to be convincing.

No I didn't miss the point, but I kinda worded the last part poorly.

What I meant was, some of your concerns were indeed explained in the movie and I wanted to tell you those parts, so maybe you would end up with a little bit of a better view of the movie.

There are still two pretty big flaws that I totally agree with, but a lot of the smaller stuff at least, I think is actually not as bad as you made it out to be.

Opinions will always be a subjective thing and there is nothing wrong with that. I take no offense to other people's opinions, and I don't mean to say that the movie was flawless, but just wanted to point out the parts in the writing that weren't actually as bad as you said they were.

 

[SilverLi]

AS Nosebleed said, this was a rip off of Episode 4. Seriously everything from the plot to the details and situations were almost copied directly from episode 4. Well I don't complain because the movie was really good and solid. But I guess we get an "Episode" 5 and 6 too as 8 and 9. 

And Kylo Ren wasn't the right villain. You can't have a villain with a baby face. And that lightsaber is just a waste. But overall a good movie. I am a person who is disturbed by the small things like how Finn could just use the lightsaber to some degree versus someone knowledgeable in the force... 

[Diamon]

Though I do agree with most people here that Kylo Ren is not a very convincing villain, it's still worth to note that before fighting against Finn and Rey, he got injured quite severly at the arm by chewie weapon (which could litterally send stormtroopers flying), and despite being a (apprentice) sith, he is still human, and that combined with blood loss would definitely make him weaker. Also, I think Ren was still quite disturbed by killing his own father, being so emotionally unstable I find it relevant that he has a lot of issues using the force during his fight (whether it is to fight in fluid motions like he should be doing, or even when trying to use the force to grab the lightsaber and losing to rey).

Don't really have any excuse for the fact that Rey is OP as fuck though. It just makes so little sense compared to Luke's progression.

[ホアー ビち]

movie was rly good, but ridley's acting was pretty lacking imo. finn would have made a better protag...

[Scorp]

Why that Kylo Ren had the mask, anyway? I did not get it. Also his nose... And rabbit ears... Who had such a nose and ear? Han or Leia? Seems no one had.

And yes, story is too much similar to Episode IV. It was in 1977 and was better.

The worst is the actors here. The only one main character who really acted was guess who? Harrison Ford. What the hell, man. Why grand-dad have to bring whole film on his shoulders, what the rest of the cast were doing? Rei is the new Luke? Really? With same dumbface she had whole film. Same for that stormtrooper. Only other guy I enjoyed watching was the Death Star commander or whoever he was, that stubborn red-haired guy. This one could act, especially comparing to that emokid Vader replacement.

[ホアー ビち]

 

The worst is the actors here. The only one main character who really acted was guess who? Harrison Ford. What the hell, man. Why grand-dad have to bring whole film on his shoulders, what the rest of the cast were doing? Rei is the new Luke? Really? With same dumbface she had whole film. Same for that stormtrooper. Only other guy I enjoyed watching was the Death Star commander or whoever he was, that stubborn red-haired guy. This one could act, especially comparing to that emokid Vader replacement.

Agreed, Harrison Ford was the only one who did a good job. But while Boyega wasnt good, he was certainly a lot better than Ridley. (I dont know who was so dumb to give her  that prize)

[TexasDice]

So, the guy who hates Star Wars finally drops his words of superior wisdom.

I like this movie. I don't love it, but it was a lot fun, even after a month of letting things sink in and listening to other people's opinions. It was a surprisingly good Star Wars movie. In fact, I like it more than Return of the Jedi, because all of our characters had things to do and didn't just sit around in a forest like assholes, while the real plot happens somewhere else.

The things I disliked also boil down to how much of a New Hope clone this movie is. I was fine with the map and even having a lot of nostalgic wink-wink moments (Mos Eisley shot, the chess board, etc) but the Deathstar was a little too much. I wish they would've subverted them blowing it up, by keeping it around for the next movie(s). Another thing concerns things that aren't really clear to me. The fallen Empire is now called The First Order and the Rebels are now called the Resistance.

So, who's in charge of the galaxy? That point kind of got lost to me. If the Rebels won against the Empire, wouldn't the Resistance just be the army? 

What I did like, was the fact that destroying the deathstar wasn't the main focus of the climax, because that's what the fight in the woods was. I liked that confrontation a lot, because it didn't involve stupid jumping and swirling around and was at the base just Finn and Rey brutishly smashing the lightsaber forward.

 

In terms of characters, I only partially agree with the consens about Rey. I mean, her defeating Kylo Ren in the first fight isn't much of a stretch from some desert guy blowing up a Deathstar on his first space flight. But sure, she is a little mary sue'ish. Not enough to bother me personally, but I can understand where those people are coming from.

I completely disagree about Kylo Ren, he was amazing. Having the first movie establish the antogonist was a great choice and I might even like that over the Darth Vader from a New Hope (who was actually just an asshole in a suit. Darth Vader wasn't a real character until Empire Strikes Back).

Kylo Ren is snotty, rebellious Kid. He wants to be a cool bad guy, with an imtimidating mask, but in reality, he's just a cowardly wimp throwing temper tantrums. Kylo Ren works in a way, in which the rebellious brat from the prequels didn't work. This character existing is a great setup by itself, because there are so many directions they can take him in. What I particulary like about him, is that the “Han, I'm your son!” wasn't a BIG SECRET OMG REVEAL, it was just an information told throughout the movie. There was no need to create suspense because there was none to begin with and the writers recognized that.

Finn and Poe Dameron were working parts. I have no problem with either character and wished the latter would've been around for more of the movie. I really like both of them and Finn helped a lot to shade light onto the Storm Troopers by showing us they're not clones.

What surprised me the most, was that Harrison Ford and Carrie Fisher were both good. I expected the worst case scenario, in which the new characters only have minor roles while we have to look at these fossils goof around for nostalgia. Part time, if you will.

But no, presenting Han Solo as some kind of crazy old man who's still doing his smuggler thing was great and really fit the character. This might've been the first time in 30 years, that Harrison Ford gave a fuck about acting and I loved it. Fantastic death scene and a great way of handing the torch down to the new characters. 

Carrie Fisher managed to convince me that she's still a real human. Which is a suprising feat, considering how fucked up she is in real life. 

 

Overall, I like the new characters, which is one of the things this movie had to do. The old characters had to give up the spotlight and we had to like the new characters. Back when the Phantom Menace tanked in critic ratings, people were saying “Oh well, but the next one will be better”. But smart people knew at the time, that all of the Episode 1 characters are shit and there was no base to improve from.

Basically, The Farce Awakens had to accomplish two things: Make the people like Star Wars again and establish what the new Star Wars is. In order to that, the people behind the movie had to deal with these checkpoints:

• Draw in a crowd with nostalgia and hype

• Make the old characters hand it over to the new ones

• Make us like or atleast care for the new characters

• Bring Star Wars back to what it was and exclude the prequels

Before this movie came out, I said that they wouldn't do anything from the prequels. There would be no Coruscant, no 80s diner with a fat CGI piece of shit plot device, no midichlorians, no 4 year old children blindly swinging lightsabers in a room full with other children, no boring political talk scenes about nothing, no villains with fancy lightsabers that were completely devoid of any personality, no forced romance involving hectoliters of sand NONE OF THAT CRAP. Not a single one of those "George Lucas ideas" would make it into the film.

That's what I expected, but my expectations were actually pushed beyong belief. First, a character explained that the Force is magic and not some bullshit lifeforms inside your body and next, the blew up Coruscant. I almost laughed out loud when the Deathstar blew up Coruscant.

And no, I don't care what J. J. and Disney say about that being some other planet because of contract issues. In our hearts, it was Coruscant.

 

Since I am cynical though, I am worried about the next two movies. I was okay with the nostalgia in this movie, despite the deathstar annoying me, since they had to make this the fanservice movie. Now, we can move on and drop all of that stuff. We have new characters, let them go on their own adventures.

But something tells me, that they're going to overload the next movie with references and totally Into Darkness it for no reason.

 

Final words: I like this movie. And yes, I'm glad the Expanded Universe died and I hope it burns in hell. And fuck the prequels. Fucking crappy ass piece of shit movies.

[CeruleanGamer]

Star Wars VIII is now in production! It's happening!

 

 

[Nosebleed]

Pretty exciting, although I am worried by the fact that the new trilogy will be made with only 2 years separating each entry (versus the previous 3 years), which could make for a rushed job.
Although I guess you could attribute it to more modern technology too.

It will be a long wait until 2017, and then another long one until 2019.
And what will make me OCD is that it will end on Star Wars IX instead of a beautiful, round X.

 

[DarkZedge]

56 minutes ago, Nosebleed said:

Pretty exciting, although I am worried by the fact that the new trilogy will be made with only 2 years separating each entry (versus the previous 3 years), which could make for a rushed job.
Although I guess you could attribute it to more modern technology too.

It will be a long wait until 2017, and then another long one until 2019.
And what will make me OCD is that it will end on Star Wars IX instead of a beautiful, round X.

 

It may seem rushed if we keep in mind the size and magnitude of these films but as you say a year give or take might be able to be reduced from the production time if you take into consideration all the new techniques and advantages of new software and cameras and all that.

haha, i feel sorry for your OCD though