Sovapex

Okay, so I get you're saying that it's the worst 'Tales Of' game of all time, which is like saying dog turds are the worst type of turds of all time IMO, so you're not technically saying it's a bad game. Regardless, some of the stuff you say don't make any sense. First off, I want to point out that your use of the word 'edgy' just muddies your argument and kind of infuriates me. It's a meaningless buzzword with negative connotations that clearly color the things you're saying in a negative light. It seems way more suited to the supposed grimdark young audience you seem to reject. Plus, you seem to use it as if it's supposed to fill holes in your argument by it's negative connotations alone. You seem to fundamentally misunderstand, or refuse to acknowledge, that Velvet at the beginning of the game (I'm talking about Prison onwards) is not supposed to be likable at all. She does, indeed, place revenge as her highest priority and is willing to let loose chaos in order to make that happen. It's a scummy thing to do. That being said, her lust for revenge makes perfect sense, and I'm not sure why you don't acknowledge that. Yeah, Laphifelt fine with suiciding in order to save people. It's a logical leap to assume Velvet shouldn't be furious with him and Artorius for doing that shiz, though. You don't just sit around and sip on your starbucks coffee whilst your little brother ties a noose around the rafters. Are you really saying it doesn't make sense that Velvet is angry that this happened? I mean, I'm sorry dude, that's stupid. As far as she's concerned, Artorius killed Laphi, and whilst there's nuance to that, taking something as irreplaceable as a loved one from your life and then sitting down and having a cool discussion about it is not something a lot of people can do. Laphi v.2's existence, in large part, seems to revolve around appealing to Velvet's moral side. He is who you should be rooting for to bring Velvet back to her senses. Of course, if you've already written her off for reasons as nonsensical as the ones you listed, then his character probably won't be effective at all. You seem to really want to push this idea that the game is just catering to 'Edgy' audiences, and therefore the writing is 'Edgy', and the philosophy is 'edgy' and therefore the entire game is 'edgy' and is a bad tales game because, you know, 'edge'. And this thing you talk about, this Baba and his philosophy? I've played Tales games since Symphonia, and the philosophy is always pretentious and lame. I dropped Zestiria, so maybe it did that better, but that game was trash in and of itself. All my opinion, of course.

I was referring to Narco's idea of morality, not his idea of the VN, so there's miscommunication there. Okay, well, I don't recognize your idea that I'm defending Funnerific. I objected to your demeanor and your logical fallacy, though I do admit I felt as if there was no need to come at him the way you did.

Lol, an hour to type a comment? Sounds like a whole different issue. But I shouldn't resort to ad-hom, that's clearly your territory. Your claim that the dude in question is nitpicking is just that - a claim, and your refusal to use argumentation and to instead post sly jabs doesn't paint you in a very enviable light, or a mature one. Nobody claimed that. Leave your strawmen at home. Are you kidding me? Your values are not the objective standard, in fact there are none. But this? This is extreme. You cannot call the police to deal with every situation you find yourself in. And if you really think if you defend yourself in a situation you're thrust into lightning fast and in the struggle your aggressor dies that your actions were unjustified and guilty, then I have to say that I find your values nonsensical. It's even more mindnumbing that you think to act shocked that anyone would have a different opinion with you on a matter that you are clearly extreme on. And why you're going on about wars and stuff I've no idea, that's not even close to being relevant and it's clear you're trying to paint your rhetoric to be more important than it actually is. Impressive nerve, though.

I didn't like it. I thought it was super generic in comparison with the first game. That being said, I dropped it right after the Chuuni kicked off, so maybe that's unfair? I dunno.

Man, sometimes Rance 6 makes me frustrated. Mostly because Japan is more ready to have games be hard and force you to look up a walkthrough. But there ain't no English walkthrough for Rance 6. How was I supposed to know you could run from that one boss fight? Rance is definitely grindy, though. Even if you don't go after all the conversations (and who wouldn't, by the way? Narrative is a big thing in this addition), you'll still need orbs for special moves, story, FR and character upgrades. The grind doesn't bother me all that much, though. Sengoku Rance is still far and away better, but that's not saying much since Sengoku Rance is just... so so good.

Wow. In class? I don't even know what to say about that. Art is in the eye of the beholder, and it's real cute you feel that way to the point of being shameless about it, but you should probably keep your head in reality next time.

Oh, the worst game in the series that nobody dares play? Fair 'nuff. I'm not asking for them to be together or whatever, I'm asking for a conclusion, and there almost never is. Like, if the game cut off right after the Final Boss without concluding the plot, you'd almost undoubtedly complain, so I don't see how you defend incomplete sub-plots. That's crap writing. Yes, because take away sub-plot related scenes arbitrarily, and you might just have an incomplete subplot! Who'd have thought. Tidus and Yuna develop nicely alongside eachother and compliment eachothers weaknesses. That's why people regard it as the best romance in video games, although yeah, they're wrong about that (see Max Payne 2). There are many examples of this happening throughout the game, HAHAHA scene included, for what it's worth.

Man, I really cannot get on the same wavelength as you. I kind of get what you're saying to an extent, you're saying some people will like certain writing styles less than others, but your examples don't jive. Like, you seem to suggest that 'vague descriptions' can have the same amount of quality as 'solid descriptions'. How? If you can't even decipher what something means easily, it messes with the reader's pace. Keep that up, and it will put them off. Sounds fundamentally bad to me. Decent writing doesn't confuse you. Good writing is smart, it can make you think without breaking you out of your pace, and entertain you. I don't see why someone would rate a writing style worse because it does something different whilst still retaining good quality.

Character development hinges on both writing and plot. Without plot there's no development, but without decent writing, the presentation of that development is almost fated to be bad. Development is one of the hardest things to realistically pull off. You can't kill a person's dog and then have them wake up the next day to be fully independent - it's a long, hard grueling process. I've seen characters pretty much spontaneously defeat their inner demons because people simply told them to before. Plus, content of the dialogue and how the dialogue is presented. Isn't that pretty much exactly the same thing?

Using words artistically is not the be all and end all of writing. Shakespeare didn't just write amazing dialogue, he wrote amazing characters and scenes, too. There are a lot of issues that can get in the way of a good plot if the writer is incompetent.

Your post is great. In simple terms, writing is the presentation of pretty much everything in the narrative. As someone who writes, understanding this was absolutely fundamental in improving myself. Good writing and a good plot will pretty much always make for a great experience. But if it's a question between one or the other... I guess I can't fault many people who go for plot, but I'll never understand it. Writing simply controls too many factors for me to favor plot over it. There's nothing that puts me off more than a boulder of information being force fed to you, bringing the plot to a halt, because the writer was too incompetent to weave his exposition into the narrative.

Problem I have with that statement is that writing does not need to save a dull plot, because plots are not always the most important thing in a Visual Novel. If the dialogue is Shakespearean, then that alone would be more than enough reason for anyone who gives a damn about that to stick with it. Same if the themes were well presented, same if the characters were well presented, same if certain scenes (like H or fight scenes) were well presented. That's what writing essentially is - Presentation. Good writing can't make a bad plot better, but it can make a visual novel better. No?

How? Working Designs is an amazing Publisher. I've went hunting for games published by them ever since Arc the Lad 2, which I expect probably has better dialogue than even the original Arc the Lad 2 in Japan. But I wouldn't know that. So, either you're one of the purist detractors, or they messed up. I'm guessing the former, though, given my past run in with you.

You played ALL THREE Agarest games? The patience on you must be godly. To be honest, though, practically all JRPGs have some romance that drags out for the entire game inserted into them. If you just want any type of romance regardless of it's quality you could pretty much just bring up a list of RPGs and throw your cursor any to find one. Tales is not a good idea if you want romance, because I can't think of a single one where characters actually end up together. You have like 40, even sometimes 60+ hours of travelling together, getting flags, speaking past eachother with innuendo, and they still don't even hold hands by the end. Granted, sometimes they can't help it because the MC's head got devoured by Cthulhu, but hey. I can say that for Vesperia, Abyss, Graces, Symphonia and Xillia 1+2 are not games you want to play if you want romance. Jesus, that JudeXMillia nonsense was still going on in Xillia 2 with no conclusion in sight. Why even bother? Tales is still a good franchise though. Xillia 2 is my personal favorite as I believe the characters developed wonderfully and they have the balls to do things that will hit you right in the feels. Emulators: Persona 3 and 4 are pretty good for romance, mostly because it stays out of the way of the story and it is not forced on you. 3 is probably a bit better for it, as it fits in with the ending more, but 4 is good as well. They do all act like they're keeping it secret from people, though. Xenogears has a great romance that is both integral to the plot, is fully realized and is treated maturely. Helps that Xenogears has a stellar storyline, possibly one of the best in JRPG history. Gameplay is whack, tho. Final Fantasy X has romance, but it's got a bittersweet ending. Growlanser is an underrated gem. I would avoid Growlanser 2, but 3 and 4 are more than worth your time if you ask me, with 4 being out and out the best we have available to us (JP releases may be better, who knows). Though you'll probably stay for the gameplay alone. Bear in mind that relationships are things you work on throughout the game with Growlanser. There is no canon love interest that will trot at your heels with stars in their eyes whenever they're out of your sight. Dragons Dogma! Though I don't know if you'll accept it as a JRPG considering Capcom often releases games targeted at the West. Sakura Wars 5 is the only Sakura Wars that has been localized to the west and it's stellar. It's very, IDK, Power Rangery and the MC is so lawful good it hurts, but the game's polish, dialogue and overall game design is brilliant. And, yes, the Romance in it is fantastic. And it has a legitimate black woman as one of the MCs. Never thought to see that from Japan. 'tis set in America tho, so, hey. Ar Tonelico has a ton of it. I dislike the story and the gameplay, though, so I can't say much about it. Odin Sphere? It's heavily Action and the RPG elements are quite western. Romance plastered all over it though. PC: Kamidori Alchemy Meister: This is one of the only ones I can even think of for PC. Final Fantasy X is also on PC. Just putting that out there. That's about all from me.

If I was to choose one, it would without a doubt be Muramasa. Then it would be everything else by Nitroplus.

Glad I could entertain you. Nope. Sorry. Maybe this is a personal peeve of mine, but I do not like socially awkward behavior at all, and that turned that awkward meter way past 10. I'd have quit school just being in the same classroom.

Goddamn, boy. He jerked off on a comatose fourteen year old. That's,uh, heavy. I think you're right. I might be able to appreciate his development or whatever, but that voice alone is probably enough to shave years off my life if I had to sit through it. And, I gotta say, self-examining myself, you're probably right. I could not stand Muv Luv Alternative in huge part thanks to Shirogane, but I'm not sure if the same would apply to Evangelion. Can't say for certain. Probably would, though.

Lol, Shinji? I heard some stuff about him. Like he's an ultimate coward and some weird sexual stuff that I can't remember. I'll stay away from that anime based on that alone.

Heh, I ain't so good at taking compliments. Thanks, glad you liked it. (too douchey? Probably) I can see most of them except number 1. I've never come across a character that has grated on my nerves half as much as Shirogane. Perhaps with the exception of But number 3 is definitely a prominent problem I see all over the place in serious VNs.

Apology accepted. I'd love to see the rationality of someone who'd think Steins:gate sucks, though. I mean, why can't we both? Are you really so set in this mindset that Steins:Gate and perhaps even Alternative are so good that they do not have glaring flaws others can point out? It doesn't detract from your love and experience in the end. This part of the human psyche boggles my mind to no end.

I smell the slight tinge of butthurt. Shame, because I'm really not looking to make anybody upset at all, but clearly some people just hate it when they don't share the same opinion. Troll? Sounds like a weak dismissal tactic to me. If I'm trolling, surely you can prove it via argumentation rather than lame evasion games and logical fallacies, no? Is that it? Is that your argument? "Characters are good because I said so, so you're wrong". Awesome argument, friend. And you actually call me a troll? Sounds like you're trying to bait me, if anything. But, okay, friend. You stay in your echo chamber, because obviously you can't handle dissenting opinions, and that isn't some sly attack neither.

I mean, that's a BS figure, considering you haven't played 100% of VN novels, but whatever.

So why are they sexually stimulating humans, then..? Meaning this is badly written, which is exactly my point all along. Why even argue with me if that's the conclusion you inevitably come to as well?

Bait? Give me a break, dude. Say what you like about me, but please don't pretend I'm not being the least bit rational with my criticism. This defense of Takeru's emotional situation is all well and good, but it doesn't change the fact that his character is annoying and trite. Is the only way to express that you're stressed, scared, traumatized etc to scream out in your head, and even sometimes out loud? The answer's no, but that's what the writers did because, to be honest, they're quite incompetent. All you're really doing is explaining why he's an incredibly annoying little cretin, as if I didn't already know that. None of what you mentioned has anything to do with the plot not being bad. You're literally just saying it has themes. That's irrelevant. As for the characters, I mean, they sucked. They had no depth, originality, nor did they have anything compelling about them. None of them, NONE, had any development apart from Shirogane. But that doesn't matter neither. Because at every turn he seeks to degrade himself because he suffers from Protagonist syndrome. What death of a friend didn't bother the main cast? At least one of them always had some type of reaction. Not sure what you're referring to, but if you're talking about nameless NPCs, then of course they have no reaction. That being said, every death that affected one of the main cast did not last long. It didn't do much in the way of affect them. Remember Amane's boyfriend? He kinda just appeared, didn't even speak to Amane, got killed and she forgot about it. That's what I'm talking about when I say the deaths are completely meaningless. Again, you're ignoring my main argument and you're explaining the context of the scenes like I didn't sit through it myself. Not to mention your strange tangent, like you're trying to compare this to some ulterior theme to deepen the scene, even though there's nothing concrete connecting this fictional scene of tentacle rape to real life. There's nothing to respond to in your reply because it's completely irrelevant. The beta rape scene made no sense, and it was there purely for shock value. They raped Sumika as an artificial way of shocking you and making you feel sorry for her. Again, why did they do all of that to Sumika, but not to Takeru? Objectively speaking, was Takeru not as good as a subject as Sumika? " They wished to understand the creatures and what made them feel." And this desire came absolutely out of nowhere. I mean, previously, they couldn't give a damn less. But this time, randomly, they felt like they wanted to pleasure one of them to see how they tick. Makes a ton of sense. Lol, are you really saying that characters went off and developed in the background whilst Takeru was busy doing something else? What kind of talk is that, man? Made me giggle though, I won't deny.

I know that too. No, Takeru was killed pretty much instantly. As for Male Brains not being able to be extracted, that's just a baseless theory. The reason is shock value. I'm sorry, but it is what it is.